Will Civ3 Have A Scripting Language?

Peter Triggs · October 1, 2001, 19:03

Well, it's October: the month that Civ3 will finally be released. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I, at least, have not heard the slightest hint that it will come equipped with a scripting language. If we haven't heard anything by now, it looks to me like we ain't gonna get one.

tniem · October 1, 2001, 20:44

It seems the more we know about the game, the more questions we have. And little answers seem to be coming. But I would guess that your assumption is correct.

Inverse Icarus · October 1, 2001, 20:53

oooh a scripting language would be too cool.

i mastered UScript within a few weeks, and im sure if Civ had something like it i'd be set.

source code would be better

Sirotnikov · October 2, 2001, 00:14

Scripting would be cool.

Source code would not, as C++ is usually more difficult to follow, and completely unnecessary for scripting AI, once a good scripting language has been defined.

If we could tweak the AI, or suppose, create new leaders besides the default ones it would be great.

Imagine if I could with a script change the romans from caesar to - musolini and change their bonuses and overall strategy.

Imagine if I could refine the behaviour of AI ships!

Imagine if I could make some sort of script driven events for a scenario!

Imagine all the people...

java4me · October 2, 2001, 00:27

Quote:

Originally posted by Sirotnikov

Source code would not, as C++ is usually more difficult to follow, and completely unnecessary for scripting AI, once a good scripting language has been defined.

I think that source code would be fine too, just because some people can read it fine!!!

player1 · October 2, 2001, 03:56

Some people still play (and MOD) CTP2 just becausce it has wonderous
scripting language. CIV 3 should have one at least as good scripting
language as CTP2.

October 2, 2001, 10:27

Don't hold your breath for a scripting language. I get the feeling that if it hasn't been hyped by now . . .

Roman · October 2, 2001, 11:02

Actually, Firaxis has already confirmed that Civ 3 will indeed have a scripting language.

I don't remember which thread this was in though...

October 2, 2001, 12:43

Quote:

Actually, Firaxis has already confirmed that Civ 3 will indeed have a scripting language.

If so, soon it will be alien time . . .

Buck Birdseed · October 2, 2001, 12:58

Quote:

Originally posted by Roman
Actually, Firaxis has already confirmed that Civ 3 will indeed have a scripting language.

I don't remember which thread this was in though...

A "comprehensive civilization editor" and a "macro language" do not Scripting Langauge make. Still, they go a good part of the way.

squid · October 2, 2001, 18:44

Having to develop and write code 8 hrs a day, I don't think I'll be playing with Civ's language. It may be useful for scenarios, but all of the interesting AI hooks are buried in the code...

Who asked for the source? Yeah right.... you clearly do not get capitalism. The only reason Red Hat and the Linux distros make it is because they sell technical support. Code does not write itself for free!

Roman · October 2, 2001, 18:50

Quote:

Originally posted by Snapcase
A "comprehensive civilization editor" and a "macro language" do not Scripting Langauge make. Still, they go a good part of the way.

Oops,

I thought macro and scripting language are the same thing. What is the difference?

MarkG · October 2, 2001, 18:51

Quote:

Originally posted by squid
It may be useful for scenarios, but all of the interesting AI hooks are buried in the code...

have you seen what people have done on ctp2's ai?

Roman · October 2, 2001, 19:03

Quote:

Originally posted by MarkG
have you seen what people have done on ctp2's ai?

Since I don't own CTP2, no I have not. Have they managed to improve it significantly (say compared to the deity ToT AI)?

Peter Triggs · October 2, 2001, 20:14

Debatably. Actually most of the modifications to CTP2's AI were done by tweaking the data in the text files. But there are some nice hooks that let you get directly into it. For example, I've been playing around with the "WW2 scenario" that was provided. You can add your own user defined strategies to Strategies.txt, so I added two: WW2_GERMAN_LAND_GOALS (which sends the Panzer divisions to capture cities) and WW2_GERMAN_AIR_GOALS (which sends the Luftwaffe to bomb the hell out of anything nearby). To get the AI to use them:

Code:

if (tmpPlayer == 1) {		// If current player is German
	      ConsiderStrategicState(tmpPlayer, 9900, StrategyDB(STRATEGY_WW2_GERMAN),-1,-1,-1);
	      tacticalGoals=Random(100);
	      if (tacticalGoals<66) {
	           ConsiderStrategicState(tmpPlayer, 9999, StrategyDB(STRATEGY_WW2_GERMAN_LAND_GOALS),-1,-1,-1);    
	      }
              else{
	           ConsiderStrategicState(tmpPlayer, 9999, StrategyDB(STRATEGY_WW2_GERMAN_AIR_GOALS),-1,-1,-1);
		   SendTroopsToTheater(); //Blitzkrieg land tactics
              }

"SendTroopsToTheater()" is a function that picks up any spare German troops and sends them to where the action is. So on any given German turn there's a one in three chance that the Luftwaffe will go for you, otherwise the Panzer divisions will. This randomness, I believe, makes the game a bit more interesting.

This is the sort of thing I've been hoping that we'll be able to do with Civ3, but so far things don't look that promising.

EDIT: I almost forgot. The award for the most *imaginative* analogy of the day goes to Sirotnikov.

Roman · October 2, 2001, 20:37

Certainly sounds interesting.

java4me · October 2, 2001, 23:23

Quote:

Originally posted by Roman
Certainly sounds interesting.

It is very interesting!!!

I plan on making mods for Civ3, so when are you going to open the Civ3 mods section!!!!!!!!!!!

Nemo · October 2, 2001, 23:45

I hope that I dont find a need for sriptinglanguage in CIV III. I didnt need one in Civ, I or II, bt I did need one for CTP (crappy @$$ game).

As long as i can edit the not using enemy road/rails to just not using enemy rails via .txt files i'll be happy.

but for all you mod makers...i hope there is a language for you. you guys come up with some pretty cool stuff (i just wish i had the time to do so too...but i am too busy playing civ

)

Immortal Wombat · October 3, 2001, 12:37

Quote:

Originally posted by Nemo
I hope that I dont find a need for sriptinglanguage in CIV III. I didnt need one in Civ, I or II, bt I did need one for CTP (crappy @$$ game).

No game needs a scripting language, but every game would benefit from one.

Dan Magaha FIRAXIS · October 3, 2001, 12:44

I'm not sure where this rumor came from, but Civ III will not be shipping with any form of scripting language or macro support.

Dan
Firaxis Games, Inc.

Gramphos · October 3, 2001, 13:02

INFO INFO

How well can you trig events in the editors?
I hope that they are good enough to not need a scripting language. If the editors are good enough and the game is robust enough no scripting is needed, and scripting would just make it hard for the game to handle all possible things that may result in bugs.

Steve Clark · October 3, 2001, 14:13

It seems that what was provided in Civ2 with the events.txt file was good enough for some of the more clever scenario designers to create wonderfully, complex scenarios (like Red Front, Second Front, Sacrificial Blood, etc.).

Nemo · October 3, 2001, 16:10

Thanks for the update Dan

Quote:

Originally posted by Immortal Wombat

No game needs a scripting language, but every game would benefit from one.

thats what i USED to think...untill i played CTP

Harlan · October 3, 2001, 16:30

I don't think the recent comments on this thread understand Dan's comment. The way I understand it, there will be no way to do events in Civ3, period. At least when the game ships. This is a big blow to scenario makers like myself.

Dan, is there any way to make events in Civ3? If not, when can we expect the game to have this feature added, if ever?

Peter Triggs · October 3, 2001, 16:36

Thanks for the answer, Dan, even though it's not the one I wanted to hear. In almost two years of posting to the CTP forums, I NEVER got an answer from anyone connected with Activision. Here's the first time I ask a question about Civ3, and Firaxis responds straightaway. That's nice.

java4me · October 3, 2001, 17:15

Quote:

Originally posted by Dan Magaha FIRAXIS
I'm not sure where this rumor came from, but Civ III will not be shipping with any form of scripting language or macro support.

Dan
Firaxis Games, Inc.

NOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

MY MODS

Comrade Tribune · October 3, 2001, 17:28

Quote:

Originally posted by Harlan
The way I understand it, there will be no way to do events in Civ3, period. At least when the game ships. This is a big blow to scenario makers like myself.

That´s also how I read this. I hope we are both wrong.

And, please, Apolyton, give Nemo his custom Avatar back.
I can´t stand his misery for much longer.

Steve Clark · October 3, 2001, 17:39

It has got to be semantics. Using the Civ2 model for making scenarios (why folks keep bringing up CtP is beyond me, CtP has no relation to Civ, but I digress), you have to have an event-type file to do any kind of scenarios. The events.txt file, even for the simplist scenarios from FW, includes what happens when you take over a city or controlling the placement of all AI units. There will be the ability to do that in some form.

Nemo · October 3, 2001, 17:42

Quote:

Originally posted by Comrade Tribune
And, please, Apolyton, give Nemo his custom Avatar back.
I can´t stand his misery for much longer.

woo hoo! a supporter! thanks

...now if only Mark G. would respond to the e-mail i sent him the other week

--

Without the event function there were quite a few great scenerios still put out for Civ II though. Its a shame that they don't have it, but it sounds like the editor is going to be grand (maybe make up for the lack of event functions/seperate scripting)

October 3, 2001, 17:45

>> Mister Pleasant mutates into a complete jack@$$<<

Don't worry, an events handler system will eventually be available for Civ3 (just as Civ2 had civ scenarios). This add on will be sold just before the multiplayer addition for civ3 goes on sale, and will no doubt include a few scenarios. So cheer up mod makers.

>>Mister Pleasant mutates to levels of jack@$$ery beyond what present theory can account for<<

Quote:

I'm not sure where this rumor came from, but Civ III will not be shipping with any form of scripting language or macro support.

What, Firaxis can't even match the technological innovation of a crappy Activision product?! What is the world coming to . . .