I consider Diplo guiding past forts a cheat

I just thought I should let you all know. Just in case it comes up in a game that I'm playing in. I won't play in a game where this is allowed.

Thank you for your attention

[finbar]

Pleasure. And it was edifying too, I have to say.

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finbar
Mono Rules!
#33984591

[Ming]

Why not? It says in the rules that diplo's/spies ignore zone of control????
What's the problem. Wait until you see the scout/alpine combo

[Empress]

uhhh can you please explain what you mean? or are you jsut being silly and I don't get it?

[Smash]

No problem.Just use a caravan,freight,explorer or partisan.

I can see a spy/diplomat slipping by garrisons (but there should be a 25 to 35 percent chance of getting caught), but what I really object to is the notion that any unit from a dip to caravan can escort a massive army through multiple zones of control. What nonsense! Oh yeah, our diplomat will magically allow 100,000 crusaders to slip by all those fortifications.

[Frank Johnson]

I think if you want to use your ZOC, you should have to fight and use your offense Why should a few phalanxes fortified stop my legions or knights if you are too scared to come out and fight?

Ming, did you include guiding in your Civ III cheat list?

[Ming]

No... I didn't. It's not a cheat, so it's not included

[finbar]

That's what I told him.

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finbar
Mono Rules!
#33984591

[cavebear]

Define "diplo guiding", please...

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Proud participant in GameLeague...

Proud Warrior of the O.W.L. Alliance...

"Diplo guiding" is where a diplo is used to negate the zones of control of a fort. You put a diplo on the diamond where the fort is exerting a zone of control and your units can move through that diamond. They are no longer blocked by the ZOC of the fort.

I'd like to know which "groups" of regular players allow this. Does your group Ming?


<font size=1 face=Arial color=444444>[This message has been edited by Alexander's Horse (edited July 23, 2000).]</font>

[Ming]

I don't know of anybody that doesn't allow it. It's a part of the game just like wonders and science. There is nothing wrong with doing it!

Oh, okay. I think its a cheat but I'll bow to player opinion

(I've had icq on it too)

Ming, could you leave this thread open anyway please, I'm still interested in opinions, and thanks for taking the trouble to reply.

Carry on makeo

[suas333]

I've done it occasionally, but i do feel kinda guilty if using it to take a major city. I hope that everyone can decide whether it belongs with the game bugs as cheat, or if it is allowed. Maybe you'll have to ask Sid Meier about it.

suas333
O.W.L Alliance

[Spider]

As long as you're asking for opinions, count me with the group that says it's part of the game.

Consider the humble knight-fork in a game of chess. Not very fair in all respects (whoever heard of a horse that attacks in two directions at once, let alone three or four), but it's certainly legal and something to guard against.

Just remember to put it into your own bag of tricks. And if it really makes you mad when you see someone do this, find out their "pet peeve" and get even that way. Or better yet, just nuke the bastard.

Remember, the important thing here is not to put up with any insolence from anyone. That's what this game is all about.

[Makeo]

haha

[finbar]

Skitch 'im, Makeo!

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finbar
Mono Rules!
#33984591

Well. AH I warned you!
I said you were on a sure-fire loser with this thread

Ming finally convinced me that incremental rush buying was OK and all the good players do it; so I do too now, just like diplo-guiding, foresting city squares etc. I now regard none of these as cheats and even limited transport chaining I think is OK now.

The things I really consider cheats are clicking in enexplored territory and generally getting info for free; along with caravan, infinite unit and Wonder swapping.

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*THE DEITY*
#8388924

No, its okay, I understand this now. Its like at D-Day, right, where the allies landed that diplo on each beach and the allied armies landed and walked right through the German fortifications. You can't argue with history right?

Yep, perfectly plausible.

[finbar]

Gee. Loses as gracefully as he wins.

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finbar
Mono Rules!
#33984591

[Ming]

ROTFLMAO

[Ming]

Some do, some don't. I think most people do it, and allow it

Why are you laughing Ming? Haven't you seen that film, "Strolling with Private Ryan"?

Actually Frank raised a good point, why should fortifications prevent an awesome attacking force from moving thru an open space if the defenders remain behind their walls. But then there should be no ZOC, why would a diplomat facilitate the movement of a massive army - or a caravan? Thats why I think this is a bug, because even caravans can allow the movement of military units thru ZOC - that makes no sense. It just doesn't seem right that a defender must physically occupy every space to prevent infiltration.

[Frank Johnson]

Hm....untill artillery.....machine guns, and airplanes there should be no ZOC. For that matter air planes and ships should have ZOC, then again that my ideal T-B-S game combat system......hehe hey Sid still time to hire me for civ3

<center><table width=80%><tr><td><font color=000080 face="Verdana" size=2><font size="1">quote:
<img src="/images/blue1.gif" width=100% height=1>
</font><font size=1>Originally posted by Berserker on 07-23-2000 10:19 PM</font>

It just doesn't seem right that a defender must physically occupy every space to prevent infiltration.


<img src="/images/blue1.gif" width=100% height=1></font></td></tr></table></center>

Exactly.

The whole point of fortifications, even in ancient times, was that they provided a point from which defenders could dominate the surrounding terrain in relative safety, particularly preventing movement.

[suas333]

i thought incremental buying was cheating.

The whole point of diplos/spies and their movement in civ is that they can achieve things like guiding troops through enemy territory. You could make up many stories to explain how they achieve this, short of bribery of the enemy. Maybe the diplos were 'entertaining' the enemy whilst the troops snuck by under cover of dark

This feature of diplos was well understood in Civ 1 and not changed for Civ 2....



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*THE DEITY*
#8388924

Well as I said to finbar, ones and twos sure, but not the entire Afrika Korps!