What faction would you join in? - Page 3

Hydro · December 8, 2003, 19:41

University: being a member of the ‘socially advanced’ and ‘ethically liberated’ University society is great, until one of their researchers declares you redundant and comes after you with a uniquely (and horrifically) designed anal probe

Believers: “Let he who is without sin cast the first stone”; “Judge not, lest you be judged”; “God, in his infinite mercy and wisdom…” – Miriam doesn’t believe in any of these. ‘Nuff said.

Spartans: the world has tried military dictatorships many times and none of them have worked out very well, either for its own people or for their victims…er…neighbors

Gaians: while no one likes their rivers to burst spontaneously into flame, lakes to solidify, or have raw petroleum products seep into your basement, environmentalism run amok can be as stultifying and reactionary as any (other?) religious creed

Morganites: See above: rivers bursting into flame, solidifying lakes, nifty basement seeps. Not a fun place to live, unless you’re in the top 5 percent and can afford to move away from the eco horrors. I don’t believe for a minute that the drones would enjoy many benefits of this society, other than being subjected to endless marketing (or is that a good way to define h*ll?)

Hive: if you really want to live in a society of genejacks, slave labor, and thought control, then be my guest. I think of the end of Orwell’s 1984, which describes the State as stomping on the face of humanity, forever. **shudder**

Peacekeepers: Look at the UN, and magnify its bloated incompetence by several orders of magnitude. You can do anything you want, as long as you fill out form 5958-G-23GGS, in triplicate. Twice. To two agencies. And then they lose it, and you have to start all over again. Ack! Where’s my suicide pill….

So, pick your poison. I’d have to say that, given these choices, the Gaians are still my choice.

Hydro

Mr. President · December 9, 2003, 06:05

Frankly, none of the societies sound especially appealing. Especially when Hydro describes them in that way. Every single one has Drones, pathetically downtrodden underclasses whose only outlet is rioting. Every faction can nerve staple people, given the right social settings.

That said, I'd still run for the Morganic escape pod. I feel reasonably confident that my ability to type, my driving skills, and my undergraduate degree in physiology could get me at least into the top 10%.

Frankychan · December 10, 2003, 04:36

Wow, I haven't posted on this site in a loooooong time. Good to see these polls keep coming up.

Anyway, I voted the same way I voted last time.

HIVE ALL THE WAY!!!

(and for those of you who still remember me, yup...I'm still a loyal citizen of the Hive)

Blake · December 10, 2003, 06:15

Considering SMACX factions I would join the Data Angels without hesitation, the Data Angels embrace freedom on so many levels and at heart I'm a computer geek. That makes the DA my favourite faction, both in-game and out-game.
It would actually mean getting on the Morganite pod in order to later rebel against their capitalistic ways; this seems infinitely safer than rebelling against Yang or Miriam.

Shai-Hulud · December 10, 2003, 15:45

Hydro, liked you're faction descriptions

Judging by the poll it seems a lot of brave souls would push their luck with Miriam, Yang and Santiago. Over ten percent is a lot in this case.

I could have imagined Hive being the favored one of the aggressive factions. But I think everyone would choose differently if given second choice...which they never have

. Orwell quote described Hive perfectly.

sammy1339 · December 10, 2003, 19:08

Quote:

Originally posted by Hydro

Spartans: the world has tried military dictatorships many times and none of them have worked out very well, either for its own people or for their victims…er…neighbors

What makes you say the Spartan Federation is a military dictatorship? I think it is quite in-character for the Spartans to pick Democratic politics. Besides that, Santiago is only as aggressive as Zakharov and Lal. I think Firaxis had something like Sparta in mind when they designed the Spartans. Despite being armed to the teeth all the time, ancient Sparta was democratic (at least it always had a highly active parliamentary system) and not particularly aggressive - not nearly as aggressive as Athens.
Overall, Sparta is the best of the bad factions. It would be my fourth choice, above Morgan Industries, which might smell even worse than modern Athens.

SynthetGod8 · December 10, 2003, 23:33

It took me a while to wade through all those long replies about the University's lax ethics. When I really think about it, I doubt that the University just experiments on anyone they like. Maybe there are secret labs where POWs are used as guinea pigs, but would it not be easier to trade them to their home faction? I think that the University is less on being evil to people and more about helping them as soon as possible. It's about the relentless persuit of knowledge.
Say that you broke your back and were paralysed. No conventional treatment would work on you. Soi along comes a University doctor who says that he's got a breakthrough treatment that has, so far, worked on plenty of animals. The doc assures you that the procedure will work, even though it's still experimental. So maybe it doesn't work and your disfigured (or even dead). The University probably has a compensation program that pays you or your family money for the loss and damage. Hell, Drones need credits, don't they? They're probably encouraged to sign up for experimental procedures. I seriously doubt that you'll be 'drafted'. If anything, you'd still get paid. The thing that is unethical about the University is that they have a lower sense of acceptable risk. Sure, they want to be sure it'll be safe for humans, but their standards of 'safe' are lower. I doubt they'd give you something that would kill you (or at most 1% died), but it might give you burning hives or something. But hey, you'd get free meds for the hives (maybe even paid more if you take the new, experimental hives cream).
As for other things, maybe the University would push new forms or energy faster than is safe. So maybe a fusion reactor blows... sure to cause a drone riot, but it was an acceptable risk to them. So a new genetic virus gets out and kills all those in the Rec Comm; it's the price of advancement. The University just has a lower sense of what the acceptable risks are. "To make an omlet, you have to break some eggs." as the saying goes. I really think it's less people being forced into experiments than it is accidents occuring in the advancement of science. The scientists aren't cruel, maybe apathetic and detatched, but they don't want their patients to die.
Ever played Half-life? Were the scientists unethical? Maybe. They went ahead with the test knowing that there was a risk of a cascade something-or-other, but it was acceptable risk. So it goes wrong and the army's sent in to clean it up. I bet that happens kinda often in the University. So it's news of these accidents that pisses off the Drones.

Enigma_Nova · December 11, 2003, 03:16

Cascade Resonance.

And in HL, the unethical standpoint (I believe) can be shown in the intro to Opposing Force.
You see Scientists, operating on dead colleagues, and apparently having quite a good time doing it.

Not wanting to correlate Black Mesa to the UoP (Black Mesa is, after all, an American Secret Research Facility), but I do indeed see some links.

Sheesh just imagine trying to crowbar your way through a mindworm boil

Hydro · December 11, 2003, 09:57

A couple of comments:

University – ‘unethical’ is relative, and, yes, some ‘unethical’ advances can be used to help others. But, tell that to the Russians and Jews that a few German doctors experimented on in WW2. This was done in the name of science, of course, in the pursuit of various noble aims. Most people (I hope) find this sort of behavior to be repulsive. The point is that the blind pursuit of science can obscure other worthy goals, such as little things like basic human rights.

Spartans – while the Spartans could be a democracy it hardly fits with their +1 police advantage, which strongly suggests the do-it-my-way-or-else proclivities. Few military societies seem to work well under democracies, and ancient Sparta was no exception (I seem to recall they had a king; regardless, they were about as democratic as ancient Athens was since the vast majorities of both societies were slaves, landless and non-voting males, or non-voting females). I do not think it was an accident that the faction was named the Spartans.

Ogie Oglethorpe · December 11, 2003, 13:39

Actually anceint Sparta was anything but democratic. Were they to exist today they would widely bedescribed as authoritarian and dictatorial. They held to the beleif that they were the chosen ones and that they were a supereior race.

Their military code while being admirable from an efficacy point of viewwas unbeleivably harshwithan incredibly draconian regimin that led to high mortality rates. Their morals would in modern day be abhored with respect to marriage, slavery, military conduct etc.

They tended to completely ignore infrastructure in favor of military units and training. ( To my mind ancient Sparta more closely resembles a mix of Believer doctrine and Spartan doctrine). High levels of support, high police, high morale, fanatasicm, low research, low industry. Prolly low planet as well but pollution wasn't so much an issue as population levels and ancient industry wasn't burdening them.

Even though I like to play them as a faction count me out to live in such a society.

Mr. President · December 11, 2003, 20:21

Quote:

Originally posted by Frankychan

Frankychan lives!

Sarxis · December 11, 2003, 20:31

Hmm.. tough choice.

Morgan has all the niceties, but the Provost is bound to do some great stuff.

Voted the nerds because I'm feeling techy today.

Shai-Hulud · December 13, 2003, 09:37

Quote:

"To make an omlet, you have to break some eggs." as the saying goes

Your defence of University's ethics was a good one, but avoid quoting Lenin in defence of ethics

. That man was much more detached from ethics than University would probably be. However, University making democratic social choise(which fits them very well) would probably be an O.K. society to live in. I'm pro-research and all that but I think too focused one-mindedness towards research would actually lead to less open-minded and free society. And those characteristics are demanded for sustained development.

Frankychan · December 14, 2003, 21:57

Quote:

Originally posted by Crimson Sunrise

Frankychan lives!

Thanks! Check out the AC-Fiction forum for a longer "explanation"...

Andemagne · December 15, 2003, 17:40

Spartans all the way.

Mr. President · December 17, 2003, 20:36

Quote:

Originally posted by Shai-Hulud

Your defence of University's ethics was a good one, but avoid quoting Lenin in defence of ethics

. That man was much more detached from ethics than University would probably be. However, University making democratic social choise(which fits them very well) would probably be an O.K. society to live in. I'm pro-research and all that but I think too focused one-mindedness towards research would actually lead to less open-minded and free society. And those characteristics are demanded for sustained development.

Work as an intern at a government science facility for a couple of months. Then tell me what you think about your scientist colleagues' ability to run a country.