Wonders in Civ III

Andreiguy · May 24, 2001, 20:26

Does anyone have any information about the wonders that are going to be in Civ III?

Now, the only two I know of that is 100% in the game are the Pharos (lighthouse) of Alexandria because it was in the screenshot of the city screen, and the Great Canal because I believe it has been mentioned by Firaxis. If there are 28 wonders in Civ 3 (like civ 2, 7 for each of the four ages), I would make them:

ANCIENT AGE
1. Pyramids
2. Pharos of Alexandria
3. Hanging Gardens
4. Colossus of Rhodes
5. Colosseum
6. Great Wall
7. Great Library

RENAISSANCE
1. St. Paul's Cathedral
2. Chartres Cathedral OR Oxford University (can't decide)
3. ________ Castle (not sure which one)
4. The Crusades
5. Da Vinci's Workshop
6. Exploration of the New World
7. The Kremlin

INDUSTRIAL AGE
1. World Exposition
2. Newton's College
3. Darwin's Voyage
4. Great Industrialization (first to build would get a bonus in production)
5. Colonies (er...

)
6. New York Stock Exchange
7. ...can't think of seventh...

MODERN ERA
1. Great Canal
2. United Nations
3. Womens' Suffrage
4. Manhattan Project
5. Statue of Liberty
6. MIR
7. The Space Shuttle

Any ideas? Please respond if you have info or have wonder ideas of your own!

P.S. Sorry if someone already wrote about this...

me_irate · May 24, 2001, 23:08

i figure that most of the wonders will be the same as in civ2. i also believe that someone mentioned a certain amount of major and minor wonders. so this would mess up your list somewhat. As for the great canal in my opinion it should be in the industrial rather than modern age.

SerapisIV · May 25, 2001, 08:25

There needs to be more world wonders, except for the Wall of China, all of yours are European/American wonders.

Lord_Davinator · May 25, 2001, 09:22

the exploration of hte new world??? as a wonder???
I don't think so....
the indians...aztecs..incas... they wouldn't really be looking for a new world... and what of a random map?

the rest are ok but yup there are going to be minor wonders and if I am right the major wonders are going to be fewer than those in civ2...meaning that they'd have to be REALLY big wonders.

MrFun · May 25, 2001, 10:38

What is so special about exploration anyway? It's not specific only to one civilization type or culture.

Europeans were not the only ones to set out and explore! China explored the seas all the way to the coast of East Africa before the New World was visited (not discovered) by Europeans.

The Arabs had established trade routes with India since the ancient era. And the Polynesians did an impressive amount of exploring of the South Pacific during the late prehistoric era into the ancient era.

I think too many people are quick to say that exploration is only in the genes of Europeans, when history shows otherwise. So if we have such a wonder to represent this accomplishment, make it culture or civilization neutral in its GL text and graphics.

DarkCloud · May 25, 2001, 13:25

How is MIR a wonder?
... maybe the ISS- but not MIR?

Although it's a wonder it stayed up as long as it did

tniem · May 25, 2001, 16:08

Quote:

Originally posted by Andreiguy

Does anyone have any information about the wonders that are going to be in Civ III?

Now, the only two I know of that is 100% in the game are the Pharos (lighthouse) of Alexandria because it was in the screenshot of the city screen, and the Great Canal because I believe it has been mentioned by Firaxis. If there are 28 wonders in Civ 3 (like civ 2, 7 for each of the four ages), I would make them:

Pyramids is definitely in the screen shot. So that gives you three.

Andreiguy · May 25, 2001, 16:37

Quote:

How is MIR a wonder?
... maybe the ISS- but not MIR?

Although it's a wonder it stayed up as long as it did

How is MIR a wonder?

Excuse me...it was the first really meaningful outpost in space, and the fact that it DID stay up as long as it did is only another plus...actually, maybe it should be renamed to the Russian Space Project; they sent up the first animals to space, first man, first woman, the first space station and much more! These are all wonders in themselves!

Quote:

Pyramids is definitely in the screen shot. So that gives you three.

Ok...thanks! so we have 3...

Mokael · May 25, 2001, 16:53

actually four -- u got your piramids and Lightouse in the screen shot, and Firaxis definately menionted ability to place Great Canal and Great Wall on the map.

Captain · May 25, 2001, 16:54

I don't think events should count as wonders of the world. Wonders should be some kind of building, monument, or something material/tangible.
I know Civ 2 already had several wonders which were more event-like, such as women's suffrage and darwin's voyage, but they never really 'gel'd as well. perhaps they could have certain "feats" of wonder that when performed give a certain bonus for a certain time or speeds up a process. (e.g. Magellan's Expedition = boosts overall happiness by 5% for 20 turns, Women's Suffrage = raises overall culture level faster, the Reconquista = makes all current units vets)
I've heard ctp had something like this but i've never played it. anyone familiar with it?

what should definitely be out are those fictional wonders, like sun tzu's war academy which never really existed.

Captain · May 25, 2001, 17:00

hmmm, sorry, I should've replied to the original question

I'm not sure how official it is, but someone mentioned that the wonders from civ 2 will be making a comeback so we could count all those (but maybe someone who has the original reference can correct me?)

that of course means that my ideas of non-event wonders is out, and they'll probably have some fictional ones in there again.

if firaxis is listening though, I'd like to suggest not making all the wonder bonuses civ specific - but rather to compensate for your generosity in building a wonder that benefits everyone, your civ would get a huge cultural bonus since you are so civilized that your civ is willing to share those bonuses with other civs.

Jaguar · May 25, 2001, 17:23

I think I read somewhere that there were 32...

May 25, 2001, 17:30

Quote:

they sent up the first animals to space, first man, first woman, the first space station and much more! These are all wonders in themselves!

I cannot remember if we where the first to send an animals (Monkey, Chimp) into space. They did send a dog into space twice. Yes to first man and woman, however we where the first Space Station. It was called Sky Lab. It came down in the early 80s. I saw the station as it pass overhead one night a few days before it crashed into the ocean.

SerapisIV · May 25, 2001, 17:50

Quote:

Originally posted by FireDragon
I think I read somewhere that there were 32...

No preview has said 32, any preview that gives a number says 16. No confirmation from Firaxis. Apolytoners are complaining about that though as that would be fewer then even Civ2 had.

Lord_Davinator · May 25, 2001, 21:33

I think the 16 are major wonders and the rest are most likely the minor ones.... I suspect there will be a drastic increase in the things required for the major wonders...something that would link it up to your trade.

There probably will be more minor wonders most from civ2 and a few more after all no one really benifits from these for long.

and of the wonders confirmed the Pyraminds definely would suit to be a major wonder.

the rest I are minor wonders(I'm assuming the lighthouse is also a minor wonder)

oh and one more thing It would be nice if ONLY coastal cities could build sea related wonders esp. the lighthouse and magnellas expedition.... wouldn't you say so??? Civ2 memories??

Kc7mxo · May 26, 2001, 13:18

Heh. Space stations should cause international incidents a few years after their construction. Everyone starts worrying about the dang thing landing on people. Especially those silly australians. Come on guys, it wasn't a very BIG piece of sky lab. . . .

Andreiguy · May 26, 2001, 17:01

Quote:

I cannot remember if we where the first to send an animals (Monkey, Chimp) into space. They did send a dog into space twice. Yes to first man and woman, however we where the first Space Station. It was called Sky Lab. It came down in the early 80s. I saw the station as it pass overhead one night a few days before it crashed into the ocean.

No offense, but could you actually check what you're saying before you say it? The Russians had dogs (Laika and Chaika) and monkeys in space a long time before the Americans had anything ready. You can check it in any respectable encyclopedia, library, etc. Second, the first space station was called Salyut I and was sent up years before skylab. In fact, there were several Russian space stations before Skylab.

You should learn something from this, buddy...DON'T SAY WHAT YOU DON'T KNOW.

manofthehour · May 26, 2001, 17:10

Well we know that there will be the great canal and the internet also. I hope Leonardoes workshop stay, it was the best.

SerapisIV · May 26, 2001, 22:40

The internet was still being debated by Firaxis. The preview that brought it up said that it would most likely be included, specifically giving an education bonus (research? in the end-game, not sure how useful it would be though), but that they weren't sure how to include it yet, it was still being playtested. The internet might not end up in the game after playtesting.

Inverse Icarus · May 26, 2001, 22:57

oh the huge battles that we all fought for Leos...

May 27, 2001, 01:12

Quote:

No offense, but could you actually check what you're saying before you say it? The Russians had dogs (Laika and Chaika) and monkeys in space a long time before the Americans had anything ready. You can check it in any respectable encyclopedia, library, etc. Second, the first space station was called Salyut I and was sent up years before skylab. In fact, there were several Russian space stations before Skylab.

You should learn something from this, buddy...DON'T SAY WHAT YOU DON'T KNOW.

OK you win part of it. I'm reading "Life in Space" by Time Life Book.

1957, Nov. 3, Sputnik II (USSR) First satellite to collect biological data from orbit; carried dog Laika.

1959, May 28, Jupiter (USA) First primates in space (Able & Baker): suborbital

1960, Aug. 19, Sputnik (USSR) First recovery of orbited animals from space (dogs Strelka and Belka). (I guess the first two dogs died in space).

1961, Jan. 31, Mercury-Redstone 2 (USA) First test of Mercury-Redstone fight vehicle with passenger aboard (Chimpanzee Ham): suborbital.

1969, July 16, Apollo (USA) First Manned lunar landing. First men to walk on moon's surface. Neil Armstrong, Buss Aldrin, Michael Collins; 22 hours on moon, with 2-hours-35 min. EVA. (I sat in my living room and watch the entire show). If my memory is correct the people of Russia where not aloud to watch the show.

1971, April 19, Salyut 1 (USSR) Unmanned prototype for orbiting space station and laboratory: decayed Oct. 11, 1971

April 23, Soyuz 10 (USSR) First crew to dock with orbiting Salyut 1 (5 hours 30 min) Did not go on board.

June 6, Soyuz 11 (USSR) First crew to occupy orbiting Salyut space station (22 days) because of accidental depressurization, cosmonauts died on reentry. (Salyut was the only space station prior to Skylab).

1973, May 14, Skylab (USA) First unmanned American space station; placed in earth orbit but damaged during launch.

May 25, Skylab 1 (USA) First crew to occupy Skylab (28) days; replaced thermal shield and repaired solar wing.

Somewhere in this house, I have a book if I did not give it the school where I work that has every launch that ever happen listed in it.
In the early days of space flight the Russian where sending up a lot of Rocket with space capsule on them and said over and over no body was on board, however we the U.S. never belive them, so how many Russian died in orbit before they got it right?
At my old job, the rumor was Yuri was number 3 in space.

And one last thing, since my policies is not to say a bad thing to other who post here, say it nice or not at all. You are not my buddy today or ever.

tniem · May 27, 2001, 01:16

Quote:

Originally posted by manofthehour
Well we know that there will be the great canal and the internet also. I hope Leonardoes workshop stay, it was the best.

Leonardo was the most unbalancing wonder in the game. It ruined MP games fast and allowed a good player to beat the AI every time. If it is in Civ III it needs to be balanced more effectively. The same goes for Adam Smith's.

imgod2u · May 27, 2001, 04:16

I'd certainly like to see "Viagra" as one of the Wonders

SerapisIV · May 27, 2001, 15:53

Quote:

Originally posted by imgod2u
I'd certainly like to see "Viagra" as one of the Wonders

What would the benefit be, increased hapiness? Increased birthrate? Decreased work productivity from people staying home?

imgod2u · May 27, 2001, 19:03

Yes yes, and oh God yes!!

AustralianJeremy · May 27, 2001, 19:42

I still think Magellan's Expedition should be awarded to the first civ to actually circumnavigate the world. If you've gone all the way round and popped back where you started, that should count as the wonder. A special wonder. Is that impossible to code? I reckon it would be a good early benefit for those who are quick to explore. And you could have cool races to see who can get around the world first (in eighty days or less!) It would be even cooler if there were two ancient boat types close enough to each other that if you made one move a bit faster, people would have to make the call if it was worth waiting till they developed the new tech to set out on the race, or if they'd be better to start straight away. What do you guys think?

Zanzin · May 27, 2001, 20:43

Quote:

Originally posted by Kc7mxo
Heh. Space stations should cause international incidents a few years after their construction. Everyone starts worrying about the dang thing landing on people. Especially those silly australians. Come on guys, it wasn't a very BIG piece of sky lab. . . .

rofl!! Luckily I wasn't born yet when SkyLab crashed into Oz.

datakodin · May 28, 2001, 06:14

What about obsolete wonders? I think the player should still receive some benefit from his/her wonder even after it becomes obsolete.

Really, some tourists will visit the city with obsolete wonder to see and enjoy. So, the obsolete wonders might give you some extra-trade in the city.

BTW, we have trade in Civ but what about tourism simulation?

AustralianJeremy · May 29, 2001, 22:40

Doesn't anyone like my Magellan's circumnavigation of the world idea?

May 29, 2001, 22:49

Yes a good idea. In CTP 2 the first one to go around the world received a Feat of Wonder and receive one extra tile to his/her naval movement for 25 turns.