Are you going to buy CTP2?

quote: Originally posted by Tical_2000 on 10-31-2000 07:54 PM When you settle for less, you'll always be dissapointed.

and you when always seek perfection, you'll always be dissapointed....

[Maccabee2]

Dear MarkG, guide on our journey to a better game, where we all tell our stories: (Sort of like The Canterbury Tales, aren't we).
You say those who seek perfection will be disappointed; this is true. However, you have misdiagnosed the patient. In fact, neither we nor our views are ill. We do not seek perfection; we seek $40 (or the equivalent) worth of improvement over CTP1. This is a reasonable expectation. Each must decide for himself what his $40 are worth. However, if people have invested time and creativity in answering Activision's requests for input, disappointment is a healthy response to their requests going unfulfilled. It's not the software engineers against whom we complain. It's the beancounters and marketing conjurers against whom our ire seethes. The setters of deadlines are about as well-loved as an opponent's slavers.
I seem to remember someone stating that only a few hundred people expressed the desire for MPG, hotseat, etc. Any marketing college freshman knows that one voice expressed represents thousands of voices unexpressed. Go do the math.
Oh, one last plug for MPG. It allows our children to play the game with us, developing future customers for TBS games. In four years, my daughter wil be working full time, with money to spend. Tell that to your marketing gurus who don't think MPG is worth the time. They know the future of TBS is shaky at best.
Just food for thought.

from your post, i'm keeping this

quote: Originally posted by Maccabee2 on 11-02-2000 06:35 PM Each must decide for himself what his $40 are worth.

[Nemo]

quote: i'm sorry, but i havent seen you doing any kind of modification on ctp, i dont see you doing it for ctp2 either.

i dont see how that is relevant - and its is not very fare. i haven't posted any of my modifiactions to the site, and i have spent >= 20 hrs understanding/modifing those damned files to make the game playable/balanced

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"Programming is like sex: one mistake and you have to support it for the rest of your life."
-Michael Sinz

[Narck]

Silly question. Of course I'll buy the game as soon as it comes out

I just hope it will keep my attention for a longer period of time than CtP 1 managed to.
Ideally, it'll keep me busy until civ3 comes out

I also hope they fixed that annoying mouse problem.

[jbs]

Ok Mark, by the end of this month you will receive the mod I have been working on since JUL 1999 for over a year. I am still in the process of completing all the GL links which has been taking me the better part of four months, plus my own QA. I had hoped to have it done months ago, but it is only a hobby for me. I will release it at the end of the month in whatever state it is in and let the community if they choose to play it point out any bugs that I didn't catch or fix. Then I will study if for three months and release a patch. It includes over 90+ new technologies, new improvements, new units including all the graphics and text files. A lot of which I stole from other mods if it fit or I thought it was a good idea. The documentation includes proper credit. Also FYI, through the end of 1999 I posted the results of much of my analysis, some of which was incorporated into other mods. I received zero credit, probably because I usually don't post more than one message on the subject, and other people took my information and expanded it into more depth. I have never complained because it was never important, but I guess I have to have a track record of posts to be considered seriously. This explosion of posts from me is because I care. I truly want a good CTP2. I am trying to put pressure on the marketing folks at Activision to not release the game early like they did with CTP1 because that will do the Civ community more harm than good. You don't agree, but the personal attacks are uncalled for. I thought you were better than that!

[jbs]

The only reason I am complaining is because I am a Civ addict. Yes 3+ months after the release with the second patch and after numerous user modifications, CTP has become a good game. I do not want to go through the pain and work (nor should any customer) of redesigning a flawed game to make it playable. For me the bar was raised for CTP2 and I have much higher expectations. So far the indications are that CTP2 will be like CTP1 upon release. How many people can truthfully say that the released version of CTP1 was a good game. I wanted a good CTP2 and am very disappointed and mad that the indications are another substandard game.

quote: Originally posted by jbs on 11-03-2000 12:15 PM I do not want to go through the pain and work (nor should any customer) of redesigning a flawed game to make it playable.

i'm sorry, but i havent seen you doing any kind of modification on ctp, i dont see you doing it for ctp2 either.

quote: How many people can truthfully say that the released version of CTP1 was a good game

the people who vote "Yes, if it is in the same state CTP1 was on its release" in the "CTP2: Delay if buggy?" poll....

[Sprayber]

Even though it would probably be smarter to wait, and
Even though I could probably spend the $40 wiser, and
Even though my girlfriend will hate me for spending so
much time playing a "stupid history game"

I'll buy it as soon as I can. I might wait a week to see some comments on it, or until my girlfriend goes out of town.

you're thinking the right thing jbs, because of CTP1, I feel that CTP2 will only be worth pirating. Activision placed that on themselves.

It's not right to sell things that aren't worth the money it's asking for.

If I find that CtP2 really is good, then I'll consider buying it.

quote: Originally posted by jbs on 11-03-2000 07:07 PM Ok Mark, by the end of this month you will receive the mod I have been working on since JUL 1999 for over a year.

i'll be waiting it for it...

quote: Also FYI, through the end of 1999 I posted the results of much of my analysis, some of which was incorporated into other mods. I received zero credit, probably because I usually don't post more than one message on the subject, and other people took my information and expanded it into more depth. I have never complained because it was never important, but I guess I have to have a track record of posts to be considered seriously.

i'm sorry, but i cant seem to find what you are referring to...
i did find a report on a pollution related bug...

quote: You don't agree, but the personal attacks are uncalled for. I thought you were better than that!

fact 1: you have barely posted in the ctp1 forums
fact 2: you have never released a mod
fact 3: you practically implied that you went through the "pain and work of redesigning a flawed game" in the case of ctp1

what do you expect me to say?


Nemo,

i'm sorry but 20 hours of modification is "customization to my own likings" in my book. i can accept it if someone from the people who worked in the creation of CD's mod, the Apolyton Pack or the Medieval Mod say "I redisgned a flawed game"(although i will disagree on the "flawed" part )

[red_jon]

quote: Originally posted by MarkG on 11-04-2000 04:10 AM [QUOTE]Originally posted by jbs on 11-03-2000 07:07 PM fact 1: you have barely posted in the ctp1 forums

Gaaaaaaah! Looks like MarkG is monitoring us closely

I wouldn't say that CTP1 is a flawed game, just some parts of it (that have since been modified with patches/mod packs).

And forgive my supreme ignorance, but what does OT stand for/mean?



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...And if the British Commonwealth and its people live for a thousand years, man will still say "this was their finest hour"- Winston Churchill.

quote: Originally posted by red_jon on 11-04-2000 03:09 PM Gaaaaaaah! Looks like MarkG is monitoring us closely

checking someone's profile to see that he has 48 posts isnt very hard...

[Narck]

quote: Originally posted by red_jon on 11-04-2000 03:09 PM And forgive my supreme ignorance, but what does OT stand for/mean?

If you click on the link it wil take you to a thread in the Off Topic forum