Medieval Pack II v1.1: A Call to Arms

[Apollon]

Think I "solved" the problem. I found an older version of Medmod, from June 10th. I took that Wouter.slc and replaced the 1.1 Wouter.slc... and it worked properly. I haven't noticed any side effects of it yet, but I plan on seeing some Anyway, I can play the game now.

It seem to work fine, and I'll use it until an update comes. Seems you only need Wouter.slc and Wouter.slc.bak (haven't tried without *.bak, but I assume it's needed)

[Immortal Wombat]

The *.bak file does nothing. Its a side-effect of Wouter saving files in EditPlus, and isn't needed at all.

[Kevin Montgomery]

Help, when I load MedMod and start a new game it goes to the desktop and I get several Slic errors:
C:\PROGRAM FILES.....ctp2_data\default\gamedata\tut2_main.slc :469: ADVANCE_MONARCHY not found in advance DB

I get several of them each for different governments. I reloaded the files that Modswapper replaces, but that makes no difference.
I also loaded the Apolyton Pack. I do not get any errors when running it. Could there be a conflict between the two?

[Jules]

Storm,
According to the game manual, there's an in-game tutorial when you start at Beginner level. I'm guessing that this tutorial is not compatible with any mods. I got the same SLIC errors as you when I tried to start at Beginner. As far as I can tell there's no way to disable the tutorial so you'll just have to bump up the difficulty to Easy, or if you're new to these kind of games, try loading the regular version of the game and play the tutorial until you get a feel for what's going on.

There should be no incompatibility between Med Mod and Apolyton Pack; that's why you use Modswapper to load them.

Hope this helps!

[Jules]

Try using this version of Wouter.slc

It's the one that comes with 1.1, but I edited it to put back in a missing line of code. Its absence I think was causing the problem. If it works, go with it!

ctp2_data/default/gamedata/ for those who don't know.

Happy Med-ing!

[WesW]

New update/patch posted.
Note: If you downloaded the update before this edit was posted, you need to get it again. The correct version will say "v1.1" when you use modswapper to update the GL.

Jules was right in that I had simply deleted one more line than I should have when I was altering the Wouter.slc a week or two ago. I have a patched version posted now.

The update also contains a number of changes to buildings.
The Theatre, Arena and Public Park now go obsolete, designed to be replaced by the Movie Theatre, Stadium and VR Amusement Park, respectively.
The population pollution reducing improvements are less effective than they used to be, reducing pollution by 30 and 60%, respectively. This will increase reliance upon the happiness improvements. Upkeep for Eco-Transit has been reduced by 10.
Ramayana now gives +2 happiness, instead of giving a Theatre in every city, and goes obsolete with Electricity along with the Theatre.

I have also gone through the text, and made sure that no buildings which go obsolete are preqs for another building. I found a number of instances of this, which could have made it impossible to properly improve cities founded late in the game.

Storm, Jules is right in that you cannot use the tutorial with the Medpack. If you are that new to the game, you need to use the original version until you are familiar with the basic game. Then you need to take some time to absorb all the new things in the modpack.

[Kevin Montgomery]

Jules and Wes, I am not realy new although I have not played in a long while thanks to Diablo2. Iwas just starting it in beginner as a sort of fast track to check that all was working and I had not mis-installed anything. Thank you for clearing it up for me.
Very nice job BTW I will send a donation come pay day.

[WesW]

If you downloaded the update before I made the edit to the above message, you need to get the patch again. The correct version will read "v.1.1" when you use Modswapper.

[StarGazer]

WES -- May I suggest that you change the following title on your modification site from 1.0 to 1.1 so that new MM2 players don't get confused?

Medieval Pack II v1.0 A Call to Arms
Introduction and Installation
Part 1: 1.1 Pictures (6.5MB)
Part 2: Sounds(4.0MB)
Part 3: Sprites1 (6.7MB)
Part 4: Sprites2 (5.4MB)
Part 5: 1.1 Texts

[StarGazer]

The usual: Impossible, Torus, Huge, 5 civs, Marauders, Science Victory Goal.

TURN 122 -- Rankings:

1. Arabs at 100% (top of ranking graph)
2. Scots at 75%
3. English at 70%
4. Native Americans at 65%
5. Me (Americans) at 25%

Have established contact (an embassy) only with the Scots, my next-door neighbors (as usual). They've got mountains galore; I have none. I'm squeezed onto a kind of peninsula; like the Arabs in a previous MM2 game, they've got the rest of the continent to expand into, which they are doing post haste.

Their gov't is Populist Zealot and their reluctance to conduct mutually satisfactory diplomatic actions reflects that, I guess, although in all the CTP2 MM2 games I have played, the Scots have always been tuff bastards diplomatically, no matter what their governmental stance. They will accept money, though, giving me nothing in return except a grimace instead of a frown. However, in view of their military strength (they recently got the elite Zulu units), I'll accept a grimace.

They're about 10 Science Advances ahead of me. We're both Monarchies. I got started with Monarchy late in the game, since Org. Religion wasn't offered until I had researched two Advances.

If the game continues like this, yours truly is going to take the back seat for a change -- which is not so bad, since then the word "Impossible" actually has some meaning.

[Caranorn]

B]OK, seems this has already been reported, I'm no longer used to these boards and missed the latest messages before I posted.[/B]


Wes, I've been trying out your Med Mod II for the past two days and may have noticed a mistake (or something that you did not mention in your read me).

So far I noticed in two games (short ones yet) that some cities could not build city walls and possibly aqueducts (certain on city walls, in the current game I have the advance and 2 out of my 4 cities can't build the walls). This seems rather strange so I expect it's not intentional.

Otherwise the game runs fine, I expect the ruins now use SLIC code as they sometimes (always when a mercenary is to appear) cause a serious slow down of the game (the first times I thought it had crashed). But I find that little slow down is a minor inconvenience so far (though it's rather strange to have the game slow during the ai's turn and be almost certain that it just stepped onto a ruin).

I will eventually change some of the terrain tile benefits slightly for my games I expect as I hate coastal cities to be virtually useless and forest/jungle cities to grow so slowly (raising their food to 10 should not hurt considering that plains and grassland can easily be irigated).

I'll go back to playing now.

Thanks once more for the great work.

Marc B.

P.S.; And yes that means I should be back for a bit. I just bought a new Macintosh G4 last week and it's fast enough to emulate Win98 and run CTP II at a decent speed (huge map and 10 civs so far, maybe even good enough for more).

P.P.S.: Wes there seems to be a problem with your Apolyton email (the link at your page). I tried to mail this direct to you and had it bounced back.[

[Cube]

Well I started a new game: very hard, gigantic map, earth world, 12 civs, maurauders, wet, uniform mostly island, about 60% water, many goods.

the year is 200 ad

I'm at the top of the ranking as usual, thanks to chichen itza(spelling), my strong science, and my strong military. I started out as usual by building to cities and inserting my regular queue in them Warrior, spearman or archer (whichever I can build), and a settler. I went into the science screen and changed reasearch, because it always starts with and expensive advance instead of the cheapest. Well I started exploring once my first warior was built and found some ruins. I went in and it gave me an advance.
I continued exploring and found more ruins. I got my other warior and sent him to another unexplored area. I went to ruin and got ambushed by 3 barbarians, so I ran. I kept exploring and going to ruins. I found lots of advances, some settlers, some cities mercenaries, gold, and barbarians. Before I knew it I had about seven or eight cities and I had only built two or three settlers.

I kept exploring with my warriors and coracles and found the Incas(orange) and the Persians(gray) I Built a noble and established embasies with them. Well by this time I could build units with the slaving ability so I built them and decided to go kill some barbarians and make them my slaves MWA HAHAHA HAHA HAHAHAHA!!!! I found some barbarians and attacked them. I controlled to which city they were sent by moving all the units out of the cities I didn't want them to go and leaving units in the city I wanted them in. I kept doing this until I had one slave in each city except for two of them.

I continued to explore and found the mayans(puple),the austrians (some sort of wierd red color I think it's called maroon), and the celts(green). I found that two of them were Populist Zealots, wohoo Ecotopians!!!! I have never played against Ecotopians so this might be fun.

Well I have made contact with Seven or eight civs, have four embassies, and I have 10 cities and have had 10 cities for a long time. The really weird thing thuogh is that I am reserching gunpowder even though it's 200ad. I wasn't the first to have gunpowder though the indians were(I checked using cheat mode) and they don't even have any science wonders. I inserted flintlock In their science screen and it will take them 21 turns( which translates into 18 or 19 turns with the bonus the AI gets). So there are going to be gunpowder units before 1000 ad. Is this normal? Does city state have to much science? Why am I so ahead of the timeline? Why do I get so many settlers and cities in ruins when I play very hard?

[janilxx]

Wes:
I would like to get modification dates back to download page. Could you add them?

PS. I started new game with new version and I saw first city capture(AI took from AI) in turn 65. That was a positive surprise But that version was the "no citywalls" version so I will start new game again.

PPS. It is quite unrealistic that you get almost the whole map quite early(swapping with AIs). In real life europeans did see for example America's first parts in ~1500

PPPS. I have been wondering a while what US citizens think about president Bush. Is he a good president for you because he really tries to think USA's best n every situation? Or do you think as a rest of the world that he is quite stupid ?

[Bluevoss]

Actually, I've had some really interesting battles with the AI in Wes's new mods (downloaded the newest 1.1 last night). Playing with 15 races on a normal map, I found myself deep in ancient battles early on. The Assyrians and I have been exchanging blows all along our front, and several times they've picked off my units in open combat.

At the risk of opening a real can of worms (on Bush), lemme just say that he does not represent (or was elected by) a majority of Americans. Further, as a true republican, he represents rich American corporations and rich American's in general. To put it into terms with this base, he's like the Russian race in Civ2 - once they get ahead, they bully other players and break treaties all over the place.

I really like the cartoons that show bush as a ventriloquist's dummy, sitting on the VPs lap with a goofy wooden expression.

"Our Messengers have brought Bad News: The Americans have taken a stupid outlook"

Just my two cents:

[Pintello]

Hi,

Well since the can of worms has been openned, I will step into it. True Bush did not have a majority vote, but the Constitution says that you have to have the Electorial Vote not the majority vote, that is why we are a Republic and not a Democracy.

I personally think that the Electorial College is a good thing. If you look at the voting map of the United States on a county by county basis you will see that the Northeast and California is where Gore got most of his votes, but the majority of the states and counties in the United States actually voted for Bush.

If we went to a strictly populous vote, the majority of the states and counties in the US would be disinfranchised. In other words, people would campaigne in select counties California, the Northeast, Florida and maybey one or two other states and the rest of the country would be ignored.

I will also say that I think a true Democracy is a really bad idea. Just because the majority thinks something is right does not mean that it is. Just a few years ago, the majority of the US thought it was OK to descriminate against other people, especially in the south, if we were a true democracy, those people would still be descriminated against today instead of having the good progress that we have had towards eliminating this.

The majority is not always right, and the founding fathers knew this, just read the Federalist Papers and others of their writings if you don't believe me.

As for Bush being stupid, I am not sure that you can make that case. So far, I haven't seen anything really stupid that he has done. Just look at the Cabinet he appointed. I think Bush being stupid is just one of those things that people who disagree with him try to sell to everybody else, I do not think it is a statement of fact. I think it should be classified more as a statement of opinion.

Timothy Pintello

[Cube]

I have been playing mm2 v1.1 and the game crashing and giving me an error that says, "ctp2 has caused an error in ctp2.exe" in turn 255(850 ad) when I try to move my 4th unit. Im playing on a gigantic map, 12 civs, 10 cities, marauders, and I have gunpowder units. I tried uninstalling ctp2, reinstalling, and patching, but it didn't work. It still gives me the error. I haven't tried reinstalling medmod though.

[StarGazer]

The Scots, my next-door "neighbors," with whom I have a Peace Treaty AND a mutual withdrawal treaty, have begun bugging the h... out of me, sending in Cavalry units and PIRATING my trade routes. When I tell them to stop the pirating, they refuse. When I ask them (politely) to get their troops out, they agree -- BUT they don't leave right away AND they stagger the entry of their units, so no matter how many the 10-turn rule forces back into their territory, there are always one or two still there. Very clever of the AI, but incredibly annoying -- especially since the Scots are Number One in everything, and my civ next to last. I certainly don't want to go to war at this point, and I'd prefer not to go to war at any point, since I'm aiming for the Science Victory (which is difficult enough even without the delays and waste of war).

Unfortunately, as I have discovered, my Spies can't Sue a military unit. In Civ and Civ II, I would easily solve a situation of military trespassing by bribing the unit and adding it to my own army. Such an elegant solution! God knows why the CTP game designers didn't include it.

Is there any way of "booting" a military unit out immediately instead of having to wait the ten turns?

I'd like to reduce the ten turns to a lower number, say, two turns. Is there a way I can do this?

I don't know why "ten" was the number decided on, anyway. It's virtually useless in a situation like this -- with a staggered entry of military units.

[WesW]

Cube, try using modswapper to update your GL, and reloading slic. There may be a conflict with a message you are supposed to receive.
Caranorn, you must be overlooking something with your cities if you cannot build city walls. There is no pre-requisite for building them. Make sure you are using the slic from the 1.1 version. Walls also go obsolete with Military Engineering, so you will not be able to build them after you get that advance.

As far as your timeline, you may need to use the large civs version with your settings. It has fewer ruins per square.
As far as revealing the map, you need to debate this with the people who complain about being stuck on their home continent when they get one with no shallow water bridges to other lands. You can't have everything with every game. I would just enjoy it as part of the game's replay value.

Gazer, sorry to see you annoyed, but I think most players would see this situation as a challenge. You can always form a picketline of troops along your border with the Scots, and use their zoc to keep the Scots out.
You cannot kick out military units, and the ten turn setting was made by Dale to give the AIs plenty of time to move out on their own before resorting to slic.

I do not plan on making any more updates to the Call to Arms version of the mod, so I have left the texts with the 1.1 name. When I begin to post the version 2 beta, I will re-name the files according to the date they were posted.

[StarGazer]

Originally posted by WesW
Gazer, sorry to see you annoyed, but I think most players would see this situation as a challenge. You can always form a picketline of troops along your border with the Scots, and use their zoc to keep the Scots out.
You cannot kick out military units, and the ten turn setting was made by Dale to give the AIs plenty of time to move out on their own before resorting to slic.

Yes, it is a challenge, but annoying because, as I am learning, the game options of CTP for handling the problem are too limited (more so than in Civ or Civ II, for example). In "real life," the offended nation should be able to solve the problem with a localized "surgical strike" (remove the pirate or offending military unit) that does not automatically break one's Peace Treaty and cause a war in which the entire nation is involved.

The picketline is a good idea, one that I thought of, too, after I had posted the message and was mulling over solutions to the problem. I think a line of Spies would be best, because 1) they are Stealth Units and 2) they pose less of a threat to the Scots (who tend to mass troops in any area where they detect my troops near their border).

Why do the AIs need "plenty of time" to move out on their own? By the way, I have NEVER seen them move out on their own. At least, the Scots don't until the ten turns are up and the units go "poof" and disappear. And then, they come right back in again. Now, please tell me how to adjust the game file to the number of turns I want in my games. Thanks!

[Dale]

Stargazer:
Look for the following lines of code in my SLIC file:

///////////////////////////////////
// The magic art of withdrawing
///////////////////////////////////

...
...
...

if(CellOwner(WDT_tmpunit.location) == player[1] && GetAgreementDuration(player[0], player[1], 3) >= 5) {

The part where it says GetAgreementDuration(player[0], player[1], 3) >= 5 means check the duration of agreement 3 (withdraw) between player0 and player1 (variables). If it is 5 or greater then return TRUE. Change the >= 5 to however many turns till auto-expel kicks in.

For those wanting to expel settlers find the following line of code just below the lines mentioned above:

if(!(IsCivilian(WDT_tmpunit)) && WDT_waterunit != 1) {

and change it to:

if(WDT_waterunit != 1) {

DO NOT DELETE the waterunit reference! The script is only setup for LAND units.

NOTE: Deleting the civilian reference will make ALL units be expelled, not just military and settlers. That means the AI will have no diplomats, no spies, no nothing on your land. Bit harsh if you ask me.

Anyways, if you ask me I like the idea of enemy settlers in your lands. Take a look at Africa where millions of people move over borders to settle in a new country. Quite often those governments don't know they're there till they stumble on them.

Wes:
Let's give this info to them to change their files if they want. They'll just find out that the game isn't what it should be if spies and stuff are expelled as well. They'll come back to the correct files.

[janilxx]

I will continue a little bit about US president's IQ. I heard few days ago a news about Bush's IQ and decided to search that news from the net and voilá I wound it:

http://207.69.141.215/BushIQ.shtml



PS. What are the original settings for
continent - islands
and
land - water

I got my settings quite messed up and I would start "normal" game after my current game.

PPS. Is it so that AI sees inside my cities automatically and if he sees that my cities are well defended he will not attack against me? Or against any AI's? I have always used a "strong" defend in my cities, maybe that is the reason I have not been attacked against?

[janilxx]

I just remembered one bug I have seen in my vacation. When I investigate AI and check what wonders he have. There is only citynames(where wonders are I assume) in list. Shouldn't there be wondernames and maybe citynames both?

Am I right? Should/could this be fixed?

I used older version of medpack in my vacation and I have not check this later.

[Der PH]

Originally posted by StarGazer
The picketline is a good idea, one that I thought of, too, after I had posted the message and was mulling over solutions to the problem. I think a line of Spies would be best, because 1) they are Stealth Units and 2) they pose less of a threat to the Scots (who tend to mass troops in any area where they detect my troops near their border).

Since the spies havo no ZOC, you will have to position one next to the other in order to prevent anyone from tresspassing your borders.

I prefer lines of real units every third tile. Their ZOCs then combine to a barrier, which foreign units cannot pass. On vital borders these frontier-defense troops are further strengthened with fortifications.

[Der PH]

Wes,

Could you please tell me, which files have been changed since the July 18th' update.

I made some modifications in the txt-files myself and want to replace only the ones which are really necessary.
This way, if you didn't change a file I modified myself, I won't have to restore my own changes.


By the way:
In one of the MM2-readmes you said you wanted to raise the number of rivers.
Playing MM2 I always had the impression, there are fewer rivers than in the original.

Yesterday I found some lines in the MM2_const.txt concerning rivers and started playing with them blindly.

With the settings

PERCENT_RIVER 20 # percent of land with a river on it (WW from 5)
RIVER_LENGTH 15 # average river length (WW from 15)
RIVER_CELL_WIDTH 20 # Size of cells to be searched for river starts (WW from 5)
RIVER_CELL_HEIGHT 5 # (highest point in each cell) (WW from 5)

I suddenly got plenty of rivers all over the map (110 x 220) as I always wanted.
Since my adjustments are partially opposed to yours I think I should tell you.

[Caranorn]

Wes, I thought I was using the latest version of Med Mod II already. I went back to your page again and downloaded the text files again. I will let you know if this solves the problem.

Yesterday I spent some time digging through the (MM) terrain and tile improvement filesbut decided not to change anything yet as I started modifying too much right away. One thing i always hated was that river and road movement costs never changed regardless of actual terrain. To me it just makes no sense to move as fast through a mountain pass as over a plains highway. I think I'll first build an exell file to have a good overvie of the existing terrain features and only then start messing arround with the files.

By the way, has anyone tried adding additional production or other factors to the goods file? I expect it's not possible, but it would be nice to have more then trade benefits out of goods.

[janilxx]

Has anyone thought to add natural disasters to MedPack?

[Pintello]

Hi Janilxx,

How many US Presidents could converse fluently in a language other than their own? As far as I know, George W. Bush is the only one. He speaks fluent Spanish. Compare that to the much more "intellegent" Clinton who really muffed it the only time I know of that he tried.

Also, please take this question off topic as it does not belong here. I personally don't want to see these kinds of comments in a thread where I try to find out information about Med Mod 2. If I want to see this kind of crap I can go to off topic.

Timothy Pintello

[Martin Gühmann]

Originally posted by Caranorn
By the way, has anyone tried adding additional production or other factors to the goods file? I expect it's not possible, but it would be nice to have more then trade benefits out of goods.

So you want a free tile improvement on every good tile? Of course it is possible to create on every good tile a free tile improvement with the help of slic. My slic code for GoodMod is nearly complete I only have to replace the placeholder tile impprovement number by the final according good tile improvement.

So here is a screen shot of three goods with a tileimprovement on it. Of course it is possible to create a tile improvement without a graphics, therefore the final good improvements won't have a graphic. The graphics are just there to be shure that the good tile has an improvement.

A note for the good improvement create code: It is a little bit slow, because it checks every tile for a good, therefore the Barbarian turn is a little bit longer for the first two turns.

An interesting side effect is that these tile improvements can be pillaged and there is no change to get them back later in the game.

-Martin

[Cube]

Well I'm still getting the "ctp2 has caused an error in ctp2.exe" error in my game. It's at the year 850ad(turn 255) and the game crashes to the desktop and gives the above error when it swiches to my 3rd or 4th unit. I have tried reinstalling both ctp2(patched version) and medmod 2, but it still doesn't work. I tried switching mods with modswapper like wes suggested but it still doesn't work. I reloaded a previous game with the same setup and it worked fine. I would keep playing this game, but it's at 500ad and it will take a long time to get to 850ad. Well I will try it anyway.

Martin g Than picture looks cool. I saw that image when I downloaded the latest version of tileview, and I'm what is it supposed to do originally? Did you create new goods, because the ones in the picture look new. How did you get the picture to appear, what file did you edit, because I would like to add the space farms to the game.

Der ph just unzip it and when it tells you this file already exist................... replace it with this one mm/dd/yyyy (date). Replace the files that have a date older than 7/18.

[janilxx]

I know I am doing something wrong...

I have not doubled but tripled AI_TIME_SLICE values.

I have now 12 players and quite of bg continent where I play. Every players have other players next to his borders.

Ok ok I have to say that I have only played ~120 turns now.

What have I got... Once I heared a voice that is heared when city is destroyed. And once I saw AI to capture other AI's city.

So what is my problem? I want to see more city captures!!!

Why?

There have been hundreds or maybe even thousands of wars and city captures in the history. Human has always wanted to get more living space.

Lets take some examples.

- Egyptians were attacked many times by other african nations
- Indians. They had wars and captured land from other indian tribes.
- Europeans took lands from indians
- Roman empire was huge
- China's great wall was made to protect against attacks
- Britain(and many other nations too) had a huge amount of territories(for example india, australia etc)
- Scotland and wales were added to britain
- Poland's borders were move a lot after WWII
- East and West Germany after WWII
- Russian(or soviet union) bastards took lands(and cities/towns/villages) from Finland in WWII
- Namibia got it's independency and breaked out from South Africa
- Soviet Union got splitted to many nations.
- Yugoslavia got splitted

Nowadays after WWII almost all wars have been actually wars inside one country. And as a result of the war the country is splitted. But of course there is still country vs country wars but now it seems that those wars do not change borders.

So how could I get more citycaptures to my MedPack games? There could be for example average of one capture per 10-30 turns. And there should be captures against many countrys. Not only captures between two country for a hundreds/thousands of years.

Have anyone had this many captures?

Do you agree that this many captures would be nice?

If I am the only one could someone guide me so that I can add more captures to my games?