What is the best MBT?

connorkimbro · December 5, 2003, 00:41

Havn't seen this one in a while. LOL. Sorry, that I had to be the one to bring it back. Let the debate commence!

Urban Ranger · December 5, 2003, 00:44

No!!!

/me gets trigger happy

Lord Merciless · December 5, 2003, 01:05

M1A2.

Jon Miller · December 5, 2003, 01:07

T-34

JOn Miller

BeBro · December 5, 2003, 01:21

Quote:

Originally posted by connorkimbro
Havn't seen this one in a while. LOL. Sorry, that I had to be the one to bring it back. Let the debate commence!

Yeah, best thread idea ever. We can´t have enough of the "my **** is the biggest" stuff

Urban Ranger · December 5, 2003, 01:37

Clearly, you meant "my duck is the biggeest"

BeBro · December 5, 2003, 01:39

LOL

of course.

But we shouldn´t spam down this important thread

Leopard!

Chilean President™ · December 5, 2003, 01:42

MERKAVA!!!

Lefty Scaevola · December 5, 2003, 01:43

The abrams rangefinder, for a weapon effective to a around 4 klicks, is calibrated to milimeters. So exactly where do you want the 120 milimeter round, Saddam.

Lord Merciless · December 5, 2003, 01:52

T-34 is not the best MBT, it is one of the most successful tanks.

Leopard II A6, Leclerc, and Merkava all look great on papers and training grounds, but none of them have ever been in a real tank battle.

Al B. Sure! · December 5, 2003, 01:57

Quote:

Leopard II A6, Leclerc, and Merkava all look great on papers and training grounds, but none of them have ever been in a real tank battle.

the europeans had their chance... if it wasnt for that whole not supporting the war in iraq thing...

ravagon · December 5, 2003, 02:34

Brilliant idea. It's been far too long as it is.

Quote:

Originally posted by Bebro
But we shouldn´t spam down this important thread

Heathen! How dare thy spam the holy of holies.

[Edit: Damn. Now those santa hats make that look silly.

]

Urban Ranger · December 5, 2003, 02:56

Quote:

Originally posted by Lefty Scaevola
The abrams rangefinder, for a weapon effective to a around 4 klicks, is calibrated to milimeters.

That seems like the epitome of stupidity. The changing conditions on the battlefield alone will preclude this sort of unrealistic precision.

ravagon · December 5, 2003, 03:31

Quote:

Originally posted by Urban Ranger

That seems like the epitome of stupidity. The changing conditions on the battlefield alone will preclude this sort of unrealistic precision.

At 4km you're probably right.
At 1-1.5km though it could be very useful to be able to put a sabot round in the space between the turret and the chassis.

Tanks without turrets aren't so much tanks as, ... well they aren't quite as effective as tanks with turrets anyway.

Ned · December 5, 2003, 03:44

All we know now is that the Abrams is the most successful tank in history. Name one that has a more dominant record?

Urban Ranger · December 5, 2003, 03:54

Quote:

Originally posted by Ned
All we know now is that the Abrams is the most successful tank in history. Name one that has a more dominant record?

Dominant?

Not like it saw major engagements like the tanks in WWII.

Ned · December 5, 2003, 04:02

What tank has a better kill ratio in combat with other tanks?

Urban Ranger · December 5, 2003, 04:05

Quote:

Originally posted by Ned
What tank has a better kill ratio in combat with other tanks?

Kill ratio is meaningless without context. Was it 50 or 500 of your tanks did the job? What are those other tanks? Etc. Etc.

Ned · December 5, 2003, 04:09

Well, I will leave the stats to others. But, until Iraq II, not a single Abrams was lost in battle. Not one. Yet it wiped out whole armored divisions in Gulf I, and defeated all opposition in Iraq II. The only losses are to RPG and hand-held anti-tank missiles.

So, its record against opposing tanks is perfect.

Uncle Sparky · December 5, 2003, 04:31

Mozza, bacon & tomato ?

2 slices rye bread toasted
5 slices smokey side bacon
2-3 thick slices beefsteak tomato
2 slices real mozza (melt on bread before adding other stuff)
2-3 bib lettuce leaves
a touch of russian dressing

mmmm

Ecthy · December 5, 2003, 05:49

Leo IIs have been in battle against Kurds.

BeBro · December 5, 2003, 06:36

Quote:

Originally posted by Lord Merciless
Leopard II A6, Leclerc, and Merkava all look great on papers and training grounds, but none of them have ever been in a real tank battle.

Danish Leo I (let´s assume the LeoII is no step back

) tanks saw limited action in Bosnia around Tuzla since late 1993, came under fire several times, lost none of them, and attacked successfully several ari sites, bunkers, missile launchers and infantry. Ok, that were no tank vs. tank battles, but OTOH in those fights Abrams tanks were used the US usually was vastly superior too, because it did not face comparable modern equipment, so we still lack a good comparison IMO.