hut knowledge - Page 2

May 11, 2000, 19:45

its my belief in the early game that you need more cities than none settlers on the board to receive one.

I have found that if i settle both settlers quickly that i receive advanced tribes or nomads much more frequently than if i have one city and my other origional none settler roaming the area looking for huts which is suicidal anyways

Ming · May 11, 2000, 21:37

I like the theory. Now, somebody prove it.

I've done some experimenting, and never considered your above approach. I've tried resetting a million times on non grass/plains and not been able to get a wandering tribe. Yet on the next turn, I was getting a wandering tribe from a different hut about 25% of the time.
I have no clue what the difference in the situations was...

You raise an interesting theory. Anybody want to test it

SCG · June 8, 2000, 18:34

quote:

8. Advanced tribes get bigger and can include improvements. Not sure on this one as to which techs cause it.

Humm ... good question.

I've experimented with this a little - not sure of the tech - might be computers.

As for the huts, I've managed random sizes from 1-4, with any combo of barracks, grainery, marketplace and library. I've heard rumors of being able to get size 8 cities (which would logically be the max possible size, due to the settler/aquaduct constraint), but i've never been able to surpass size 4.

Smash · June 8, 2000, 22:23

I noticed a pattern today while playing hotseat(crazy stuff that).It seemed you can only get 1 nomad per continent/landmass.

My mate was exploring and settling all over the large real world map.EVERYTIME he landed on a new mass he would get a nomad in the first 2 or 3 huts.Then no more.He uses it to build a city and "poof" he would get another on that land mass.Happened at least 6 times.

Course hotseat is odd.

Scouse Gits · June 9, 2000, 00:14

Opening huts before building a capital always seems sensible. No risk of barbs, and those NON chariots/archers are wonderful. The downside is the useless scroll of wisdom - not on the path to Monarchy. I have only recently realised that a scroll of wisdom before founding your capital slows down research. Alas, there is no such thing as a NON advance before the first city is in place.

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SG (2)

Jim W · June 9, 2000, 21:50

quote:

Originally posted by Canadian War Beaver on 05-09-2000 02:54 AM
let me rephrase Jim....... i mean before i have founded my first city

Don't know why it took so long to catch this. There was one time when I was in the process of building my first city when I knocked over a hut, and there was yer friendly local advanced tribe, complete with palace. I kept that captial, because it was a better place than the one I was starting.

I don't know whether or not that counts as "before founding of the first city."

Jim W

East Street Trader · June 14, 2000, 00:26

Smash

Is it worth adding to your knowledge

9. Huts on mountains never yield barbs (pretty sure anyway) and barbs from huts in Arctic/Antarctic always freeze to death.

East Street Trader

rah · June 14, 2000, 00:33

I've gotten barbs from mountains many times before.
RAH

Julius Brenzaida · September 24, 2000, 16:34

quote:

Originally posted by Smash on 05-05-2000 10:12 PM

3.You will not get technology after Invention has been discovered(not supposed to anyway)

Not exactly.
I think you cannot discover any new tech with the huts after you've reached the critical number of 24.
Check it, I am quite sure this is the rule.
So you can discover anything, as long as you don't pass over 24. I've been many times far beyond invention (up for ex. to industrialization)

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Oh Man, when will you understand that your greatness lies in your failure - Goethe

Smash · September 24, 2000, 20:39

That has not been my experience.Invention does it for me.

One of the fortnight occs(Mongols War-only-sometimes) I had more than 24 techs and still got tech from hut.Conversly I beleive at least 1 player got invention before 24 and suffered because of it.

Anybody?

I've also got barbs from mountains.In fact I have gotten barbs from all terrains.
[This message has been edited by Smash (edited September 24, 2000).]

rah · September 25, 2000, 08:37

1. Invention has always done it for me also.

2. When we were playing the non-city challange, I opened about 50 huts prior to capturing my first city and got all techs or mercenaries. (NO, cities, non-settlers, barbs) I tried the non-city challange quite a few times before I found a setup that gave you a chance at victory. (being on the same continent as an ai that builds a city on the coast). Every time the same thing happened with the huts prior. So I figured I opened over 300 huts and there were no exceptions.

RAH

The Mad Viking · September 25, 2000, 08:42

quote:

barbs from huts in Arctic/Antarctic always freeze to death.

That explains it! I couldn't figure out why they disappeared. No Eskimo Barbs!

Julius Brenzaida · September 25, 2000, 14:59

quote:

Originally posted by rah on 09-25-2000 08:37 AM
1. Invention has always done it for me also.

RAH

Well,
Maybe your right. But I am pretty sure that I have never gotten any new tech from a hut after I owned 24 techs. I play civ II multiplayer. And I never noticed that Invention screwed anything for me.
But I don't mean to be definitive on the subject.

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Oh Man, when will you understand that your greatness lies in your failure - Goethe

Ming · September 25, 2000, 15:21

As an exercise, I played a game in MP mode as the only human player. My sole purpose was to cheat my brains out and ALWAYS take a science from a hut after I had gotten some non horses and chariots. I kept resetting on every hut until I got what I wanted.

Invention was the key factor... not number of sciences.
I was able to get EVERY SCIENCE up until that point in the science tree. I played around a little bit too.
Once it was down to only a few available sciences, I would take invention, and see if I could get another science after that... I couldn't, even after HUNDREDS OF RESETS!

Now, I'm sure people will come in and say they remember getting corporation or some other science from a hut past invention on the tech tree... but I would say that it is just a bug, and a weird event that is not supposed to happen.

Please, go out and duplicate my test. I look forward to putting this subject to rest once and for all.

Scouse Gits · September 25, 2000, 18:36

Ming ... agreed! However,if an AI civ has invention, and you don't, the human player can continue to get scrolls of wisdom from huts.
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SG (2)

rah · September 26, 2000, 08:49

I did the same test as ming before MP came out, a while back. Actually in response to a thread of the same topic. I kept resetting if I got invention and was able to get every other tech prior in the tech tree(somewhere in the mid to high 30s count if I remember correctly). Once I had to take invention and did, I tried resetting over a hundred times on the next hut and needless to say never saw another tech.

Maybe SG's comment helps explain how someone remembers getting a tech that should have not been possible.
That is what we should test for grins. hmmmnnnnnn.

RAH

Kull · September 29, 2000, 11:58

My "Seeds of Greatness" scenario features seven civs in the Ancient Near East, most of whom begin with one city and no usable techs. The Persians have a "no,no" tech called "Persian Culture" (Invention), which is used solely to generate "Persian-looking" people in the city window. The unintended side-effect (which I now refer to as a "Feature" - thank you, Bill Gates) is that the Persians can NEVER get techs from Goody Huts. All the other civs routinely gain techs in this manner, so it's also clear that Invention only hamstrings the owning civ.

I playtested them all for months, so there's no question whatsoever that Invention is determinative.

DrFell · September 29, 2000, 18:49

Did some testing in cheat mode on tot, giving all techs to all civs, revealing the whole map and opening every hut 1 by 1. I found that the all the advanced tribes i got were only size 1 cities with no improvements... maybe advanced tribe size is related to the number of turns?
[This message has been edited by DrFell (edited September 30, 2000).]

Scouse Gits · October 2, 2000, 08:41

Doesn't this raise an interesting prospect? If an AI civ is encouraged to gain Invention and one of its derivatives (Demo, Gunpowder, SteamEngine) a human player could trade or steal the derivative and then ?perhaps? gain subsequent techs from huts!!!
Am I missing something here??

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Scouse Git[1]

"CARTAGO DELENDA EST" - Cato the Censor
"The Great Library must be built!"

rah · October 2, 2000, 09:32

Yes DrFell, the bigger cities don't occur till well after AD. And when it does occur it's random. I tested resetting a few huts after it was late enough for this to happen, and sometimes I'd get a one size city, and other times I'd get a 4 sized city with 2 or three improvements. Even got an aquaduct in one.

RAH

Mercantile · October 2, 2000, 14:27

Rah, so it is random then. I have received large and small new cities. i prefer the larger ones because if they are placed properly, you can spit out settlers to quickly colonize the area. If it is attached with improvements i don't wish to pay for, ie aquaduct at size three, i just sell it and it pays for a rush buy on the settler. Often i will sell an improvement and then churn out a settler that turn or the next one.

DrFell · October 2, 2000, 17:03

My first Quadruple Post!

[This message has been edited by DrFell (edited October 02, 2000).]

DrFell · October 2, 2000, 17:04

See above
[This message has been edited by DrFell (edited October 02, 2000).]

DrFell · October 2, 2000, 17:05

Yep ... See Above
[This message has been edited by DrFell (edited October 02, 2000).]

DrFell · October 2, 2000, 17:06

You guessed... see above

Quintuple post! do i hold the record?
[This message has been edited by DrFell (edited October 02, 2000).]

DrFell · October 2, 2000, 17:07

I dont think its completely random... during my turn 2 test of advanced tribes i got about 6... ALL were size 1 with no improvements. But i agree that later on, they seem to be of random size and with random improvements.
Another question: has anyone ever got an advanced tribe without enough food to support its population? Or one with unhappy people, i.e. civil disorder?

Mercantile · October 2, 2000, 17:15

i have never had not enough food, but i have had a city in disorder, especially if i don't leave a troop in there for martial law. I agree only later in the game do i get big cities. There must be a year that triggers these sorts of things. I notice it and just keep on civin. I rarely take the time to record when these strange anomolies occur. I am too lazy

SCG · October 3, 2000, 08:15

I'm not sure if it is a year or a particular tech that triggers larger advanced tribes, but I've gotten size 4 cities that were in food deficit with 4 improvements, as well as size 1 cities that brought in 6 extra food and no improvements, as well as size 2-4 cities without temples (so in disorder) and everything in between. I've never gotten an aquaduct, but then by the time I am finding large advanced tribes, I'm pretty dominant city and tech-wise (almost by definition since if there are huts left late, the AI hasn't been too effective using their half of the world)

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Sleep is a luxury and I don't have Shakespeare's Theatre in my back yard.

Blaupanzer · October 12, 2000, 13:52

Odds on disorder related to your Government form versus size of empty city. Have gotten them up to size 4 with improvements up to aquaducts. Have gotten settlers from plains and grassland, found an advanced tribe in the woods in my last game, got techs higher than invention BEFORE I applied the 2.42 patch.