i am angry!!!!no city view?!

ZENMASTER · November 10, 2000, 07:56

what the F*** does it mean no city view
so why st. swithin led us on?!
you are doing it again activision

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WHAT IS LIFE AND WHERE DOES IT COME FROM?
GOI-FONG-TZA ZENMASTER

Tiberius · November 10, 2000, 08:24

I think Activision told us about the "City Screen" and NOT the "City View". It's not the same thing.

Anyway, I miss the old Civ1 City View

Ralf · November 10, 2000, 10:46

Personally, i couldnt care less about the city-VIEW. It was a static picture that was basically identical for each and every city of the same size. After i looked at it a couple of times, there was no "news-value" in it anymore.

What i want is some means of checking out what units, city-improvements or wonders any indevidual city have already constructed. A picture of each tab of the city-manager would be nice.

Also: I actually *like* micro-managing, and i *never* build queues. Does the appropriate window for that nothing-more-to-build city pop up automatically? MUST i use these queues?

[This message has been edited by Ralf (edited November 10, 2000).]

Dida · November 10, 2000, 11:20

quote:

Originally posted by Ralf on 11-10-2000 09:46 AM
Also: I actually *like* micro-managing, and i *never* build queues. Does the appropriate window for that nothing-more-to-build city pop up automatically? MUST i use these queues?
[This message has been edited by Ralf (edited November 10, 2000).]

Well, that's you not everybody else. We probably don't have as much time and patient. and I'm sure you have missed a lot by not using the queues.

Ralf · November 10, 2000, 11:37

quote:

Originally posted by Dida on 11-10-2000 10:20 AM
Well, that's you not everybody else.

Dida, i didnt imply that playing hands-on, without using the queue-system was the "correct" (or "best") way to play the game.

All i did was asking a question.

ZENMASTER · November 10, 2000, 14:19

well i can personally tell that winnie lee talked about it and if you look at first five gspy pictures
(a.k.a the first one) you can see a city view tab

------------------
WHAT IS LIFE AND WHERE DOES IT COME FROM?
GOI-FONG-TZA ZENMASTER

November 10, 2000, 14:32

quote:

Originally posted by ZENMASTER on 11-10-2000 01:19 PM
well i can personally tell that winnie lee talked about it and if you look at first five gspy pictures
(a.k.a the first one) you can see a city view tab

if you're talking about this screenshot, "view city" is probably a different text for "city manager". see a latest screenshot

Pintello · November 10, 2000, 16:00

Hi MarkG,

Actually what they are talking about was the screenshot that showed the city squares map in the upper left hand corner. In the rest of the box you had options to assign workers and things like that. I also think there was a way to work on the build queue. It was not a city view screen a la Civ2. It was more a city management screen. If I had to quess, I would say that you get to it by right-clicking on a city from the main map.

The screen shot in question is found at this URL: http://www.pcdome.hu/preview/calltopower2/index.html

Timothy Pintello
[This message has been edited by Pintello (edited November 10, 2000).]

JimMac · November 10, 2000, 16:23

Edit:Redundant post!>Pintello/Ralf found it I think.
[This message has been edited by JimMac (edited November 10, 2000).]

Ralf · November 10, 2000, 16:39

Thanks Pintello: that tip gave me some info about the screen that relocates the city-area workers.

MarkQ: The Build-manager has a button in the lower left corner called City-manager. The City-manager is a multi-tabbed screen:

http://apolyton.net/ctp2/images/view...w/day3-ics.jpg

What i want to know is: How do i know what city-improvements/wonders any indevidual city already have constructed, and what units guards that city?

Is there a tab with all the already constructed city-improvements/units listed, for that indevidual city? I suspect the inventory-tab and the unit-tab.

My God! Many, many screens within screens, and tabs, tabs and tabs.

Why couldnt they have the already-constructed lists and the what-to-build-next queue-lists in one and the same screen? Why did they had to have this equaly vital info two clicks deep and away from each other?

----------------------------------- edited:
It seems that the production-tab contains what-to-build-next, and the inventory-tab contains (i believe) already-constructed items. Only one tabe away from each other.

But *why* so many tabs? - why so many clicks? Was it really necessary to split up the info in as many tabs as possible?

Im somewhat confused here by the entangled way the CTP-2 team have chosen to design the interface. I hope i get unconfused after i played the game a couple of times.

[This message has been edited by Ralf (edited November 10, 2000).]

Pintello · November 10, 2000, 17:16

Hi Ralf,

Thanks for the complement. I have gone back and looked at CTP2's Asset pack and I noticed two screenshots were of variations on the City Manager. In both screenshots there is either a tab or a button labled "Inventory." I would guess that that is where you look to see what has been built in a given city already.

Timothy Pintello

November 10, 2000, 19:01

yes, that's what the inventory tab shows

Tical_2000 · November 10, 2000, 23:01

Whats the big deal? If you want to see a city, book a helicopter ride and tour your hometown. What a whiner!

Atahualpa · November 11, 2000, 01:33

Cool down man!

Dida · November 11, 2000, 01:52

quote:

Originally posted by Atahualpa on 11-10-2000 12:33 PM
Cool down man!

Hey, don't be so serious, we only discussing some CTP issue here. No Bush nor Gore, don't worry.

Chronus · November 11, 2000, 11:08

Hmmmm ... I'm a little concerned about the interface myself. Ralf pointed out the "screens within screens" and many tabs which kind of annoys me. I enjoy CTP but my greatest complaint is how difficult it is to get something done. Introducing the game to a Civ-lover friend of mine resulted in failure because he had to wend his way through multiple tabs to view the information he needed. In a nutshell, this is a good way to deter new players.

I thought I read somewhere that a simple, one city screen (similar to Civ2) was available as an option. MarkG, if you read this, can you verify? Thanks, in advance.

November 11, 2000, 11:40

quote:

Originally posted by Chronus on 11-11-2000 10:08 AM
I thought I read somewhere that a simple, one city screen (similar to Civ2) was available as an option. MarkG, if you read this, can you verify? Thanks, in advance.

nothing like that. the City Manager has 5 tabs. see the 4 of them
http://apolyton.net/ctp2/images/view...y4-cityman.jpg

it all depends on how much you want to micromanage. for example, on my current game the only micromanagment i do is to not use the mayours and do the build queues myself(which is done via the Build Manager). i very rarely have to use the City Manager

DarkOrder · November 11, 2000, 14:14

There is a city manager. In this window you can select the build menu which allows you to build units, buildings/improvments, and wonders. The rest of the stuff in the city manager are sorted through with tabs. There is an imropvemnets window (shows what buildings/improvements your city has), a specialists window (where you can set citizens to specialize in city happiness, food production, commerse(gold), science, and production. There is also the state of your city window that shows how happy your people in that city are and if they receive any bonus (+1 if you build a shrine) or negatives(-1 from pollution). To change cities there is a popdown city seletor (has arrows as well) that allows you to change quickly from one city to another.

There is no city "picture," you will be too busy keeping your cities running smoothly to need such a thing. Mayors are okay, but your cities will grow faster if you don't use them. I found using them only acceptable if I had more than 10 cities and suddenly went to war. The problem is, the mayor may take fifteen turns to create a city wall, instead of a samuraii. You can go straight to the build manager of a city without opening the city manager.
The fastest way to grow your empire:
1. build at least 5 settlers as fast as possible.
2. have a settler settle on a rich piece of land (15 Food, !5 production, 10 commerce), rivers through plains are ideal, with good land next to them.
3. Allow for expansion, don't put all fof your cities right on top of each other. This takes away from the resources being gathered.
4. Put all citizens into food production until your city is size 7 or you need units.
5. build food tile improvments as soon as they become available (farms or nets).
6. Make sure you leave a military unit to defend your city. Nothing worse than a barbarian wandering into an unprotected city and taking it over.

Any other questions

Chronus · November 11, 2000, 15:43

Is the player still allowed to assign keys to particular tabs and commands? I've been assuming all along that this feature is still there but I thought I'd ask anyway.

CTP was far more bearable when I was able to set up these hot keys myself (the defaults are painful to even think about). One nice feature about CTP was scrolling through the cities with a keystroke (not the mouse). I'm not aware of that feature in Civ2.

Slax · November 11, 2000, 16:02

DarkOrder - You have all the answers....Umm...Who the heck are you and why do you have all the answers?

DarkOrder · November 11, 2000, 16:05

I am a cyber ninja. Didn't I say that in another post already? Now if I can just evade those damn Marines. They blew my torso off last time and it was a real mess getting it put back on. (*sneaks away*)

Smooshies

[This message has been edited by DarkOrder (edited November 11, 2000).]

Ralf · November 11, 2000, 16:11

quote:

Originally posted by DarkOrder on 11-11-2000 01:14 PM
You can go straight to the build manager of a city without opening the city manager.

DarkOrder: I have only two easy-to-answer questions that would make all the difference in the world:

- If i click (double-click?) any of my cities on the map; what manager pops up? The Build-manager or the City-manager?

- If theres nothing more to build in one of my cities; what manager pops up? The City-manager for that city, or the overall build-manager?

If you (or anyone with 100% knowledge) can answer that, it would be great.

DarkOrder · November 11, 2000, 16:21

well I will try:

If i click (double-click?) any of my cities on the map; what manager pops up?

The City-manager

You can select the build manager from the city manager at any time. I think it is easier to think of the managers as national. You can select between cities while in a manager very easily. So with a few clicks you can change from city build manager in city 1-** and set them all to build a building or unit.
You can access the build que for a specific city from the tabs UI as well.

Ralf · November 11, 2000, 16:35

quote:

Originally posted by DarkOrder on 11-11-2000 03:21 PM
The City-manager

Great! That was the answer i wanted to hear! Now, if the city-manager *also* pops up automatically if theres nothing more to build in any single city - that would be even better. Correct?

Thanks, the other info was also reassuring. Perhaps i ranted to early about that interface. I must try this game out properly first, before i comment any further on the interface.

November 11, 2000, 18:49

quote:

Originally posted by Ralf on 11-11-2000 03:35 PM
Now, if the city-manager *also* pops up automatically if theres nothing more to build in any single city - that would be even better.

it doesnt
you get a message in the message tab and the name of the city on the map turns yellow

btw, as darkorder said, double-click on a city gives you the city manager. right-click on a city gives you a menu with the following: city manager, build manager, rename city, activate all units and several other commands...

and of course, almost all(if not all) screens have a (editable) keyboard shortcut

Ralf · November 11, 2000, 19:29

quote:

Originally posted by MarkG on 11-11-2000 05:49 PM
it doesnt
you get a message in the message tab and the name of the city on the map turns yellow

...And the map automatically re-centers on that City with the yellow-coloured name, RIGHT???

If it does, its OK!

November 11, 2000, 19:39

quote:

Originally posted by Ralf on 11-11-2000 06:29 PM
...And the map automatically re-centers on that City with the yellow-coloured name, RIGHT???

if you have auto-cycle turned-on, it will center to the city at the end of your turn

Ralf · November 12, 2000, 01:45

quote:

Originally posted by MarkG on 11-11-2000 10:40 AM
it all depends on how much you want to micromanage. for example, on my current game the only micromanagment i do is to not use the mayours and do the build queues myself(which is done via the Build Manager). i very rarely have to use the City Manager

Well, for those who mainly moves around units outside the cities in order to conquer the world, that perhaps OK.

But for us who wants to take a civil perfectionist approach, and who actually enjoy seeing each of our cities grow with constantly added city-improvements and more, the CTP-2 five tabbed city-manager roundaboutly hidden within build-manager seems to be oncomming bad news. ):

One thing could save the situation somewhat: Is there a way to *bypass* that build-manager alltogether and have the that city-manager automatically popped up instead?

Its not the end of the world with that five tab City-screen - i just dont understand the design-logic behind this. Why not put all info in these tabs under ONE directly overviewable city-screen?
After all, they have upgraded the game to use up to 1280x1204 screen resolution, for crying out load. Most of us use 1024x768 wich should be more then enough.

There seems to be many nice features in CTP-2 that the Firaxis-guys could use as good examples.

How to present the game-backfeed in as instantly overviewable ways as possible, and with as little tab- and button-clicking/screen-manoeuverings as possible, is however NOT one of those features.