Another happy evening of multiplayer

[Atomic Dogg]

<center><table width=80%><tr><td><font color=000080 face="Verdana" size=2><font size="1">quote:
<img src="/images/blue1.gif" width=100% height=1>
</font><font size=1>Originally posted by deity on 01-11-2001 03:51 AM</font>
So, most noble finbar, you feel that it may be in the best interest of your civ for AH and I to remain at loggerheads

I mean, that sounds like a fair and balanced solution LOL


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That's Realpolitik baby! Looks like a fair situation, I wouldn't make anyone move anything....just stare down the barrel at each other! Makes for an interesting game.

And I never voted for that toffy-nosed Alexander Downer either I'll have you know....

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-Atomic Dogg is Lowang
-You no mess with Lowang!
-Finbar is A. Downer's Highschool sweetheart

[Hydey]

Why doesn't AH just use his mighty diplo force to encourage Deities Horseman to defect to the way of the Horse empire.

That done, finbar, Lowang and Myself can sit back and watch the fire works.

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I'm Australia's nuclear cop
I am the real Troll
A.H. is a nice guy

Interesting, the peaceful civs of the world wish a continuation of the cold war
Maybe AH and I should change tack..... LOL

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*deity of THE DEITIANS*
aka: half-assed dieticians
icq# 8388924

Bah! He calls his city "AH for Brekkie" and puts forces right next to one of my cities, "Peaceful Horse", after refusing to remove a unit that was wandering around well behind my borders for several turns and then claims I did something wrong?

I think its clear who the aggressor is here should war break out. Deity should remove his horse to show his good intentions. I don't care what the history is, keeping military units right next to someone else's city is a very unfriendly and provocative act.


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Chaos, panic and disorder - My work here is done.

Keep the OT sticky thread free!!

deity accepts the decision of the world leaders.
AH may keep his city on that pot of gold... and Captain Deiticus remains on his horse, nearby... within the city radius of "AH for Brekkie"

Fair nuff

WE will live in peace...

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*deity of THE DEITIANS*
aka: half-assed dieticians
icq# 8388924

There has been no such decision. I told you I occuppied the longitude that "Peaceful Horse" is now on and you agreed. This was long before you established that city. Therefore your forces should be no farther forward than the longitude your city is on.

Fair is fair Deity. Your civ is much stronger than mine. Why do you need to threaten me as well? Withdraw please.


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Chaos, panic and disorder - My work here is done.

Keep the OT sticky thread free!!
<font size=1 face=Arial color=444444>[This message has been edited by Alexander's Horse (edited January 11, 2001).]</font>

[finbar]

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<img src="/images/blue1.gif" width=100% height=1>
</font>&lt;font size=1&gt;Originally posted by Alexander's Horse on 01-11-2001 05:17 PM&lt;/font&gt;

I think its clear who the aggressor is here should war break out. Deity should remove his horse to show his good intentions. I don't care what the history is, keeping military units right next to someone else's city is a very unfriendly and provocative act.

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Guess who's been into the Parliamentary Library and found the Little Golden Book of Diplomatic Bluffing? What you're cheerfully ignoring - and why not? all grist for the verbal fisticuffs - is that his horse is in his territory, albeit within your city radius. Ergo, your city squares are in his territory, ergo, technically, and in every other way, you have breached the agreed border. Be that as it may, you and Deity have a good old-fashioned stand-off and it's injecting some life into this otherwise moribund forum. Keep it up.

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Founder, ACS Pedantry Institute
Founder, ACS Gourmet Recipe Exchange
Troll & Hydey Wrangler
Mono Rules!
#33984591
<font size=1 face=Arial color=444444>[This message has been edited by finbar (edited January 11, 2001).]</font>

Yes but finbar, consider this - Deity had neither cities nor units in the region when we agreed on that border, whereas I had units guarding it, at the point where "Peaceful Horse" now is, and on the hill in front of "Forward Horse!". He moved all the units in and established his city LONG AFTER the border was agreed - and just to annoy me too. Following his logic, I should be able to put units right next to his city too. I might add I immediately withdrew a unit which would have prevented him from establishing that city when the border was agreed!

Also, his city is using the fish on MY SIDE of the border. So his city radius is lapping over MY territory just as much as mine is over his

I suggest a compromise - what I object to is the military units. If he puts a diplo on that mountain instead of the horse, withdraws the 2 horse, one of which is OVER the border, and agrees not to fortify the mountain, then I will consider the mountain demilitarised and let him continue to use MY FISH. I will also withdraw my diplo.

I think that is very fair

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Chaos, panic and disorder - My work here is done.

Keep the OT sticky thread free!!


<font size=1 face=Arial color=444444>[This message has been edited by Alexander's Horse (edited January 11, 2001).]</font>

[finbar]

Where exactly is/was the border? A line drawn down through Peaceful Horse, through the water, through the hill square with what looks like coal outside Forward Horse?

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Founder, ACS Pedantry Institute
Founder, ACS Gourmet Recipe Exchange
Troll & Hydey Wrangler
Mono Rules!
#33984591
<font size=1 face=Arial color=444444>[This message has been edited by finbar (edited January 11, 2001).]</font>

<center><table width=80%><tr><td><font color=000080 face="Verdana" size=2><font size="1">quote:
<img src="/images/blue1.gif" width=100% height=1>
</font>&lt;font size=1&gt;Originally posted by finbar on 01-11-2001 08:44 PM&lt;/font&gt;
Where exactly is/was the border? A line drawn down through Peaceful Horse, through the water, through the hill square with what looks like coal outside Forward Horse?


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Yes, that's right. The coal square is mine too, the longitude line is the border. Deity moved into the area after the border was agreed. Also, I told deity I was ocuppying the longitude "Peaceful Horse" is now on before we agreed on that border, so as far as I'm concerned all his units should be West of that line i.e. no further East than the longitude line his city is on, which I didn't know existed till he posted that map

He is just playing games, but it is a good example of how he tries to incite wars whilst preserving his "spotless rep".

I guess he just wants to try and achieve what makeo could not. But the Horse Empire will not bow to dieters

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Chaos, panic and disorder - My work here is done.

Keep the OT sticky thread free!!
&lt;font size=1 face=Arial color=444444&gt;[This message has been edited by Alexander's Horse (edited January 11, 2001).]&lt;/font&gt;
<font size=1 face=Arial color=444444>[This message has been edited by Alexander's Horse (edited January 11, 2001).]</font>

That's right finbar, Peaceful Horse (Ha!) is on longitude 62. WE had agreed that this was the border BEFORE he built there.

I believe we both discoverd the area around the same time; it's just that we didn't realise it at the time. Don't forget my horse was far into AH's territory, which he kept whinging about, so I obviously had found that land much earlier but I didn't send a settler there as he did. We've not exchanged maps.

It is true that he withdrew his units from West of 62 as I did East of 62. I was slower than him to do so because of terrain and his stupid units kept boxing me in (deliberately) so he could complain in the world forum!
If his city stays there my military units remain - a mountain each...

And yes, instead of me building a city on that pot of gold I chose a nearby location for "AH for Brekkie"


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*deity of THE DEITIANS*
aka: half-assed dieticians
icq# 8388924

Your view of this is such Cr*P!

I TOLD YOU I was already occuppying the 82 longitude when you agreed to the border. That horse was of yours was a latecomer, I've been in that area since shortly after the barbs got your diplo some centuries ago (remember that? You didn't know I saw that).

The idea that you can have a longitudinal border and have units from both sides on the same longitude is absurd, and you know it

Do the right thing Deity, withdraw the horses.




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Chaos, panic and disorder - My work here is done.

Keep the OT sticky thread free!!

<center><table width=80%><tr><td><font color=000080 face="Verdana" size=2><font size="1">quote:
<img src="/images/blue1.gif" width=100% height=1>
</font>&lt;font size=1&gt;Originally posted by Alexander's Horse on 01-11-2001 09:56 PM&lt;/font&gt;
Yes, that's right. The coal square is mine too, the longitude line is the border. Deity moved into the area after the border was agreed.
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It is clear that AH recognises the BORDER as longitude 62. A border is a border. It is a line separating civs. If one civ chooses to OCCUPY that border it is clearly to the disadvantage of the other civ and deity believes this is quite a provocative act.

Captian Deiticus is getting most angry with this dialogue but deity will attempt to appease him by praising his patience and encouraging him to gain the very best reputation in world circles by acknowledging world opinion.

Also, would the world please note that the Alexander Horse Empire has more military units than any other civ. And way more per city.

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*deity of THE DEITIANS*
aka: half-assed dieticians
icq# 8388924
<font size=1 face=Arial color=444444>[This message has been edited by deity (edited January 11, 2001).]</font>

Wrong, wrong, wrong! I told you I was already occuppying the longitude and you agreed. That of course means is it MY territory. That is what "Occuppying" means Your terrirory starts with the longitude line your city is on. This is so bleeding simple.

Come one Deity, got off my land. Actually there isn't much military advantage for you in your current dispositions (if you knew the whole picture). It just harms your rep

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Chaos, panic and disorder - My work here is done.

Keep the OT sticky thread free!!
<font size=1 face=Arial color=444444>[This message has been edited by Alexander's Horse (edited January 12, 2001).]</font>

[finbar]

Gee, our very own Mark Phillipousis -v- Pat Rafter, writ small.

Guys, as with all such debates involving personal agendas and disputed history, there won't be a solution. You two will go on bickering till the game drops off the agenda. Fair enough. It's amusing most of us. And keeping this otherwise moribund forum alive.

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Founder, ACS Pedantry Institute
Founder, ACS Gourmet Recipe Exchange
Troll & Hydey Wrangler
Mono Rules!
#33984591

AH, How is it harming my reputation when I'm prepared to abide by world opinion and you are not?

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*deity of THE DEITIANS*
aka: half-assed dieticians
icq# 8388924

<center><table width=80%><tr><td><font color=000080 face="Verdana" size=2><font size="1">quote:
<img src="/images/blue1.gif" width=100% height=1>
</font><font size=1>Originally posted by Alexander's Horse on 01-11-2001 10:15 PM</font>
Your view of this is such Cr*P!
The idea that you can have a longitudinal border and have units from both sides on the same longitude is absurd, and you know it

<img src="/images/blue1.gif" width=100% height=1></font></td></tr></table></center>

I couldn't agree more
I'll move the horsies if you move the city!

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*deity of THE DEITIANS*
aka: half-assed dieticians
icq# 8388924

<center><table width=80%><tr><td><font color=000080 face="Verdana" size=2><font size="1">quote:
<img src="/images/blue1.gif" width=100% height=1>
</font>&lt;font size=1&gt;Originally posted by deity on 01-11-2001 10:48 PM&lt;/font&gt;
AH, How is it harming my reputation when I'm prepared to abide by world opinion and you are not?


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What world opinion? Certain "world opinion" has already made clear that they would dearly love for us to go to war so that we get bogged down in a war whilst they continue their development. What weight would you put on that?

You should keep the Horse empire happy. You may need us later

And in other games I might add, one in particular springs to mind


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Chaos, panic and disorder - My work here is done.

Keep the OT sticky thread free!!

<font size=1 face=Arial color=444444>[This message has been edited by Alexander's Horse (edited January 12, 2001).]</font>

<center><table width=80%><tr><td><font color=000080 face="Verdana" size=2><font size="1">quote:
<img src="/images/blue1.gif" width=100% height=1>
</font>What world opinion? Certain "world opinion" has already made clear that they would dearly love for us to go to war so that we get bogged down in a war whilst they continue their development. What weight would you put on that?

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I think the unanimous decision by worlds leaders is fairly clear - I don't move my horse and your city stays is what they all said!



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*deity of THE DEITIANS*
aka: half-assed dieticians
icq# 8388924
&lt;font size=1 face=Arial color=444444&gt;[This message has been edited by deity (edited January 12, 2001).]&lt;/font&gt;
<font size=1 face=Arial color=444444>[This message has been edited by deity (edited January 12, 2001).]</font>

[Atomic Dogg]

Youv'e got to love games where you lose the connection...hot rejoin and find yourself in charge of the barbarians!

Got to have a look at the entire map....then I come back i and my keyboard is frozen....then everything goes nutz!

Sorted out....back in the flow.....what a strange worl we live in

The trouble I apparently have caused however however seems rather unjustified with the lackluster competition I apear to be presenting being last on the powergraph!


Would have been funny to have human barbs

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-Atomic Dogg is Lowang
-I rule the Barbarians!

[Atomic Dogg]

Oh now Hydey of the Japanese thinks I am responsible for his loss of 5 cities to barbarians!

It's not what you think Hydey! I didn't do it! I'm innocent! I want my Lawyer!

After AH asked who had attacked Hydey the exchange went something like this....lowang 13/01/01 12:38 AM which civ is Hydey?

hydey: 13/01/01 12:39 AM the one that looked after you

lowang: 13/01/01 12:40 AM not me by the way

lowang: 13/01/01 12:40 AM hehe.....I've been nice....I hope the ai didn't attack you in my absence

hydey: 13/01/01 12:41 AM I remember not taking your vacant city for 3 turns do not forget it

lowang: 13/01/01 12:42 AM I sent every barb on goto hydey's civ lol!

hydey: 13/01/01 12:44 AM just for that I will crush Lowang first before I crush the rest of you

lowang: 13/01/01 12:44 AM HAHAHA! just kidding! take it easy lol

hydey: 13/01/01 12:45 AM no I will crush you like a bug

lowang: 13/01/01 12:45 AM just kidding folks

lowang: 13/01/01 12:45 AM ooooh dems fighting words

lowang: 13/01/01 12:47 AM you lost 5 cities to barbs?

hydey: 13/01/01 12:48 AM yes, defended with 2 vet archers

lowang: 13/01/01 12:48 AM my god! i was stunted in this game by barbs capturing two of my cities earler on

:roolleyes: I'd worry more about those barbs than starting a war with me....we both have better things to do. For some reason when I was barb leader I couldn't see or control any units or cities...all I could see was the entire map of terrain.

I'm struggling badly in this game, but all I can say is...when you feel the ground trembling means I'm taking over your neighborhood!

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-Atomic Dogg is Lowang
-The Evil Empire...Coming to a City near You!

testing and bumping...

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*deity of THE DEITIANS*
aka: half-assed dieticians
icq# 8388924

[Rasputin]

As an impartial observer I think the following points are relevant.

A border was agreed of longitude 62. AH believes that the border is actually the line to the West of the Longitude 62 squares, Deity beleives that the Squares were the actual border. The problem is that the Longitude 62 actually runs at 45 degrees not vertically. So a border of longitude 62 would not be as descibed by AH as a line running directly south of Peaceful horse, but a line running SE of Peaceful horse through the jungle , East of the Fish AH claims are his and also well east of Forward Horse... So a greater issue is raised... If the official chat logs reveal that border was agreed at longitude 62 , then AH is correct in keeping his city at Peaceful Horse, and Deity is correct in keeping his horses statioen d where they are as they are west of Longitude 62, But the city of Forward Horse is well West of longitude 62 and so therefore is in violation of the agreement.

To make this situation ease, I beleive that the two antagonists should agree on a new border , with Peaceful Horse being disbanded and rebuilt on Hill to south/East on edge of lake, this will Give AH access to utilise the fish within his borders and still keep use of the Gold mountain, then a new border running directly south from Gold mountain through the lake and down through the coal west of Forward Horse. Deity to move his two horses back west of longitude 62, but he can move his other horse to a position west of Forward horse.. Both sides should then withdraw any utilisation of squares on the other civs side of the border... Both sides may maintain an army in readiness but must be placed on their own side of border... Units next to citys on border wil lnot be treated as acts of war, but utilisation by city workers of squares across border will...

This is of course just my opinion but seems to me to be a fair solution

[Hydey]

No they should commence a 1000 year war.

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I'm Australia's nuclear cop
I am the real Troll
A.H. is a nice guy

Raz, the 62 line is a vertical line through the city and the coal. I checked the map.
I think you suggestion is a good one, one I'm willing to abide by.
Make 62 the DMZ. No cities, no units.

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*deity of THE DEITIANS*
aka: half-assed dieticians
icq# 8388924

I agree if the 61 longitude is the DMZ. As I said when the border was agreed, it was on the basis that I was already occuppying the 62 line with border troops. I have deployed and settled cities based on that agreement, which Deity made before he had any troops or cities deployed in the region.

Deity can keep his city on the 61 line but must not put forces in the field or fortify that line. Neither will I.

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Chaos, panic and disorder - My work here is done.

Keep the OT sticky thread free!!
<font size=1 face=Arial color=444444>[This message has been edited by Alexander's Horse (edited January 13, 2001).]</font>

<center><table width=80%><tr><td><font color=000080 face="Verdana" size=2><font size="1">quote:
<img src="/images/blue1.gif" width=100% height=1>
</font><font size=1>Originally posted by Alexander's Horse on 01-13-2001 10:14 PM</font>
I agree if the 61 longitude is the DMZ. As I said when the border was agreed, it was on the basis that I was already occuppying the 62 line with border troops. I have deployed and settled cities based on that agreement, which Deity made before he had any troops or cities deployed in the region.....

<img src="/images/blue1.gif" width=100% height=1></font></td></tr></table></center>

errrrr, How come I had horsies there and occupied that mountain? Surely you would have occupied it if you were there first!
Plus, I had a horsie deep inside your territory, which you whinged about incessantly.... So, I had to have BEEN there long ago!

I think it's very easy in civ to find land, think you are the first to discover it, not realising that it was on another civ's map already.

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*deity of THE DEITIANS*
aka: half-assed dieticians
icq# 8388924

[Rasputin]

i stand corrected always though the grid was done the other way never payed too much attewntion ...

The Horse empire is bored by this whole imbroglio with the Deiticians. We have made 2 good compromise proposals, both ignored. We have nothing further to say on the matter.


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Chaos, panic and disorder - My work here is done.

Keep the OT sticky thread free!!

... thus continueth the Cold War

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*deity of THE DEITIANS*
aka: half-assed dieticians
icq# 8388924