AU501 - DAR1: 4000BC-2150BC

[Dominae]

This is the DAR ("During Action Report") thread for the first 40 turns of AU501 - The Power of Seafaring.

Use this space to discuss early-game moves, and plans for the future. For instance, where did you found your capital, and why? Since this report only spans 40 turns, please provide as many details as you can remember.

[Theseus]

WOOHOO!!

[nbarclay]

I went into the game planning to follow the last plan I posted in the teaser thread. However, two things happened to change my mind.

(1) I lucked out and got a free settler from the initial hut. (It's not quite all luck; I was trying to boost my chances of that happening when I decided to build a worker first instead of a warrior first in my capital, thereby eliminating barbs as a possibility from the hut.) The settler looked down and saw two game forest tiles, so he decided that that would be a perfect place to build a city. With a second, high-production city, I decided to build some warriors there (two MPs and two explorers) and build a granary in the capital ASAP after my initial worker.

(2) In my excitement over the free settler, I botched the capital's growth when it grew to size 2 for the second time. (The first time it grew, it produced a worker the same turn.) That left me working a forest on a turn I should have been working the fish, which cost me a turn on growth. Simce my second worker had just finished mining a grassland with shield (if I remember the timing correctly), I worked the mined grassland with shield for three turns to balance out the food situation (albeit at the expense of commerce for research) before switching to the fish.

The end result was that with my forest chop one more 1-turn shift from fish to forest (to speed up my granary and slow down the capital's growth), my granary completed in 3900 BC with the capital a turn away from growing to size 4.

In 2590 BC, I lost the first settler out of my capital when he ran up against a barbarian camp (the first barbarians I encountered in the game). I should have diverted my MP warrior from the capital to serve as an escort! Adrianople completed a worker after its four warriors and started a granary.

2350 BC: Caeserea is founded on the gold hill with the goal of giving research a boost.

2310 BC: Nicaea is founded and starts work on the first Byzantine curraugh.

As of 2150 BC, my Byzantines have four cities and are a turn away from founding a fifth. Adrianople has just completed a granary and is slated to serve as a second city oriented toward building settlers and workers (after chopping and irrigating the game forests).

[Smellincoffee]

This is my first try at one of these, so bear with me.

------------------------

I decided to found Constantinope on the start, sending the worker to irrigate the grassland SE of town-- stretching toward the cow. My first build was a worker, and the two of them improved the town some. I forgot to replace the first irrigation with mining, though.

The hut didn't give me a free settler-- but I did get a tech, same for the hut in the marsh. (Warrior code and ceremonial burial) I just saw a light blue civ, and my first curragh is moving towardit. I discovered that I was on an island in 2470. This picture was taken before I decided to switch Con. and Adrian's builds-- to a settler and worker, respectivly. I've been following the Philosophy beeline in tech.

I can't get the bloody picture to upload onto the server, so I'll just use an MSN Community.

URL: (If image doesn't work, which happens with MSN Groups)
http://groups.msn.com/_Secure/0VADbA...56854234407906

[Dominae]

Originally posted by Smellincoffee
I can't get the bloody picture to upload onto the server, so I'll just use an MSN Community.

You can just attach an image file to your post and the forum will display it for you. Just make sure the file is under the maximum size (both in bytes and in pixels).


Dominae

[vmxa1]

Smellincoffee you do not have to up load pix. Make them 800 res jpegs and you can attach them. Use the broswe button below the reply window to point to it.

[ducki]

First, let me apologize for the terseness, but these were the notes I took while playing so that I didn't forget to do anything or leave anything out of my report. I'd rewrite it, but I think it fairly clearly highlights the transformation you lunatics have inflicted upon me as a player.

I accidentally played until 1990BC and I made contact with 2 AIs in 2470BC, so if you don't want to know about those or in which directions they lie, don't read this yet. I blacked out the minimap in my screenshot, though, and cropped as well as I could. Here goes the MM madness that is my new playstyle.

4000BC - Found. Start Worker instead of Warrior. Really don't want barbs next to capitol on turn 10 and rarely seem to get anything but barbs on Emperor.
Turn 1. Work Fish
Turn 2. Work BG
Turn 3. Work Fish
Turn 4. Work BG
Turn 5. (3800BC?)Work Fish - synced up now on food and shields to grow and finish in 4.
(The MM started early here. This is silly already! )

3650BC - Finished Worker, completed Road+Irrigation of Grassland SE of Duckstantinople. Begin Barracks(granary placeholder).
Worker1 to Cow. Worker2 to BG NE(7) of Duckstantinople.
3550BC - Worker1 Irrigate Cow. Worker2 mine BG. Hut pops a settler. Too bad I don't know where to send him, though there looks to be good hunting(2 game) South of the Volcano. Whee!

3350BC - After 20minutes of thinking - honestly, 20 minutes, just about which direction to send the hut-settler I moved south by two, then saw coast and moved east to be coastal but still have the two game in range. Luckily, that puts a whale within border-expansion range. Nice spot. Couldn't have planned it better if I'd explored, but I'll need much tighter spacing from here on out. At least I've got a barracks-military-navy town up that might even be wonder-worthy later on. Pottery is two turns away.
Start on warrior - wish I could do a curragh, but I'm going to need at least one garrison in Duckstantinople and at least 1 explorer to find city sites before I have settlers exploring for themselves(eek!).

3300BC - Gah! Volcano is now Active! Argh!
Pottery comes in. Switch to Granary. MM citizen from Cow to Mined BG. Still grow in 1 but finish Granary in 16 rather than 24.
Set research to Writing 100%, done in 48turns. Hoping to hit Mapmaking first and shoot for the Lighthouse(hey, this IS the Power of Seafaring, right?)

Sidenote: I don't even have a pump up yet and I did more MM so far than I ever did before the 'poly folks explained how to MM a pump. I think I'm going to be sick.

3250BC - Duckst. grows to 2, must go 20% lux, killing Writing back to 50 turns. It'll come back, I know, but it still hurts psychologically.
Currently at +4fpt and +4spt. Granary in 11. Time to grab an axe.

3200BC - Worker 1 finishing road on irrig. cow. Go east by 1 to chop and start road towards Adrian.
Tried MM Citizen in Adrian from game to coast - adds 1 happy-commerce. No change in beakers. Now I've got the MM bug. Gaaaahhh!!!!
Finished Warrior, send to Duckst. Start another. Must get to Curragh SOON!

Blech. Volcano erupts. Anyone got a cork? Odd. No damage. Whew!

3000BC - Duckst. grows to 3. Lux to 40%. /sigh. Strike that - MM Laborer to Lake Icthor from BG and either the extra food or extra commerce allows lux down to 30%. Writing in 36. Darnit Dominae, see what you people have done to me?!? I actually got a warm fuzzy feeling when I switched that laborer and her ugly face turned bright and shiny! Pthphptphtpt!
Granary in 6, but the forest will cut that in half.
MM Adrian. laborer from Game forest to Sea, this time I get a beaker out of it and still finish a warrior next turn. Wheee!

I'm not even on the Top 8 list of Civs Fated to be Destroyed by Ducks. Not really all that surprising.

2950BC - Warrior finishes, start Curragh. Send warrior to Duckst. pray for peaceful neighbors. Chop done, granary in 2. Start road to connect Adrian. Start new settlement plan. Should probably do something like a dot-map, ala CFC Succession Games, but it would be cooler if I could just "landmark" or name tiles in-game.

Debating whether to just road to Adrian or Chop-then-Road my way there. Wishing I'd explored earlier, but glad I got a hut-settler.
Starting to think I'm alone on this rock. Curragh in 5, will soon find out.

Garrison reaches Duckst. - tweak sliders - lux 20, science 80. writing in 26(temporarily, I'm sure)

2900BC - Granary complete(and full). Pop: 3 with 5 stored food. I'm sure I should remember something about that - I know Dom said something about 4 and-a-half pop and 6-and-a-half pop somewhere, but I think it went over my head. Damn. Start Warrior, done in 3. Take break to try to remember why half-pop was important.

2850BC - Change in plan - Warrior 2 going exploring. Will slow down Writing due to lux and shrinking econ, but must know more about homeland.
Have decided that half-pop thing was for Granary completion so that it would already be half-filled. Or something. Dunno for sure.

2800BC - Warrior2 went SW and hit coast very quickly. Will have to really pack the towns in, it looks like.
Duckst. hit size 4. Postpone road to Adrian - must get Grassland mined asap for pump to work, IIRC. It's gonna be screwy for the first settler, maybe two, I think. Gah!

2750BC - Warrior3 done in Duckst. Size4 grow in 1. Start Warrior3 and plan to eat some wasted food. Writing in 25. Yeah, right.

2710BC - Curragh complete, time to go 'splorin'!
Begin Curragh2.
Curragh goes east one, sees some daylight across the sea, and plans to pop into sea and back out(We're seafaring, we get that extra move) but Sea eats two moves now, so I was afraid I might be tempted to reload due to failure to remember the new rules, but we survive and near the borders of another civ across the sea. Also, our exploring Warrior2 has spotted a border to our Southwest across(I hope) a sea. Oh yeah, found some spice or incense.

2630BC - Warrior4 headed north last turn and now there's a barb coming down. Dang. (Later killed barb, got promoted, cleared camp and used the 25g to keep deficit-spending.)

Also figured out what's been eating me about the map - it's so hard to do my usual CxxC spacing without either wasting bonuses(BG, tobacco) or losing out on either coastalness or fresh water. Nice work Dominae, this one's making me think a lot more than I normally do.

2590BC - Stupid AI. Settle closer to the coast so I can meet you! Grr!

2470BC - Finally! Contact! Tokie seems annoyed and we just met! I haven't even shown him my pointy stick yet! Let's hope I have something worth trading. Should wait till Curragh1 finds out who's over to the east, though, for better prices. Ah, there's Mursillis! He and Tokie know Warrior Code and Ceremonial Burial, Tokie knows the Wheel and Mursilis knows Alphabet. Unfortunately, Tokie won't part with the Wheel and I fear losing what little trade-power I have now. Should I take CB or WC and a little cash or wait? Hmmm...
I will wait, pending either a drop in offered price or new contacts. I doubt anyone else has boats this early.

2430BC - 1st Settler produced(Seems late, wonder why?) - Sent SW.

2390BC - Finally have Pump food evened out/in sync. I hope.
Price just dropped for selling ABCs to Tokie. Must decide between CB and WC. Probably CB just to empty his treasury. Plus I don't really need more troops yet. Support already shrinking bank account.
Writing in 20. This is taking forever!
Caesarea settled 1 tile SW of Cow. Will use Temple to grab last BG then start wonder, most likely. Colossus would be nice, Lighthouse would be nicer.
Must settle the lux down south - spice? incense?

2350BC - Adrian. finishes worker, begins Temple to grab Whales, then either wonder or more ships.

2310BC - Settler2 complete. Is that right or did I have a forest-chop somewhere in there sync me back up? Odd.

(... boring cruise-control Pump MM and exploring and stuff ...)

2150BC Hittites research Masonry - 5 to go on Writing, so maybe I can trade for that and some cash.

2070BC - Found Varna on Tobacco NW of capitol, next to Wheat.

1990BC - Settler4 complete. Writing done. Research Mapmaking 80%. Will found embassy with Hittites for 32gold, then trade them Writing for Masonry+30-ish gold, then trade Masonry or Writing to Japan for Wheel and Warrior Code. Soon to contact 3rd Civ. I think.

[donZappo]

Emperor Difficulty

I went into this with a slightly different idea. I wanted to exploit the seafaring trait right from the start! So I moved one space to the west and settled Constantinople right on the coast. Sure, I gave up the bonus resource, but resources seemed plentiful so I didn't think I would miss it until I got it back in the later ages. Plus, it was basically trading in a shield for some gold, right? I set my worker to irrigate the bonus plains right next to it, and dragged this irrigation through to the cattle to the south. Oh, and I started on a curragh to get a real feel for the trait. I set my research to pottery at 100%

I sent the curragh off to the south and discovered Japan in 3550. Definitely pleased with the speed of that meeting. I noted they have two patches of Ivory. Nice play, Dom. Either you have to be good friends with them and trade for the spare, or find the dark place in your heart and invade their small island. I got their wheels for my alphabet, so I guess they'll be speaking my language for the rest of the game...

I finished researching pottery in 3200 BC and decided to risk a 50 turn gambit on writing going for a Map Making grab. I had hoped to meet other civs and try my skills at trading to keep me up in techs until then. Or get lucky and trade Map Making to everybody for much money.

I met Sumeria in 2800BC. Between them and Japan I got Ceremonial Burial and Masonry + 3 gold for The Wheel and Pottery. Woo hoo, the early curragh gambit is paying off!

I finished my granary in 2750BC. I already had two warriors to this point, both being MP as my citizens were getting quite unruly. I was holding off exploring by foot for a good deal of time since my curragh has led me to believe I'm on an island and have such a luxury... I set my worker to cut down a tree so that the turn after the granary finishes I'll get the shields added to my settler to make up for a bit of REX time lost.

2590BC - I thought about trading Masonry to Japan for their Warrior Code. I saw no reason I should help them get to Mathematics any faster than normal, so they won't be seeing this tech from me.

2470BC - Founded my first city, Adrianople to the northwest.

2390BC - Finished building a curragh so I could go Curragh --> settler to coincide with city growth. Risked my first goodie hut. Freakin' Barbs!

I met the Hittites in 2310BC. I bought the Warrior Code off of them for The Wheel and pocket change. I've discovered something, well, "interesting" to my west but I guess I won't spoil the surprise for anybody. I start to feel my benevolent heart start to beat black blood through my veins as I ponder my future expansion routes.

2150BC - Founded my third city, Caesarea to the northeast. Kinda close to the swamp but I'm alright with that.

I'll have my next city put down in about 4 more turns. Having sacrificed some early REX for curragh exploration and being on the coast has actually paid of quite well! I met 3 civs, have a tech lead on two, and am only down Mysticism to one other. My cash is flowing and my island is going to be quickly populated in the next few years. If my writing gambit really works out for me, I'll be sitting quite pretty! That extra cash is definitely helping with negotiations for the time being.

Dominae - Nice map! I'm really liking it so far! I see that you've done some interesting things to kinda force our hand in certain directions, but I see some great choices to make in the real near future. You also appear to like to give us a taste for the new terrain in Conquests.

-donZappo

[donZappo]

I'm surprised I beat you to the first settler, Ducki, since I took a round-about way of doing things. I used a forest to boost it a bit, but I still would have sworn you had me beat. Good looking game you have there so far. I wish I got bonus settlers like every other player does. I do think you should see a doctor about that MM virus you have caught, though!

[ducki]

Well, since (without the hut-settler) I wouldn't have had any defenses at all until 2750BC, that was quite a gamble, but if I built military for defense, I'd need one for the capitol and one for the worker in case the hut was nasty - which means no building a worker in the first 10 turns. It really was an all or nothing deal as far as I was concerned - either no early worker or no early military. It paid off this time, but I'm not sure I'd risk it again anytime soon.

I have to also agree that this is a great map so far. Thanks Dominae!

I can't wait to see how many folks go for a Philo beeline, if any.

[Dominae]

Originally posted by ducki
Tried MM Citizen in Adrian from game to coast - adds 1 happy-commerce. No change in beakers. Now I've got the MM bug. Gaaaahhh!!!!

Good luck trying to shake it now!

Also figured out what's been eating me about the map - it's so hard to do my usual CxxC spacing without either wasting bonuses(BG, tobacco) or losing out on either coastalness or fresh water.

Extra Commerce (from Tobacco, for example) is never lost when you found a city over it. It's annoying to cover Bonus Grassland tiles because then you do lose that 1 Shield, but between that and having more coastal tiles to work I would prefer the latter (especially on this map).

Originally posted by donZappo
I went into this with a slightly different idea. I wanted to exploit the seafaring trait right from the start!
...
Woo hoo, the early curragh gambit is paying off!

Excellent!


Dominae

[Stuie]

Well, I'm probably in over my head playing on Emperor, seeing as I prefer an easy-going Monarch game usually. And I'm totally pissed at the people getting settlers from the hut. I got a warrior.

I'm also not a mircomanager usually, so I missed some opportunities along the way. Ah, well. Live and learn.

4000bc - found Constantinople on the starting spot. Build order = Worker. Reasearch = Pottery @ 90%. Worker moves to the shielded grassland.
3950bc - Worker builds mine
3700bc - one turn to late, I switch the citizen from the fist to the shielded grassland. Oops. Now the city will grow before the worker is finished.
3650bc - Worker1 builds a road. Worker2 built. Build order switched to Barracks (as a Granary pre-build).
3600bc - Worker2 heads for the cow.
3550bc - Boarders expand and pop the hut - I get the aforementioned Warrior.
3500bc - Move warrior to the capital for crowd control (I'm really bad at using the slider - must improve).
3250bc - Workers have been roading/irrigating - irrigation of cow begins. Pottery researched; switch to Writing at 20% (Philosophy beeline anyone ).
2950bc - Workers are prepping 2nd city site.
2800bc - Luxury slider to 40% (one turn late . Constantinople is now size 3).
2710bc - Granary complete. Build = Settler.
2510bc - Settler complete. Build = Settler.
2470bc - Adrianople founded on the coast. Build order = Curragh. Workers move off to prep 3rd and 4th city sites.
2430bc - Volcano becomes active!!!!
2350bc - Volcano erupts - tiles effected are east and south.
2270bc - Adrianople builds Curragh1. Build order = Curragh. Curragh1 contacts the Japanese to the south. We trade Alphabet for Ceremonial Burial and 10g.
2150bc - Settler2 is finished - this one will be moving NW to the tobacco for my third city.

Not a very clean game, but like I said, I don't enjoy micromanaging. At least I'm having fun... so far.

[Smellincoffee]

I tried attaching it four times, but it wouldn't allow me. It said my picture had to be no bigger than "800 x 0".

[Dominae]

Originally posted by Smellincoffee
I tried attaching it four times, but it wouldn't allow me. It said my picture had to be no bigger than "800 x 0".

That's right. You need to use an image editing program such as Photoshop to resize the image so that it's under the maximum size allowed (800x600). When you capture images using Print Screen, it uses your screen's resolution (probably 1024x768, or higher), which is too big.


Dominae

[Cort Haus]

How many turns till Writing, Nathan?

[Cort Haus]

Emperor

Took starting tile, and decided to go for worker first (working fish for food and commerce) after reading how the hut won't give barbs if you've no military. It gave 25g

So, worker-warrior-warrior-granary

At emp, the need for MP or slider at size 2 restricts exploration or research. So one warrior for MP and one to explore a bit. The slower research needs good commerce to get through, so sufficient roads will be very important, even if at the expense of some growth.

Starting worker moved to the bonus grass at Const-7 and roads & mines, followed by same again on Const-4. The second irrigates towards cow.

Checked each turn fiddling with wf to avoid loss of food or shields on growth/builds where possible.

Pottery in 3300 BC, started Writing at 100%, even though initial turns at 50-turn rate

1st warrior explored east then south, finding Incense and seeing green civ next turn.
Then he returned home to MP and keep research ticking.

Worker irrigating cows starts road towards incense, other chops Const-77 to finish Granary in 2700.


Adrianople on tobacco at Const-777, starts curragh, then Caesarea 7 of incense - builds warrior

Currah heads for greens (Japan). Trade Alphabet, 10g and 1gpt for Wheel


In 2150 I had 3 cities, the fourth to be founded next turn. Writing in about 10 turns.

[nbarclay]

Originally posted by Cort Haus
How many turns till Writing, Nathan?

As of 2150 BC, it was showing six turns to Writing (running a 2 gpt deficit with 29 gold in the bank).

[Smellincoffee]

Dominae : Oh, okay. Gotcha. It was 812. ( )

[notyoueither]

I built on the hill and sent the worker off for the hut (Warrior Code, yaaay!).

I am playing more spread out than I used to. Got a bit tired of urban crowding.

Got contact with Japan due to cultural borders, and then developed a small barbarian problem. Small because they don't do much, but they restrict where workers and unguarded settlers can go.

[vmxa1]

Originally posted by Smellincoffee
I tried attaching it four times, but it wouldn't allow me. It said my picture had to be no bigger than "800 x 0".

Find Irfanview, it is free. It can capture the screen, resize it and save it as a jpeg.

[Taian]

AU mod, Emperor.

So, we're seafaring. Unfortuneately, the advantage of the extra gold in cities built on the coast isn't available in the initial starting position. This begs the question of whether to plop the city down where we start or to move northwest to have access to the coast and access to fresh water. I chose the latter in this case. So, in 3950BC, Constantinople was founded and the Byzantines began their quest for world domination.
My initial tech choice is Writing. Since we're playing the power of seafaring, I'm going to gamble that it's going to be a ton of islands. As well, it likely won't take overly long to colonize the homeland as a result. I'll forgo Pottery for the moment and hope to maybe trade for it later. Hoping to be the first one to writing and trade it around. I chose to go for min research on writing, so it's 50 turns to go.
I popped the first hut (the one we see in the start position) in 3450BC and got 3 barb warriors. The first killed himself on my warrior and I killed the second the next move. After that I healed and then let the 3rd one kill himself on me as well. Scratch one barb pack.
My second build out of Constantinople (after the warrior) was a worker to get the roads down and tile improvements going...he finished in 3400BC. Next up was a Curragh which completed in 3200BC. I'm hoping the curragh pays off in early exploration and gaining contacts around the world.
First contact was achieved with Japan in 3050BC and I traded Alphabet to them for Ceremonial Burial and 10 gold. The first settler was finished in 2850BC and I moved him 1112 from Constantinople to found Adrianople. My 3rd city was founded 7777 from Constantinople in 2310BC (Caeserea).
The other hut on our island also yielded a bunch of barbarians that managed to kill themselves on my warrior, giving him veteran status.
Adrianople was put building a warrior initially and then pumped out 3 more curraghs (with the help of a few forest chops) before 2150BC.
Wasn't sure if we actually play through 2150BC or end it before the turns...anyway, I played it and ended up contacting Sumeria. Both them and Japan are currently more advanced than I am, but neither have writing yet and I'm 12 turns away from it (crossing fingers...). As well, Japan has the Wheel which Sumeria doesn't have. Hoping to play one against the other to get to tech parity.

EDIT: Stats for the moment:
3 Cities
2 Warriors
2 Workers
4 Curraghs

[steven8r]

OK, I d/l'ed the standard game and loaded-up Emperor level. So far what I've learned from this game is that I still need to learn more!!! I read through the 'Teaser' threads and then even the 'spoiler' sections. Even with that unfair advantage, some how I managed to screw things up. In fact, if my game sucked rocks at this point, it would be a HUGE improvement!!!

I've got several notes so far:
Someone please let me know at which point I start screwing things up. Thanks,

T1: Settle on the spot. WF fish. Research Pottery @ 50% (didn't matter if I upped it to 100%, still same amount of time.) Start building Worker. Move Worker1 (1)

T2: 3f 1s, WF->BG, Worker 1 (W1) started Irrigating.

T3: 5f 3s, WF ->Fish (at this point +2gpt, Pottery in 19)

T4: 8f 4s, WF->BG (at this point +1gpt, Pottery in 26)

T5: 10f 6s WF->Fish

T6: 13f 7s Continue to WF Fish (This looks like the 'Balance' that Ducki mentioned: Worker and growth will happen same turn w/ this configuration). Irrigation complete, Worker 1 moves (1) to Cow. Increase Sci to 90% -> Pottery in 10 +0gpt, 18g in treasury.

T7: 16f 8s, Worker 1 starts Irrigating.

T8: 19f 9s, Woops, it looks like I'll waste 2 Food, but come-out OK on Shields. I just remembered, I WILL loose some Shields due to Gov'r assigning extra WF before he goes into Worker. DOH!! (Perhaps I misunderstood Ducki's 'Balance' thingy.)

T9: City Grows, Worker 2 finished, start Warrior, Pop back to 1. WF -> BG ==> +2f, +2s /turn. Worker2 (7) to BG.

T10: 2f 2s, WF -> Fish, Worker2 Mine,

T11: Culture Expansion pops Goody Hut, Reveals Map (Yippee!)

Gov'r auto WF to freshly Irrigated Cow after expand, Worker1 starts Road.

T12: 9f 5s, don't change anything.

T13: 13f 7s, WF -> Fish.

T14: 16f 8s, WF -> Cow, Worker1 (7) to BG. Growth and Warrior in 1 turn.


T15: Growth, Warrior Complete, start Barracks as Prebuild for Grainery (Pottery in 3). Gov'r assigns Forrest to new citizen, other citezen WF -> Forrest to boost Shields. Increase Lux to 10%, Sci @ 90%. Hopefully this will keep that 2nd pop happy enough to allow me to explore some more territory. Warrior goes N to explore.

T16: Riot in Constantinople! OK, 10% Lux WON'T keep 'em happy! Move Warrior back home for MP. WF -> Cow & Fish, Worker2 starts Road.

T17: Order Restored. (wheew) 5f 2s, WF -> Cow and M-BG. Lux 0%, Sci 50% -> Pottery in 2. +3gpt.

T18: 9f 6s, WF -> M-BG & Forrest to boost Shields.

T19: 10f 11s, Switched Barraks to Grainery. Start researching Writing in 50 (doesn't seem to matter how much I put into research, this # doesn't go down. So I put 20% into Science to keep my income). Worker2 moves (6) to Forrest.

T20: 11f 16s, Worker2 chops, increase Lux to 20% -> +2 gpt. (gonna try to pop that Hut up North w/ Warrior).

T21: 12f 21s, WF -> M-BGx2, Worker1 Road, Warrior goes N (again).

Pliny releases some histoical book and the Byzantines are the 5th Happiest (Puny) nation in the World. (Perhaps I should've held-off 1 turn on Warrior leaving town.)

T22: 14f 26s

T23: 16f 31s

T24: 18f 46s (w/ 10 from chop), WF= Fish & Hill --> =2f +2s. Writing still 45 turns away. Worker2 (4) to M-BG and Worker1 (2,3) to Grassland to start road South. Warrior Pops Hut and unleashes Angry Barbs!


T25: Growth. Will waste 1 Shield WF = Cow, M-BG, Fish. Warrior lost Ignominiously! (Note to self, DO NOT attack across Rivers!!!). Worker1 Road, Worker2 moves to same square as Worker1.

T26: 5f 4s. Growth in 3, Grainery in 2 (will waste 1 Shield). Worker2 Road.

T27: 10f 57s, WF = M-BG, Fish, Tobacco. No lost Shields. Maybe I am learning this MM thing after all.

T28: Grainery complete, start Warrior -- I've got Barbs just hanging-out North of town, Need some protection. (this will slow-down the turning-on of the Pump) WF = M-BGx2 Fish

T29: 6f 5s

T30: Warrior complete, will need another? for MP when pop grows in 1
Something interesting that I noticed about changing WF around: When I remove a Pop from the Fish and reassign, they get upset. Does Fish make them happy? or is it just the extra food so that they think they're gonna grow and not be, 'Too Crowded'?
WF = M-BGx2 Hill, dropped Lux to 30%.

T31: Growth, Pop = 4. 0f 7s, WF = M-BG Fish Tobaccox2. Dropped Sci to 10% (doesn't seem to matter) Upped Lux to 50%. Worker1 & 2 move to Forrest to start Road and see Barbs. Move Warrior out of town to protect.

T32: Warrior complete, what now? another? 3f 0s, WF = M-BGx2 Fish & Tobacco.

T33: 6f 5s, WF = M-BGx2 Cow Fish. Will waste 5 Food, but will grow and complete Warrior. Warrior fights Barb--wins, but is down to 1hp.

T34: Growth Pop=5, Warrior complete, start Settler. WF = Cow, M-BGx2, Roaded Forrest, and Fish. Workers move (7) toward Wheat. Warrior LOST (again!!!) to Barb Chief. Move 1hp Warrior on top of Workers.

T35: 4f 8s, WF = Cow, M-BG, Fish, Hill, Volcano. Workers Move toward Wheat. Up Lux to 70%.

T36: Growth Pop=6 now, 25s. (will waste 6 Shields building Settler). Another Warrior lost to Barbs. Workers still unprotected.

T37: Settler complete, start Warriors--I keep losing 'em! WF = Forrest, M-BGx2, Fish. Barbs start showing up on my Southeastern Border.
Settler moves (7,7,7) on top of Tobacco, will build City next turn. Pull Warrior out of Constantinople to guard Settler/Workers.

T38: Founded Adranople. WF = roaded Wheat. Start building Curragh to scout and meet folks. (should've Mined it before moving Workers to BG to Mine & Road. Will get it shortly.) Moved Warrior to hill above Barb Camp--maybe he won't die here.
Constantinople: WF = M-BG, Fish, Tobaccox2. Lux 60%

T39: Constantinople: Warrior complete--MP, build Worker.
Adrianople: same thing. Warrior attacks Barb Camp from Hill. Actually wins this time! WooHoo Now Adrianople can breathe a little easier. Barbs still roaming the Mountains SE of Constantinople.

T40: Year 2150, end of this section
Const. Growth, pop = 5. Change Worker to Warrior to defend vs Barbs. WF = Cow, Fish, Tobacx2, M-BG.
Adrian: still building Curragh. 6f 2s (really should've Mined that Wheat! Doing that now, but I wish I'd done it sooner.)


OK, I've established exactly 1 extra Town. And Barbs are roaming my Southeast border. I've got little military and almost NO exploration.

Edit: I've got:
3 Warriors
2 Workers
2 Cities
Lot's of Barbs to have to contend with
and 26 turns till Writing /edit.

Any suggestions (even slaps in the face) would be appreciated.



Thanks,

Steven

[Cort Haus]

steven8r,

the 'happiness' from the fish is due to the commerce which is turned, via the lux slider, into happiness.

You can get faster than 50-turn research even if it starts on 50 turn on max science, as long as you pump commerce. Writing started at 50-turn for me too, but I kept it at 100% and it pays off eventually - just ensure you're wf uses road or commerce-bonus tiles.

[jim_steer]

Level : Monarch

*note : This DAR is written under the influence of much beer and cookies so maybe a bit odd

Thought I would try using alexman's start strategy as I assumed that dominae would put us on an island all by our lonesome and hence I wouldn't need any military for a while.

Here is a dramatised log of the major events :-

4000BC - Constantinople founded, starts producing a worker.
3650BC - Worker 2 completed.
3500BC - Border expands, the capricious gods of the volcano give me a new settler.
3400BC - Pottery Discovered, volcano worship spreads throughout the land, cultists found the mighty city of Adrianpole and begin producing warriors to smite any unbeliving barbarians.
2900BC - Granary completed in Constantinople, the people rejoice and feast upon the sloaths, orangatangs, etc...
2670BC - A population boom due to excessive feasting necessitates the production of my first Settler, warrior cultists investigating a village pop 3 unbeliving barbarians, warrior re-enforcements close-in to destroy the foul beings.
2590BC - My valiant warriors destory the evil barbarians and the mighty city of Caesarea is founded in their honour.
2470BC - More excessive feasting in Constantinople leads to the founding of Nicaea the citizens of this city spot a new volcano the sea to the south. My workers lay waste to a forest to the east of Caesarea to produce a new curragh with which to investigate the strange new land, unfortunately the captain gets drunk and heads west instead.
2270BC - The population of Caesarea undetered by drunken seamanship produce a second curragh, a more sober captain is chosen a lead this expedition and heads south-east towards the volcano.
2230BC - Curragh 2 sends reports of giant gray beasts roaming the coast of the southern island, the citizens of Caesarea fearing they have another drunken captain begin the production of a third curragh. A group of settlers sickened by the stench of Constantinople head towards a copious source of incense with the aim of bringing sweet smells to the entire empire.
2190BC - The drunken captain of curragh 1 sends reports of a Great Banana in the jungles of the western isle, theologans theorize that this maybe a mighty new god.
2150BC - The fair town of Varna is founded near the incense, the captain of curragh 2 reports sighting a giant green dotted line on the hills of the southern island confirming in the eyes of many of Caesereas population that he has indeed taken to drink. The report is taken slightly more credibly in the capital and speculation about the existence of a rival Civilisation is rife.

At this point I was 6 turns away from discovering writing and had completely given up on micromanagement. Start Strategy seemed to pay off with a little help from the volcano gods

[Arnelos]

AU 501, Stock game, Emperor level

4000 BC: Sat there for the longest time just trying to figure out where to stick the dang capital. The two spots I agonized over were 1 NW of the starting hill or the starting hill itself. Eventually, since I like coastal capitals, I chose the coastal tile. Settler moved NW. Worker moved SE (toward goodie hut).
3950 BC: Constantinople founded. Worker moved E and gets a free settler from the hut! Settler moved SW. Constantinople WF set to fish. Start on Curragh. 100% Research (6 bpt) on Pottery.
3900 BC: Worker W. Settler SW.
3850 BC: Settler founds Adrianople. Worker W. Adrianople WF set to Game. Adrianople starts building Warrior. Research now 7 bpt.
3800 BC: Worker NW.
3750 BC: Worker starts mine.
3700 BC: -
3650 BC: Complete Warrior in Adrianople, start Warrior. Warrior NW.
3600 BC: Constantinople expands to Pop 2. Set Constantinople WF to 2-6 (3 fpt, 2 spt). Set slider to 10 % Lux, 90% Research (6 bpt). Warrior NW.
3550 BC: Warrior N (into Constantinople). Set slider to 100% research (7 bpt). This gets me Pottery NEXT turn rather than the turn after that.
3500 BC: Pottery research complete. Start Writing. Warrior forts in Constantinople.
3450 BC: Curragh complete in Constantinople, starts Settler. Mine complete by worker at Constantinople #6. Constantinople culture expands - WF changed to 6-15 (000). Adrianople completes Warrior, starts Worker. Warrior in Adrianople forts. Curragh W-W-SW. Worker starts road at Constantinople #6.
3400 BC: Curragh S-S. Contact with Japan. I sell Alphabet, Pottery, and Bronze Working for Ceremonial Burrial, The Wheel, and 10 Gold. Curragh SE.
3350 BC: Adrianople expands to Pop 2. Adrianople WF set to 3-8 (1 fpt, 4 spt). Curragh SE-SE-S (into the shadow of Mt. Fujikillallyou).
3300 BC: Adrianople completes Worker (shrinks to Pop 1), starts Granary. Worker #1 has completed road at Constantinople #6. Adrianople WF set to #3 (game). Worker #2 W. Worker #1 S. Curragh E-SE-E. Oooh, finally, a luxury (incense)!
3250 BC: Constantinople expands to Pop 3. Slider set to 10% Luxury, 90% Research (7 bpt). Constantinople WF set to 2-6-15 (4 fpt, 4 spt). Curragh E-N-NE. Worker #1 mines. Worker #2 NW.
3200 BC: Worker #2 mines. Curragh E-N-N.
3150 BC: Curragh E-E-E.
3100 BC: Curragh SE-SE and forts.
3050 BC: Constantinople completes Settler (and shrinks to Size 1), starts Granary. Workers complete mine on cow tile (con #15). Constantinople WF set to #15 (3 fpt, 3 spt). Contact with Hittites. I sell The Wheel for Warrior Code and 10 Gold. Worker #1 and Worker #2 road. Settler N. Curragh NW-N-N. Slider set to 100% Research (5 bpt).
3000 BC: Japanese City spotted on their coast on top of the ivory. Settler N. Curragh N-N-N. Contact with Sumerians. Sumerians have Masonry, but I don't have any techs to give them (and only 30 Gold). Well, crud... the Hittites now have Masonry, too. I would interupt one of the workers, but that road is going to let them get to the forest site for the chop faster anyhow.
2950 BC:

The Most Advanced Nations of the World:
1) The Glorious Hittites
2) The Great Sumerians
3) The Fine Byzantines
4) The Mediocre Japanese
5) The Puny Maya
6) The Pathetic French
7) The Hopeless Russians
8) The Forgotten Dutch

Constantinople expands to Pop 2. Workers complete road at Constantinople #15 (cow). Constantinople WF set to 6-15 (3 fpt, 5 spt). Settler W. Curragh SW-W-NW. Both Workers N-N.
2900 BC: Both Workers begin chopping forest at Constantinople #8. Settler NW. Curragh Nw-NW-NW.
2850 BC: Settler founds Caesarea. Caesarea WF set to #5 (wheat). Caesarea starts Warrior. Curragh Nw-NW-NW (Sumer sighted).
2800 BC: Forest chop at Constantinople #8 complete (Constantinople gets 10 shields toward Granary). Adrianople expands to Pop 2. Adrianople WF set to 3-8 (1 fpt, 4 spt). Worker #1 roads at Constantinople #8. Worker #2 S. Curragh N-N-N
2750 BC: Mt. Fujikillallyou in Japan is now active. Worker #2 S-SE. Curragh N-N-E.
2710 BC: Worker #2 starts road at Adrianople #7. Curragh N-N-E.
2670 BC: Worker #1 has completed the road at Constantinople #8. Worker #1 W. Curragh N-E-SE.
2630 BC: Constantinople expands to Pop 3. Constantinople WF set to 2-6-15 (4 fpt, 5 spt). Slider set to 10% Luxury, 90% Research (10 bpt). Worker #1 starts road at Constantinople #18. Curragh E-S-SE.
2590 BC: Mt. Fujikillyouall in Japan has erupted. Worker #2 has completed road at Adrianople #7. Worker #2 E-S. Curragh E-S-S.
2550 BC: Constantinople completes Granary, starts Settler. Caesarea expands to Pop 2. Caesarea WF set to #5 (wheat) and Scientist (1fpt, 1spt, 5 bpt!). Worker #2 roads at Adrianople #5. Curragh SE-S-S. Due to the granary, income is now -1 GPT. Adrianople sets WF to 3-20 (1 fpt, 4 spt).
2510 BC: Adrianople completes Granary, starts Settler. Adrianople sets WF to 3-7 (2 fpt, 3 spt). Worker #1 completed road at Constantinople #18. Worker #1 begins mining Constantinople #18. Curragh SE-S-SW. Income now -2 GPT because of 2 granaries.
2470 BC: Caesarea completes Warrior, starts Worker. Caesarea sets WF to 5-13 (2 fpt, 2 spt). Warrior in Caesarea forts. Curragh E-S-S.
2430 BC: Constantinople expands to Pop 4. Worker #2 completes road at Adrianople #5. Worker #2 S. Curragh E-S-SE. Slider set to 20% Luxury, 80% Science (10 bpt). Constantinople WF set to 2-6-15-18 (4 fpt, 6 spt).
2390 BC: Worker #2 SE (to incense tile). Curragh SE-S-S. Constantinople WF set to 1-2-6-15 (3 fpt, 7 spt).
2350 BC: Constantinople completes Settler (shrinks to Pop 2), starts Worker. Sumerians have started builing the Oracle. Slider set to 100% Research (10 bpt, -2 gpt). Settler SW-S-SW. Constantinople WF set to 6-15 (3 fpt, 5 spt). Worker #2 starts road on incense tile. Curragh S-S-W.
2310 BC: Constantinople expands to Pop 3. Constantinople WF set to 2-6-15 (4 fpt, 5 spt). Settler builds Nicaea. Nicaea sets WF to #8 (2 fpt, 2 spt). Nicaea starts Warrior. Curragh S-S-S. Set Slider to 10% Luxury, 90% Research (13 bpt, -2 gpt).
2270 BC: Constantinople completes Worker (shrinks to Pop 2), starts Worker. Caesarea completes Worker (shrinks to Pop 1), starts Worker. Worker #1 completes mine at Constantinople #18. Constantinople WF set to 15-18 (3 fpt, 5 spt). Nicaea WF set to #9 (2 fpt, 3 spt). Caesarea WF set to #5 (3 fpt, 1 spt). Slider set to 80% Research, 20% Tax (11 bpt, 0 gpt). Worker #3 (from Constantinople) S. Worker #1 N. Worker #4 (from Caesarea) S. Curragh SE-S and stops.
2230 BC: Writing research complete, start Philosophy. Adrianople expands to Pop 3. Adrianople WF set to 3-7-8 (1 fpt, 5 spt). Slider set to 30% Luxury, 70% Research (8 bpt, -2 gpt). Worker #3 starts irrigation at Constantinople #5. Worker #1 and Worker #4 start mine at Caesarea #5. Worker #2 NW. Curragh E-E-E (suicide!!!). Sold Writing to Japan for Iron Working. Sold Writing to Sumeria for Masonry and Mysticism. Sold Mysticism to the Hittites for 35 Gold.
2190 BC: Constantinople completes Worker (shrinks to Pop 1, Expands back to Pop 2), starts Temple. Adrianople WF set to 3-7-20 (1 fpt, 4 spt). Slider set to 20% Luxury, 80% Research (11 bpt, -2 gpt). Curragh E-S. Contact with Egypt. Sold Mysticism to Egypt for 60 Gold. Curragh SW. Worker #5 (from Constantinople) SW-S-W. Worker #2 N.
2150 BC: Adrianople completes Settler (shrinks to Pop 1), starts Warrior. Nicaeae completes Warrior, starts Curragh. Caesarea expands to Pop 2. Adrianople WF set to #3 (2 fpt, 3 spt). Caesarea WF set to 5-8 (2 fpt, 2 spt), as a third shield from the forest would simply be wasted. Warrior in Nicaea forts. Worker #5 starts mine at Nicaea #8. Settler (from Adrianople) S-S. Worker #2 N-W-N. curragh S-SE-E. Alphabet sold to Egypt for 60 Gold. Slider set to 100% Research (14 bpt, -2 gpt).
2110 BC: Workers complete mine at Caesarea #5. Worker #2 joins Worker #3 in irrigating Constantinople #5 (done). Worker #3 S. Worker #1 and Worker #4 start road at Caesarea #5. Settler founds Varna, connects incense. Varna WF set to #2 (1 fpt, 2 spt). Varna starts Warrior. Curragh E-S-S. Contact Russia.

STATUS
5 Cities, 4 Warriors, 5 Workers, 33 beakers toward Philosophy, 1 luxury (incense) hooked up, 2 granaries. Other than what you can see, that's the story.

[Dominae]

Originally posted by Arnelos
2590 BC: Mt. Fujikillyouall in Japan has erupted.

That's a nice level of detail, Arnelos. Let's see if you can keep it up throughout the entire scenario!


Dominae

[Arnelos]

Originally posted by Dominae
That's a nice level of detail, Arnelos. Let's see if you can keep it up throughout the entire scenario!

I have absolutely no intention of keeping it up. I really only did it for the first part of the game so that someone like you could note anything that might be more efficient than what I did (since I didn't really use E_T's spreadsheets to plan ahead or anything, just did what seemed wise at the moment).

[Dominae]

Hope you're up for a couple of constructive criticisms, steven8r:

Originally posted by steven8r
T1: Settle on the spot. WF fish. Research Pottery @ 50% (didn't matter if I upped it to 100%, still same amount of time.)

Putting Science at 50% on the first turn is a bad move 99.9% of the time. In Civ3, you either want to do either all-out research, or all-out capitalism. Obviously you cannot leave your Science slider at 100% for the entire game, because you've got citizens to keep happy and improvements to upkeep. But in general if you're researching a tech yourself, you want to have very little gpt income.

So, now, why put the Science slider above 50% if this does not reduce the time it takes to research it? As Cort Haus pointed out above, it's the amount of Beakers that determines how fast a tech is completed, not the amount of turns. As your cities grow and your Workers build Roads, your Commerce output increases, and consequently so does the number of Beakers you put toward research each turn. The displayed number of turns to complete a tech is a very misleading measure, because it could go up or down based on what your Beaker output is at any given turn. This is why, in the early=game, switching a Laborer from a high-Commerce tile to a low-Commerce one will result in halving the estimated research time for a tech; you did not jump forward in time, you're just producing more Beakers.

If this sounds complicated, here's the basic rule: if you want to research a tech, always put your Science slider as high as it will go without getting into serious debt (or unhappiness problems). On the very first turn, you should always put it at 100%.

T8: 19f 9s, Woops, it looks like I'll waste 2 Food, but come-out OK on Shields. I just remembered, I WILL loose some Shields due to Gov'r assigning extra WF before he goes into Worker. DOH!! (Perhaps I misunderstood Ducki's 'Balance' thingy.)

I'm not sure I really understand ducki's "balance thingy" myself (sorry ducki). If you've got a tile that produces 3 Food per turn (here, the Fish), there's only a couple of ways you can fill the Food box from size to size 2 without wasting any Food. Here they are:

3*6 + 2*1 (7-turn growth)
3*4 + 2*4 (8-turn growth)
3*2 + 2*7 (9-turn growth)

Any other way of doing it wastes Food (I just said that): for instance, if you work a 3 Food tile for 5 turns, you might as well work it for 6 turns, because you've got 5 = 3 + 2 Food left to go.

Where am I going with this? Of the three methods above, I would: stick with the first one whenever possible because it offers the fastest growth rate; use the second one when I want to avoid wasting Shields and need those Warriors ASAP; never touch the last one.

As you can see, I'm a big fan of growing my cities as quickly as possible. IMO, if you're going to micromanage anything in your games, micronomage Food.

T14: 16f 8s, WF -> Cow, Worker1 (7) to BG. Growth and Warrior in 1 turn.

Typically you do not want to your cities to display that they're going to grow and complete a build on the same turn; this is bad:

Constantinople: 1
Warrior: 1

This is because whenever a city grows you always get one or two extra Shields from the new Laborer; when your city is producing a Food surplus, the Governor will typically select a Forest or other high-Shield tile, which gets you 2 Shields you were not expecting. You waste these if your city is producing 2spt before growth and has 8 Shields done on a Warrior build. So if you want to micromanage production, try to take these precious "free" Shields into consideration.

T15: Growth, Warrior Complete, start Barracks as Prebuild for Grainery (Pottery in 3). Gov'r assigns Forrest to new citizen, other citezen WF -> Forrest to boost Shields. Increase Lux to 10%, Sci @ 90%. Hopefully this will keep that 2nd pop happy enough to allow me to explore some more territory. Warrior goes N to explore.

T16: Riot in Constantinople! OK, 10% Lux WON'T keep 'em happy!

Barring Barbs and other civs messing with your plans, you can always ensure that your cities will not Riot by checking the F1 screen at the end of your turn. If each city has at least as many Happy Faces as Unhappy ones, you will not get any Riots. Conveniently, you adjust the Luxury slider in the F1 screen, so you can tell right away how much you need to keep your populace happy (and never more than that!).

---

Overall, I think you're doing pretty good. At least you're thinking about your actions, which goes a long way in helping you learn all this stuff. Keep it up!


Dominae

[E_T]

Did I hear someone say spreadsheets??

Wow, You really know that you've had an influance, when you start seeing AU posts that use your WF designation system.

/me thinks that this might earn him a spot in the HoF.... naaaaa



E_T

[Cort Haus]

Originally posted by Arnelos


I have absolutely no intention of keeping it up. I really only did it for the first part of the game so that someone like you could note anything that might be more efficient than what I did (since I didn't really use E_T's spreadsheets to plan ahead or anything, just did what seemed wise at the moment).

Arnie, E_T - what are these spreadsheets? I think I might want one, whatever they are.