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Old March 3, 2004, 09:21   #31
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Do we look good if we are in position ready to strike the turn of the vote?

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Old March 3, 2004, 10:38   #32
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The next turn 2159 we send out our advance troops. Drones turn 2159 they will start the attack. Then our turn 2160 we start our attack.
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Old March 3, 2004, 16:48   #33
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Sweeeet.

Please please please post some screenshots.

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Old March 3, 2004, 20:54   #34
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Quote:
Originally posted by HongHu
There is no problem that they would want to do this. Now do they have the ability to surprise attack us? If they do attack us then we have every reason to start war against them.

ps. Mead, I have not got your turn yet. Would you please post the upload link in the forum?

I'm working on the upload.

I finished the turn but I am having problems with the upload.

Remember the trouble I had with getting the turn downloaded a few months ago.


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Old March 3, 2004, 22:04   #35
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Oh, and since it seems OctavianX didn't post this. Some friendly banter in #Apolyton:

Quote:
* laurentius has joined #apolyton
* laurentius does the cyborg dance
Octavian_X> hehe
laurentius> 1 week from here
laurentius> i hope we arent at war by then
* settler2 has joined #apolyton
* settler2 has quit IRC (Quit: settler2)
Arnelos> I doubt they'll be a war.
laurentius> why so arnelos?
Arnelos> :shrug:
Arnelos> people are bickering at each other, that doesn't necessarily mean they're about to FIGHT
Arnelos> hell, go look at the Civ3 inter-team games...
laurentius> im too afraid to..
Arnelos> the sheer amount of mud slinging is just phenomenal
laurentius> im already having nightmares with PBs flying
* Join_ACDG_CPU has joined #apolyton
laurentius> hi maniac
Join_ACDG_CPU> Hi
* laurentius has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
* laurentius has joined #apolyton
Arnelos> laurentius... you want to see mud slinging, make a visit to the PTWDG forum and check out the "Spite and Malice" thread
laurentius> btw
Arnelos> it's burried a few months, but you can find it... that's probably one of the worst ones
laurentius> unortho told about the mud slinging
Arnelos> ah, yes
Arnelos> there are a lot of threads like that in that forum
* settler2 has joined #apolyton
* settler2 has quit IRC (Quit: settler2)
Octavian_X> Comrade Arnelos does speak the truth.
laurentius> nice to hear that
laurentius> boy we were already starting to build PB and nerve gas pods..
laurentius> oops
Arnelos> lol
laurentius> did I just say that?
Octavian_X> hehe
Join_ACDG_CPU> What are you guys talking about?
laurentius> were taling about my nightmares
laurentius> with tass flying on a planet buster missile to heaven
Octavian_X> lol
laurentius> where he belongs to
We probably need some form of stance on what members should say if comments are made in chat channels by CyCon members about the possibility of a war. Personally, I think we just sorta shrug off the possibility as unlikely, but perhaps continue to be a bit obnoxious about the Planetary Council resolution.
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Old March 3, 2004, 22:07   #36
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btw... I should mention here that I think it's pretty clear that CyCon knows we're about to attack. Our Planetary Council motion, I would guess, has killed most of what would have existed in terms of a strategic element of surprise. They know we're coming.

Hopefully, however, we can preserve an operational element of surprise... the timing and nature of our attack being secret until CyCon is already hit.
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Old March 3, 2004, 22:56   #37
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Quote:
Originally posted by Arnelos
btw... I should mention here that I think it's pretty clear that CyCon knows we're about to attack. Our Planetary Council motion, I would guess, has killed most of what would have existed in terms of a strategic element of surprise. They know we're coming.

Hopefully, however, we can preserve an operational element of surprise... the timing and nature of our attack being secret until CyCon is already hit.
Indeed, they know we are coming but they do not know when, I believe we still have the element of surprise on our side, or at least as you say the operational element of surprise.
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Old March 3, 2004, 23:18   #38
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They may just think its a big bluff.

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Old March 4, 2004, 00:39   #39
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Just try to give them the impression that the Hive is a big mess inside and nobody really knows what we are going to do. (which is half the truth anyway isnt' it )
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Old March 4, 2004, 00:42   #40
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...but I'm banking on them getting ready for an invasion. Hopefully we can blindside them.
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Old March 4, 2004, 06:52   #41
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With the current debate about the status of the PEACE faction in the vote, I had to chime in on the issue.
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Old March 4, 2004, 11:17   #42
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Quote:
Just try to give them the impression that the Hive is a big mess inside and nobody really knows what we are going to do. (which is half the truth anyway isnt' it )
I'm doing that RIGHT NOW

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Old March 4, 2004, 15:04   #43
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Oh and tell them that we think THEY are going to surprise attack us. That is also the truth isn't it.
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Old March 4, 2004, 19:16   #44
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Can anyone get the Drones to vote on the Council resolution? That will lend legitimacy to our cause.
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Old March 4, 2004, 19:30   #45
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I told the CyCon it was just RP.

They WILL be surprised.

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Old March 6, 2004, 02:53   #46
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Hmm...

This should be interesting. I'm sorry, but it appears the original intent of this motion to have been clouded. I feel, at this point, we should be demanding the immeadiate return of all PEACE bases, along with some other outrageous demands involving the handover of techs by the CPU to PEACE.

Of course, I don't know if you, Chairman, were planning another course of more subtle action. My suggestions only stand if our plan is to still ignite war between Hive-Drones and the CPU as soon as possible.
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Old March 6, 2004, 06:00   #47
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I'd say let press on them for cease fire and negotiations and then we can attack and surprise them.

We dont have to be nice, we are the hive!
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Old March 6, 2004, 16:22   #48
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If they are willing to cease fire then PEACE can live a little longer. However we will do whatever according to plan.
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Old March 6, 2004, 18:01   #49
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Quote:
by Maniac
PEACE talks part I
Greetings Chairman Voltaire, Ambassador Jamski and Former Operator t_ras,

(My message was too long so I had to split it in two)

Despite what I assumed after Octavian X posted his Planetary Council thread, it seems that the Hive would not yet have decided whether or not to declare war with CPU, and thus that diplomacy isn't yet pointless. Therefore I would like to react on a chat Voltaire had with Drogue, of which Drogue posted a summary in our private forum.

To begin with, apparently Voltaire feels the CPU upsets the balance between Hive, Drones and us, that you feel threatened and that CPU wishes to destroy the Hive. I would ask why you think so? At first, what can be more balanced than three factions of roughly equal power? Second, this year the Drones have become more powerful than the Hive and probably CPU, thus technically you should feel more threatened by them. Third, despite asking numerous times, I still haven't received a reply as to why some Hiveans think CPU has aggressive intentions towards the Hive and would want to destroy you. I'd say it's the opposite: we have the impression the Hive wants to destroy us at all costs, while we just want live in peace and safety now our archenemy PEACE can no longer threaten us.

Another point Voltaire mentioned is that a lot of this tension would have come from Hive feelings that some CPU members are anti-Hive, and that Voltaire thinks I am not pro-Hive, and so is scared that with me being Prime Function CPU is likely to go to war against the Hive.
First, if you think some CPU members are anti-Hive due to the 3D roleplay, I'd say it's just that: roleplay. Also a lot of that roleplay is not the consequence of CPU members supposedly wanting to attack the Hive (as our poll this year on whether or not to declare war on you shows), but instead of the Hive breaking pact and all your other anti-CPU actions.
Second, I'm not per definition pro or anti any faction. I just pragmatically judge who is willing to cooperate with us and base my opinion on that. So how do you expect me to think about the Hive if I offer a Hive-PUT pact, tech trades and ask what caused the bad Hive-CC relations lately, and the reply I get is a severance of the Hive-CC pact and Hive cooperation with our enemies? I'm perfectly willing to cooperate as much as you want with the Hive, but the initiative lies in your court: we have made repeated attempts to cooperate; it's the Hive that keeps refusing.

End of Part I

PEACE talks part II
I suggest we move to the issue of PEACE. Below is my proposal. The main line of this proposal is CPU security and safety.

1> We have the ability to eliminate PEACE. But we are willing to allow PEACE to survive, as long as they aren't in our immediate vicinity. Our security concept can't allow a hostile faction remaining in our immediate vicinity. I guess the Hive destroying all Angel defences in Conshelf 57 and the remaining PEACE ship taking that base is the best possibility.

2> Crossbone Way comes under CPU control or is deconstructed voluntarily by PEACE.
Just like you can't tolerate a CPU base on that island near the Hive mainland, we can't tolerate a PEACE base in the middle of our sphere of influence.

3> CPU, Hive and PEACE should agree to the sphere of influence I proposed in the Council thread:
quote:
(32.46), (34.40), (36.38), (42.38), (43.37) and the two islands between those coordinates become a demilitarized zone.
Everything northwest of that is Hive/PEACE territory, and everything southeast of that is CPU territory.
Any unit of any faction which trespasses the DMZ or enters the territory of the other faction, is considered in violation of the treaty and may be destroyed.


4> We will retreat that colony pod from the DMZ island mentioned above as soon as possible, and not found a base there.

5> Hive and PEACE should withdraw their units as soon as possible from our sphere of influence as described under point 3.

6> No new CPU/Hive/PEACE bases can be founded within 16 squares of an existing CPU/Hive/PEACE base.

7> The Hive should show signs to be more willing again to cooperate with CPU, meaning for example a re-signing of our pact (the best way to ensure no one has hostile intentions towards each other) or a trade of technologies. That way we have a reason not to give in to the requests of the Angels to declare war on you.

8> If PEACE survives, the main advantage you get is a free vote in the Planetary Council. We would like assurances you won't abuse that. Therefore we propose a CPU veto right on all Council motions except all the official in-game ones. This is to prevent you can propose any motion in the out-of-game Council you want, and CPU being outvoted 3 to 2 every time. I would propose a similar veto right for the Hive and Drones to make things equal.

If your intention is not to destroy CPU, but really only is your own security, this seems to me a good deal for the Hive. So I hope you will see the rationality in it and accept it.

I should also mention there is a growing group of CPU members (me among them - I don't really care if we win this game - second or third is good for me as well) who, if you declare war on us, want to surrender immediately to the Drones and support them gaining a solo victory. CPU wouldn't win this way, but at least we'd probably end the game with our faction more or less intact, and we wouldn't have to spend months fighting for a lost cause.

Friendly greetings,

Mani Alpha-3

i wanted to confused him a litle to gain time so i answered this :
Quote:
RE: PEACE talks part II
at first sight looks good. but dont quot me, i'd have to talk to the others.

any way I AM concerned about CPU unification and the military posibilies of that
if we're planning to begin war this turn it doesn't matter, but if he'll still have a turn first we might as well be positive and say yes.

PS:
with his mention of surrendering to drones he has just made me think diferent about merging drones and hive...just some thing to think about (and better do it fast).
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Old March 7, 2004, 00:23   #50
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Well this goes without saying but their request is outrageous. They expanded through war while others peacefully occupies whatever land it had before. Then they want a DMZ on that so they can sleep on their new land without worrying anybody get it back.

And then they want a CPU veto on any motion. I mean what else can you do other than to laugh at that? If you guys can keep the talk for one more turn if we are not ready to strike yet that's good, but don't show them that we are so easy to be bullied.
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Old March 7, 2004, 00:33   #51
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if we're planning to attack any way and we're just doing it to gain time it doesnt matter.
if we do need this extra turn thn jumski or voltair will have to do some extended talking wiht them and PEACE and meaby even "begin" all the procces as requested by CPU.
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Old March 7, 2004, 00:34   #52
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Quote:
Originally posted by HongHu
Well this goes without saying but their request is outrageous. They expanded through war while others peacefully occupies whatever land it had before. Then they want a DMZ on that so they can sleep on their new land without worrying anybody get it back.

And then they want a CPU veto on any motion. I mean what else can you do other than to laugh at that? If you guys can keep the talk for one more turn if we are not ready to strike yet that's good, but don't show them that we are so easy to be bullied.
They are buying for time to Kill us. The more time they get to be closer to choppers and drop, and the more time they get to start making use of all their new bases, the more likely our defeat.

Attack now.


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Old March 7, 2004, 00:43   #53
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i agree, attack now!
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Old March 7, 2004, 00:50   #54
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You need to persuade buster about that. I don't want us to go in alone and risk lose all of our force to an enemy probe. If you are sure that we don't have that risk, then by all means attack.
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Old March 10, 2004, 10:49   #55
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*bump*

I should mention that I was chatting with MrWhereItsAt, a CyCon member (who is on several of my Civ3 DG teams), about Civ3 ISDG issues and the conversation strayed to the ACDG for a short period. I intentionally dropped into the conversation that I thought that Voltaire's Planetary Council motion was stupid. I did so in order to cury favor and hopefully give the impression that the issue of hostility between the Hive and the CPU was not yet a done deal (the objectives lined out earlier in this thread regarding the impression we should be making toward the CyCon). It seemed to have the intended effect, as MrWIA related that his team was worried that their military campaign against the PEACE had probably raised jitters among Hive and Drones more than they had thought about while they were busy gobbling up PEACE bases. They would very much like to avoid a war. The statement by me was truthful, seeing as I really don't think it was wise to do the planetary council motion... of course, MrWIA does not need to know that the reason for my opinion is that I felt it blows our surprise rather than that I or anyone else in the Hive actually want peace with CyCon. He can come to his own conclusions and obviously did.

Apparently, MrWIA, with the joyous hope that perhaps the Hive might be ammenable afterall, posted a short snipet of that piece of the conversation to the CC forum. This apparently sent Tassadar into an epileptic ceisure and he yanked MrWIA's post and closed the thread. He then apparently went ballistic at laurentius for the CyCon trying to solicit information from Hive members again (the history of which Kody filled me in on several days ago, btw... so I know about that).

When I got a chance to explain the situation to Tassadar, I think he realized relatively quickly that the situation was not what he thought it was. To begin with, MrWIA was not trying to solicit information from me for the purpose of getting me to make critical leaks - not only does he have more integrity than that, but he knows me well enough from other DG's that I'm very good at that game. Secondly, I knew exactly what I was doing. As I put it to Tassadar, if there's a sneaky b*stard between MrWIA and myself, it's undoubtedly me and not him.

Point is, since I happened to be in chat with him and the ACDG happened to come up, I figured I'd just keep up what it seems that Jamski and I agreed in this thread was the right line to take: Be as friendly as possible with CyCon members you happen to talk to until the war actually starts.
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Old March 10, 2004, 18:09   #56
Frankychan
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Location: Back in Hawaii... (CPA Member)
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Hmmm,

Things are starting to sound very interesting. I like how you "politick" Comrade Arnelos. But despite Almighty Comrade Tassadar's removal, I think the seeds have been sown for mass confusion.

I also agree that the CPU proposal is utter nonsense. They decide to gobble up the territory of another faction, and when they have their fill, want to change the rules so none of US do what they did. That's crap. I think the CPU opened up the floodgates and weren't aware of the flood it would cause (mainly, the Drones and Hive wanting a piece of THEIR territory).

Point is, so long as the Drones get their share and we get ours, then the rest of their political babble is nonsense.
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