Huge World Comparison Game

[Scouse Gits]

I thought you warmongers might like this.
It is a huge world, you start on a moderate sized continent with no local goody huts. No restrictions (except no cheating) weapons free enjoy yourselves. (You should play as the Carthaginians.)
Should anyone feel that OCC is playable in this sort of scenario the best (IMO) site is to the West of the starting position.
Zipped scenario file here.
Unzipped Scenario & Text files - download both into the same directory.


I shall try to use this post to keep track of results as they come in.


OCC
1855 Tom DeMille AC
1868 Huey AC
1881 Aurelius AC
1894 vik AC

ICS
1670 DaveV Conquest


Perfectionist


Other
1770 Smash Conquest
1800 oedo Conquest



____________
Scouse Git[1]

"CARTAGO DELENDA EST" - Cato the Censor

[This message has been edited by Scouse Gits (edited March 29, 2000).]

[War4ever]

ah but Steve with these new comparison games, you and i should have a blast clobberin civs These are right up our alley

------------------
It's clobberin time!!
- The Thing from the Fantastic Four

[Steve Clark]

Hey War: You play that Zulu comparison game yet? Seems like everyone took the compassionate route, I started clobberin' as soon as I could (you know - make peace, then clobber them). Haven't had time to finish it, got 2 or 3 more civs to destroy. Won't be a problem.

I just don't if I'll have the time for this new map though. Let me know how and what you did.

[Paul]

I'll give it a try when I have finished OCC fortnight 4 and DaveV's game.

[War4ever]

hey Steve..... no i havent' tried the zulu game as i haven't had the time either perhaps this weekend.. sunday ... then i am giving this new scenario a whirl ...... what did you think of my new sig?

------------------
It's clobberin time!!
- The Thing from the Fantastic Four

[Steve Clark]

War: Love it

[crowatbitemedotcom]

Sounds good SG. I'll try it this weekend.

Exactly how big is this 'huge world'?



------------------
Will everyone stop bloody quoting everyone else in their signature damnit. - Graag

[Steve Clark]

Oh great, I hope it doesn't have anything to do with Big Huge Games.

Looks like we'll be playing CivII and its scenarios for a very, very long time.

[Vespasian]

quote: Originally posted by Scouse Gits on 03-03-2000 10:11 AM I thought you warmongers might like this. It is a huge world, you start on a moderate sized continent with no local goody huts. No restrictions (except no cheating) weapons free enjoy yourselves. (You should play as the Carthaginians.) Should anyone feel that OCC is playable in this sort of scenario the best (IMO) site is to the West of the starting position. Zipped scenario file here.

Zip? The curse of the Macintosh lives on.....


------------------
"On ne peut pas apprendre la chance si on n'est pas hardii."-Napolean

[Smash]

I'm on a MAC and had no problems.Dropstuff 4.5 decompresses zip files to hqx which can then be decompressed with stuffit.If you can make it into a simpletext document then you can play it by putting it in the appropriate folder and and selecting "begin scenario"There is a READ ME with the game

I decided not to allow myself Marco polo's Embassy to try and make it tougher.
I'm about half way up the spindle.Going for conquest as I thought that might be the hardest way to win on this map.2 civs down(sorry War4ever,you were first)Mongols took out one for me.So 3 down 3 to go.

Many cities allready which is a bit of a pain so I built Mich's and SOL and went Commie to minimize micro-managing.Great Library,Magellan's,Lighthouse,War Academy,Leo's and Gardens(for early deity expansion problems) also built.Shake's and the Oracle(still effective although I have only 1 temple in my capitol) captured.

Right now my army consists of muskets,knights,crusaders,diplomats and many,many caravels.Going for Steam Engine and Super Ironclads next.Seems late(around 1300AD) but I have only encountered phalanx,archers and the odd legion so far

Managed to build a route thru the first land mass by building adjacent to a 1 square inland lake and a 3 square inland lake.3 cities (Port A,Port B and Port C) did the trick.I really hope I don't have to do that again.It continues....
[This message has been edited by Smash (edited March 04, 2000).]

[DaveV]

SG1 - I'm in, though it will take me a while to slog through a huge map. Cute job on the text file, by the way...

[Scouse Gits]

Thank you all for showing the interest - I must shamefacedly admit that the Spindle is a slight modification of a map that beat me a month or so ago. Sounds as if you have the bull by the horns, Smash, may it continue.
Good hunting

------------------
____________
Scouse Git[1]

"CARTAGO DELENDA EST" - Cato the Censor

[Tom DeMille]

SG1, neat map, although I didn't explore much of it. I tried it in OCC mode, just for the heck of it, and found myself prospering. I wanted a seaside city square for sending those caravans out by sea, so ended up in a three special north east of the starting location. It was a pretty good site - I maxed my population out to 28, a few more than usual - I think the extra scientists helped to compisate for lack of a special.

Anyways, I landed in 1855 (no log), having only met the vikings (alliance) and aztecs (kept peace). I beat the AI to all the OCC wonders. I lost a few turns by sloppy tax/science management, and a few more when the Aztecs discovered Flight just after I discovered Automobile (I had just gifted them combustion - maybe I'll stop doing that ) It was touch and go during spaceship construction too. I had a barbarian uprising 5 squares away (riflemen and artillery). I quickly built a tank, but it died before I had cleared the barbarians out. They pillaged a mine, so my production fell below 80. With pollution every turn, my engineers were busy (I had disbanded my settler to rushbuy the powerplant - doh). And then I ran out of food (and lost both engineers). Still, by this point I had discovered fusion power, and was churning out 300 gold a turn of revenue, so I was able to keep rushbuilding the spaceship (I would build a temple (160 gold) and then switch to structural to complete it in one turn), only loosing a few turns. I did end up with rather a lot of pollution, the threat of global warming, and a loss of 6 or seven population, but I figured this was a small price to pay to get my spaceship done.

[Scouse Gits]

Tom, I take my hat off to you. I really did not think the map was OCC viable.

________________
Scouse Git[1]

"CARTAGO DELENDA EST" - Cato the Censor
[This message has been edited by Scouse Gits (edited March 07, 2000).]

[oedo]

Awesome map!
I even completly forgot about our multigame . Sorry Dave and Carolus, this won´t habben again.

To the game: I established a science city first and let the other cities produce almost only caravans. I built a lot of wonders (HG, Colossus, Lighthouse, Marco Polo, Copernicus, Shakey´s, Mike´s, Leonardo, INC, SoL), before I started the crusade. So I didn´t play a real warmonger strategy. After I built Leo´s (1180AD), I started cranking out horsemen, and ´waited´ until they were transformed to chavalry (1420). Conquering was pretty easy since no AI civ wasn´t even able to discover gunpowder (I think the vikings once stole it, but they couldn´t trade it to another AI anymore). The first city I captured was Trondheim in 1420. The last city was Moscow in 1800.

I made a savegame each turn (maybe I forgot one or two), so I should be able to create a game log. This, however, will take some time.
[This message has been edited by oedo (edited March 07, 2000).]

[Smash]

Its now 15 something and a large scale invasion of Mongolia is underway.I was a little dismayed to find they have GP and walls in most cities.5 or 6 cities have been liberated by the Carthaginian Freedom Force(CFF)Dragoons have stalled out.So.I built a ton of catapults before Metallurgy.But Mongols muskets must be vets cuz Karakoram survived an 8 cannon 6 dragoon blitz(built a fort next door and loaded it up).I've decided to reinforce and consolidate what gains I have made while I rush dragoons for awhile.90% of Tactics is researched.I have switched to 0 science and max tax.(80% under Commie)Several cities are under seige.I have 10 cannon and 10 dragoons in that fort next to the capitol.At least 6 vet muskets in that city.Loading more in just before Tactics when the CFF will try to crush the capitol once again

Diplommat attacks are taking down everything but the walls I want.Unfortunately I was only able to build about a dozen vet ironclads before some civ discovered Magnetism.Wish I had embassys then.I had alot of gold and could have rushed more..oh well.

Thankyou for making a route thru the 2nd landmass!I control the passage way(more or less) and a special advance detail has been sent to set up an operations base in Russia and Babylon.These civs seem to behind military wise.Scouse Gits(1) of Russia tributed 1000 gold.Thats a record for me.


CFF #s
72 riflemen
77 dragoons
42 cannon
8 ironclads
37-galleons
8-diplomats left

Even with some mega ship chaining it takes along time to shuttle reinforcements up to the front.

I have 40+ cities now and turns are taking 30 minutes+.Its hard work co-ordinating a large civ(40+ cities is alot for me nowadays) and a large military.No cities with aquaducts so no happy problems with Mich's and Commie martial law.It would really been a nightmare if I had to watch for disorder.Now I can run thru my cities every 4 or 5 turns instead of every turn.I know its costing me a little but the heck with it.

CCF military strategists predict total victory by the 17th century.We shall see.Come too far to quit now.Hasn't left me time for the "fortnight occ" which looked interesting.

I'm getting the feeling ya get sometimes when you are building a jigsaw puzzle.Something like"Man! this is torture.But I must finish.Just one more piece.Now just one more.....one more...ok.. one more...thats it last turn...well one more quick one...."

[Tom DeMille]

quote: Originally posted by Smash on 03-07-2000 02:42 PM I have 40+ cities now and turns are taking 30 minutes+.Its hard work co-ordinating a large civ(40+ cities is alot for me nowadays) and a large military.

Gee, it took me only 4 1/2 hours last night to finish this map in OCC.

Go babylonians!

[Smash]

hehe I wonder how your city would do if the CFF stumbled across it

[Scouse Gits]

I think this is where I came unstuck - I simply had not made sufficient allowance for the sheer size of the world.
I had 40 very sleazy cities on the home continent and another eight on the polar cap and other bits before I even started the "Drang nach Norten" - pushing 70 cities by the time the Vikings bit the dust and reduced to 2 turns an evening!
I threw in the towel at about 1730 having just reached the equator and feeling inclined to do something else before the end of the millenium...

------------------
____________
Scouse Git[1]

"CARTAGO DELENDA EST" - Cato the Censor
[This message has been edited by Scouse Gits (edited March 08, 2000).]

[vik]

I OCC'd it, too. i got to AC in 1894, but I didn't keep a log.

I was surprised at how far ahead in technology I was. I had always heard that large maps are a detriment to OCC players. Based on this game, and other random large map games I played after this, I no longer believe that is the case.

I headed immediately West for that OCC site you recommended. I was sad to see it was landlocked, but luckily, I got to bribe a barb trireme pretty early, and actually established my first trade route at around 300 bc.

I initially thought the map was screwed up. I knew it was a large map, but as I was exploring the eastern part of my island, I saw the western part sitting two squares away. That was kind of wierd to get used to that. I suppose if you picture this "world" in three dimensions, it would amount to a pencil. Pretty neat.

After exploring the Viking island, I just left my diplomat up there to bribe any other ship I could find, but all I found was an (egyptian? i dunno, it was yellow) settler. No boats to bribe. Later in the game, an ironclad from a country I hadn't met yet came up and blew my diplomat away.

The only country even close to me in technology was the vikings, and that is because of all the tech gifts I gave them.

Pretty fun, and nice work on the little text box. It looked strangely familiar to something I have seen before....

At first I didn't want to play this one (not much of a warmonger ) but when i read Tom did it OCC-like, I couldn't let this one go.

I founded my city at the recommended OCC site without checking if it had access to sea. Felt like pre-Paul times when I bribed a Viking trireme and later a Caravel. I also built Marco Polo's and allied with everyone but the Mongols. Good thing too, I made tons of gold from gifts. A few turns before I landed on AC the Vikings sneak-attacked but by then I had fortified armors in place and a stealth fighter to pick of spies. I couldn't grow bigger than 23 and managed only twice to get an advance in 2 turns
Oh yeah, landed in 1868.
Great map, only complain is that I couldn't trade with anyone but the Vikings...

[Smash]

Its now late 1600s and I finally finished off the Mongols.The ais in my game are alot more advanced than others so far.They have formed an alliance against me and as a result they all have Gunpowder,Leadership and Industrialization and have had so for along time.The heathen Russians recently stole Amphibious Warfare so I can expect the Babs and Ruskies to have marine defenders.

back to the Mongols.They put up a strong resistance,as you would expect any civ lead by Ming to do.I spent alot of time sabotaging to get walls.Had em in every city save 2 or 3.Vet muskets behind walls can take a beating.


Mongol casualties(taken just before last city sacked)
12-settlers
59-musketeers
35-elephants
35-dragoons
46-catapults
5-galleon
5-frigate
7-ironclads
2-transports
2-dips
1-caravan
1-explorer


My total casualties so far

1-musketeer
1-alpine troop
6-rifles
1-horseman
1-crusader
21-knights
43-dragoons
51-cavalry
24-cannon
1-galleon
1-frigate
6-ironclads
4-transports
5-dips
1-explorer

4 more wonders captured
Eiffel Tower-whoopee
KRC-expired the turn after capture
Pyramids-well,something
Cope's-no science in this game

Moving on the 2 remaining civs.Russians 14 cities-Babs 8 cities.I'm really hoping they aren't as entrenched as the Mongols were or it may take awhile yet.Then they'll hide 1 city on me.....

[Smash]

Bad news from the front!The remaining ais have Communism.PARTISANS.I don't know how the ais have gotten so advanced.Just the 1 tech stolen and I have shared nothing.The workload just increased.Why didn't I just stay small and play the scientist?

[Scouse Gits]

Smash - I like a few spies to bribe partisans, especially if they are a distance from the enemy capital. Buy the units on hills and mines - you sometimes need a battleship to deal with one on a mountain!
----------
SG (2)

[Smash]

Thats the problem.The ais are Democracy right now and since I'm fighting in their backyard when they do change governments partisans or any unit for that matter costs a fortune.600 for 1 partisan just doesn't seem worth it.Good news though I have Espionage and walls are coming down much easier now.

[Smash]

it has ended.Last city(Moscow) conquered in 1770.Thanks to the advent of Espionage,Machine Tools and the ai railroading everywhere I was able to conquer the Babs and Russians much faster than the Mongols despite partisans.

At the end I had 70 cities and over 400 units.yikes!

Final Casualties
2-muskets
7-rifles
2-alpines
1-partisan
1-marine
1-horse
1-crusader
21-khnights
43-dragoons
88-cavalry
30-cannons
12-artillery
1-galleon
1-frigate
6-irons
3-destroyers
2-cruisers
1-sub
5-transports
5-dips
1-explorer

score:1600 208%

Petrina the Magnificent


a strange map led to an epic conquest game

[Scouse Gits]

Congratulations, Smash it sounds as if you did exactly what I wanted to do - but failed - and the scenario played as I had hoped with the more perfectinist civs able to get well dug in in the North whilst the early warmongers slowed you down in the South

------------------
____________
Scouse Git[1]

"CARTAGO DELENDA EST" - Cato the Censor

[DaveV]

I'm in the very early stages still, but I can't sit idly reading other peoples' posts any longer! After three 1-hour sessions, I'm at 475 BC, I've just built MPE, and it's time to play "Let's Make a Deal". I've already built HG, and I'm just a few turns from Feudalism and the War Academy. It looks like I should be able to trade for The Wheel, which I expect to give me enough firepower to take out the Vikings. The Vikes have already built Colossus, and are about to complete the Lighthouse. Saves me from having to build it (very evil grin)...

I'm looking forward to a military slugfest.

[Aurelius]

I see Tom DeMille has an 1850's AC date. I enjoyed NOT keeping a log and doing this in OCC fashion.

Unlike Tom and Huey, I just used the original square for my city. My early science really suffered on that Tundra, but the city grew fast.

All that Tundra forced a fast Science Path to Explosives. Takes an engineer a long time to convert Tundra to Desert and then to Plains!

My city reached the size 28 threshold and like Tom, I lost my engineers to famine near the end. Lot's of pollution but I managed to build the ship in the minimum time and built Apollo in one turn.

So 1881 is my Score...nice going Tom and Huey. Did you guy's do any interesting tech paths given the isolation?

Man, had to disband 3 warriors/1explorer and sell my colliseum to build Copernicus before my one and only contact/ally, 'War4ever' of the Vikings! And then I had to Sell my Marketplace and disband the trireme to beat 'War4ever' in completing Shakespeare's Theatre.

Only had one Rifleman defending the city throughout AD until 'War4ever' sneaked attacked--my stealth easily repelled his nasty bombers and tanks--I thought War4ever didn't like Marines?! !

Aurelius

Oh, hope more of these scenarios are in the works.

quote: before my one and only contact/ally

That's why I built Marco Polo's. I followed the "normal" tech-path, but MP made it possible to see what the other civs were researching, so I could pick something else and trade for it later. The huge amount of gifts made it possible to make up for the lost time building MP. I could practically build everything in one turn.
________________
Save the 's!