The Divine Anthropologist

Elok · November 3, 2003, 18:19

Knew a girl. Cute, smart, friendly, honest, said she was a definite agnostic, but "very interested in religion as a subject." I figured, okay, she's not a believer but at least she's open-minded. Might as well get to know her, she might be single some day.

I'm beginning to think I thought wrong. I'm pretty sure I've fallen for a Divine Anthropologist, a woman who studies religion for the same reason many scientists study chimps, or violent warring tribes in the middle of nowhere. My kind are an amusing, primitive, backwards sort of parody of real people, and it entertains her to look at us and speculate on the many subtle differences that make us the clear inferiors that we are.

WHY DO PEOPLE DO THAT? I don't think it's self-esteem. What is it that makes otherwise nice people look down their noses and laugh for a passing diversion? If I am wrong, how does that make atheists happy? Why do people act like condescending ****** under any circumstances in the first place?

In conclusion: I have wasted several weeks of my life in a moonstruck daze. Argh.

DinoDoc · November 3, 2003, 18:22

That sucks man.

Immortal Wombat · November 3, 2003, 18:41

Quote:

Originally posted by Elok
WHY DO PEOPLE DO THAT? I don't think it's self-esteem. What is it that makes otherwise nice people look down their noses and laugh for a passing diversion? If I am wrong, how does that make atheists happy? Why do people act like condescending ****** under any circumstances in the first place?

Because people - no offense, almost all people - are either vaguely interesting, or incredibly amusing. Whether it's 20 minutes on a bus, or a couple of weeks of conversation, most people aren't worth knowing, but are unique enough and intriguing enough for a while. Of course, this attitude combined with being a hot chick is just a pain in the arse for everyone, but as I'd most likely be single anyway, why not be philosophical about it?

MrFun · November 3, 2003, 19:38

Quote:

Originally posted by Elok
Knew a girl. Cute, smart, friendly, honest, said she was a definite agnostic, but "very interested in religion as a subject." I figured, okay, she's not a believer but at least she's open-minded. Might as well get to know her, she might be single some day.

I'm beginning to think I thought wrong. I'm pretty sure I've fallen for a Divine Anthropologist, a woman who studies religion for the same reason many scientists study chimps, or violent warring tribes in the middle of nowhere. My kind are an amusing, primitive, backwards sort of parody of real people, and it entertains her to look at us and speculate on the many subtle differences that make us the clear inferiors that we are.

WHY DO PEOPLE DO THAT? I don't think it's self-esteem. What is it that makes otherwise nice people look down their noses and laugh for a passing diversion? If I am wrong, how does that make atheists happy? Why do people act like condescending ****** under any circumstances in the first place?

In conclusion: I have wasted several weeks of my life in a moonstruck daze. Argh.

You know what -- I wager that the way you felt when she treated you in this patronizing way, is similar to how me and many other non-heterosexuals feel when some other religious people patronize us as "lost sheep."

Japher · November 3, 2003, 19:43

MrFun; I don't patronize you and tag you a "lost-sheep" because your GAY

Elok; Boot to the curb... She's a beitch and you just can't accept it because she's hot.

Use her and lose her...

Jon Miller · November 3, 2003, 19:45

everyone is interesting and valuable if you take thetaime to get to know them

I only regret that I don't have the time to get to know everyone

Jon Miller

Kuciwalker · November 3, 2003, 19:53

That sucks...

Bereta_Eder · November 3, 2003, 20:11

You don't know Elok. You could still "convert" her!

Berzerker · November 3, 2003, 21:48

Quote:

I figured, okay, she's not a believer but at least she's open-minded. Might as well get to know her, she might be single some day.

Now there's a man of god for ya, in search of the divine vagina.

Elok, you're making an assumption about her. If there is any knock on anthropologists, it's their unwillingness to make (vocally anyway) judgements about the cultures they study. Also, you went from claiming she is agnostic to indicting atheists. If she's agnostic, she doen't know if God exists... What more can you ask of a person if you don't have actual proof to convince them otherwise?

Bosh · November 3, 2003, 22:47

Bah. Studying you irrational religious types is a lot of fun, even better than warring chimps

A good chunk of my bookshelf is Taoist or Sufi philosophy ATM and my favorite course in college was on historical theories of religion. I guess there's a range in the amount of respect us "divine anthropologist" types have for religion but then some religions are more worthy of respect than others...

Lincoln · November 3, 2003, 23:33

It is difficult to reach anyone who thinks that they know everything. Humility is a lost virtue. Maybe someday she will be in some type of trouble and she will call out to God for help. Then you can study her...

MrFun · November 4, 2003, 00:12

You mean like how some religious people presume to know everything about homosexaulity??

Yeah, I know what you mean.

Sikander · November 4, 2003, 00:32

She's either a complete *****, and you should be rid of her asap, or there's more to it. If there is more to it, perhaps you can explore that a bit by asking her why she seems to be so cruel or at best clinical. She may be interested in you or interested in your religious views or both, but afraid to admit it because like many here on OT she is loathe to admit that she doesn't have all the answers (or far more readily to admit that religion may have a few itself), and perhaps embarrassed to be hanging around with a religious person discussing religion. In other words the clinical study she's been doing of you might be a dodge for other feelings either personal or religious. If this is the case you may be judging her too harshly, perhaps because you yourself are a bit sensitive about these issues. Bottom line, if you are still curious about her talk to her. If she doesn't seem to be willing to be honest and really communicate, dump her. That's a deal breaker regardless.

Capt Dizle · November 4, 2003, 00:44

Elok,

Frankly, absent the presence of the Holy Spirit, the religious do appear to be the equivalent of some sort of maladjusted lunatic lost tribe of savages.

So, pray for her, that God might reach out and touch her.

Elok · November 4, 2003, 09:01

I get the feeling that the situation is made out to be less complex than I think it is. I'm thinking of something like a blind spot, and as always I'm essentially talking out of me rear. These are, after all, only sullen suspicions; I've never been in her head.

BTW Sikander, that's pretty much the conclusion I came to myself. Like I said, she's spoken for, so it's a matter of indulging my own curiosity more than anything else.

She categorizes herself as an agnostic/atheist, Berz. I usually distinguish the two terms as the difference between somebody who says there is no God and means it on a philosophical level, and somebody who believes it with the kind of fervor usually reserved for more positive ideals. The dictionary definition isn't terribly significant in the grand scheme of things, so I use words like Humpty Dumpty in Through the Looking Glass. Now I'm making literary allusions. Man, I must be in a weird way.

Anyway, I just had to vomit some angst. Thanks to all who were there to catch it.

Rogan Josh · November 4, 2003, 09:10

Quote:

Originally posted by MrFun
You mean like how some religious people presume to know everything about homosexaulity??

What's to know??

You like to **** other men and that's it. Surely you don't claim that your sexual tastes define who you are as a person? (That would be rather sad.)

I don't like strawberry icecream - I prefer vanilla, but I don't go around shouting about it.

Arrian · November 4, 2003, 10:54

Quote:

I'm beginning to think I thought wrong. I'm pretty sure I've fallen for a Divine Anthropologist, a woman who studies religion for the same reason many scientists study chimps, or violent warring tribes in the middle of nowhere. My kind are an amusing, primitive, backwards sort of parody of real people, and it entertains her to look at us and speculate on the many subtle differences that make us the clear inferiors that we are.

I'd be interested in her conclusions.

Just kidding.

Sort of.

-Arrian

DinoDoc · November 4, 2003, 12:24

Quote:

Originally posted by Elok
Anyway, I just had to vomit some angst. Thanks to all who were there to catch it.

That's gross.

MrFun · November 4, 2003, 12:57

dp

MrFun · November 4, 2003, 12:57

Quote:

Originally posted by Rogan Josh

What's to know??

You like to **** other men and that's it. Surely you don't claim that your sexual tastes define who you are as a person? (That would be rather sad.)

I don't like strawberry icecream - I prefer vanilla, but I don't go around shouting about it.

Well I also know that you're playing stupid right now -- I meant that religious people presume to know how sexual orientation develops -- that they presume it's a choice.

At least I'm willing to admit that I do not know for certain how I have become gay -- the only thing that I know, is that my sexual orientation is not a choice.

Japher · November 4, 2003, 13:02

Religious ppl presume to know everything MrFun... Some KNOW that I am going to Hell because I don't believe in Jesus, others say I am going there because I am a total arse

They all KNOW how the world began and man came into existence...

All I tell them is that they also once KNEW that earth is the center of the universe and that they were wrong there!

All religion is a bunch of poorly thoughtout guesses, don't take them seriously if they bash you, just stay away from them and forgive them since they can't forgive you...

Rogan Josh · November 4, 2003, 13:11

Atheist ppl presume to know everything Japher... They KNOW that there is no hell to go to.

They all KNOW how the universe began and man came into existence...

All I tell them is that they also once KNEW that the universe follows determanistic laws and that they were wrong there!

Atheism is a bunch of poorly thoughtout guesses, don't take them seriously if they bash you, just stay away from them and forgive them since they can't forgive you...

Rogan Josh · November 4, 2003, 13:19

Quote:

Originally posted by MrFun
Well I also know that you're playing stupid right now -- I meant that religious people presume to know how sexual orientation develops -- that they presume it's a choice.

Do you think that is really true? Do you think they think that it is the desire or the act which is important? I would have thought it was the act, and you can choose not to have gay sex. These people would say that it is the devil who is tempting you (so your desire is not your fault) and you must resist him. In fact, there are many Christians who disapprove of the new gay bishop not because he is gay, but because he is unashamedly 'practicing'.

Japher · November 4, 2003, 13:26

Quote:

Atheism is a bunch of poorly thoughtout guesses, don't take them seriously if they bash you, just stay away from them and forgive them since they can't forgive you...

I agree

MrFun · November 4, 2003, 16:19

Quote:

Originally posted by Rogan Josh

Do you think that is really true? Do you think they think that it is the desire or the act which is important? I would have thought it was the act, and you can choose not to have gay sex. These people would say that it is the devil who is tempting you (so your desire is not your fault) and you must resist him. In fact, there are many Christians who disapprove of the new gay bishop not because he is gay, but because he is unashamedly 'practicing'.

So non-heterosexuals should neglect their own self-esteem and sense of worth by denying part of who they are??

No wonder so many non-heterosexuals have so much negative stress in this society.

DinoDoc · November 4, 2003, 16:22

Mr Fun

Issues has an issue and she wants it to be everyone's issue. The discussion could be about fondue pots and Issue would rage about the multinational corporate conspiracy to exploit fondue pot workers. Of course, Issues is found among all ideological persuasions - anti-gun mothers, gun totin' mothers, bloodthirsty feminists, troglodyte misogynists, politically correct, politically incorrect, lefties, righties, vegetarians, carnivores, radical Rotarians - it doesn't matter. HINT: An effective tactic to employ against Issues is indifference.

Lorizael · November 4, 2003, 16:28

Quote:

Originally posted by Rogan Josh
All I tell them is that they also once KNEW that the universe follows determanistic laws and that they were wrong there!

Really, it was only those that didn't believe in God that held to deterministic views? And obviously it could have only been Christians that discovered Quantum Mechanics... right?

Lorizael · November 4, 2003, 17:07

Oh yes, that's right. And I also seem to recall a scientist of some note - smart fellow, came up with something to do with light and things not being constant - who said something along the lines of "God does not play dice."

Oh that's right, it was Einstein, one of the most brilliant and religious scientists of our time.

Ben Kenobi · November 4, 2003, 18:01

Quote:

because he is unashamedly 'practicing'.

Well said Rogan. That's precisely why I'm against this bishop. Would you slag a Catholic priest for practicing pedophilia, and not an actively homosexual Episcopalian bishop?

Anyway, back on-topic I think you are being a little harsh, elok. Did she openly say she thought religious people were inferior?

If she's spoken for, it still does not mean you can't evangelise. Ask her if she considers you stupid.

Elok · November 4, 2003, 19:00

Er, sorry if I'm misreading you, Lorizael, but you do realize that Einstein said that as an argument AGAINST the verity of quantum mechanics, right? I can't tell how many layers of sarcasm you're using there.

Well, Ben, thing is, the girl is of course not rude enough to say flat-out that people who believe are fools. I don't even think she thinks of it that way in so many words. I just get the feeling that she has this basic unquestioned assumption at heart to the effect that my ideas are intrinsically ridiculous.

The primatologist never says, or maybe even consciously thinks, that the chimps he takes notes on are like inferior variants on himself, but the awareness is there at heart, a vague, shadowy concept never probed or questioned any more than the idea that birds need wings to fly. It's the kind of thing you can't really argue against. Haven't you seen it before?