Getting the drivers ready for Civ3

[Steve Clark]

We all saw that Civ3 will require DirectX 8.0. So you say to yourself, fine, I'll install it from the game (if you don't already have it). Well, graphics-related drivers are notorious for causing problems and installing DX8 won't be that simple. For example, I'm finally taking the plunge into DirectX 8.0a in preparation for Civ3. From experience, it is not that simple since there are other components that should be upgraded before you do that. Specifically, since I have an AMD chip, I'll be upgrading the MiniPort driver, installing the 4-in-1 drivers based on my VIA chipset, upgrading the nVidia driver to 12.41 and then DX8.0a. This will substantially improve performance throughout the whole system, thus minimizing any system-level bottlenecks.

The most important thing to remember (and I predict will be the cause of many problems that will be reported here as folks try to get Civ3 to run) is to make sure that your graphics-card driver is DX8.0 compatible. I'm doing this all ahead of time to make sure everything will work right at the system level and with other applications/games.

[Provost Harrison]

Well I don't see that there should be a problem. Providing your video drivers are up to date and compatible with DX8, you will be fine. You don't need to do anything with the motherboard stuff, and the soundcard drivers are straightforward; DX8 will have some included if it is a standard piece of equipment. This already has DX8 so I can't envisage a problem...

[Sabre2th]

My computer came with Directx8 installed, so I haven't done too much with it, but I did install it on my old P200. It installed very quickly and without a single problem. I don't see why so many people are complaining.

[Provost Harrison]

Originally posted by Sabre2th
My computer came with Directx8 installed, so I haven't done too much with it, but I did install it on my old P200. It installed very quickly and without a single problem. I don't see why so many people are complaining.

Oh, I installed it on a P2-266 and it went seriously tits up. It took me a lot of effort to fix (reinstalling Windows, basically)

[Sabre2th]

Originally posted by Provost Harrison


Oh, I installed it on a P2-266 and it went seriously tits up. It took me a lot of effort to fix (reinstalling Windows, basically)

Interesting. I wonder what the difference was? What OS were you using on the 266?

I was using a slightly tweaked version of win98.

[java4me]

Originally posted by Provost Harrison


Oh, I installed it on a P2-266 and it went seriously tits up. It took me a lot of effort to fix (reinstalling Windows, basically)

Boy that sucks!!!

I just had to reinstall my system after my cdrom drivers broke!!!

[dainbramaged13]

i dont know what my drivers are or anything like that, and i dont know what hardware i have (i was not knowledgable about computer hardware when i bought it) does anyone know any good programs that find and download drivers automatically?

[Steve Clark]

It depends on what brand. I know that Gateway has a utility that checks the drivers on your system and then recommends what needs to be updated. I would think Dell, HP, IBM, [cough]Compaq[/cough], AlienWare, etc. would have something similar. Otherwise, it would require going through each of the components in the Device Manager one at a time.

[Rakki]

if you don't know what hardware you have in your 'puter, open it up, have a look, and start scribbling things down

[Sarxis]

I can't imagine that anyone wouldn't have Dx8 already. How long has it been out now?

Well, ok, I could imagine some CIVers not having it- since, afterall, these diehards are still probably only playing Civ2.

[Jaybe]

What are you guys trying to do!?!?? Scare me off from buying a PC?

I was going to go to Best Buy and purchase an HP7935 with a 17" monitor (new, comes with Windows XP). Just as a game machine for playing Civ3, though I might buy Call to Power 2 just to see what it was like (I've got Civ:CtP on my Mac).

[java4me]

Originally posted by Jaybe
What are you guys trying to do!?!?? Scare me off from buying a PC?

I was going to go to Best Buy and purchase an HP7935 with a 17" monitor (new, comes with Windows XP). Just as a game machine for playing Civ3, though I might buy Call to Power 2 just to see what it was like (I've got Civ:CtP on my Mac).

Join the PC Clan!!!

[Sarxis]

Though I definately recommend PC versus MAC, I HIGHLY suggest Dell over Hewlit Quackard.

[Though actually, I TRUELY recommend building your own PC]

[Ozymandous]

Originally posted by Jaybe
What are you guys trying to do!?!?? Scare me off from buying a PC?

I was going to go to Best Buy and purchase an HP7935 with a 17" monitor (new, comes with Windows XP). Just as a game machine for playing Civ3, though I might buy Call to Power 2 just to see what it was like (I've got Civ:CtP on my Mac).

Ahhh, run away, run away!!!

Do NOT buy a HP!!! If you care about ever being able to upgrade your PC at all or EVER fix problems with it yourself.

HP (IMHO) is in the same boat as Compaq when it comes to the lowest quality crap you can buy for your hard earned money.

Your best bet would be to do one of the following things:

1) Research and build your own PC.
Pros: You know exactly what is going on with your system so can likely fix anything that goes wrong, generally cheaper than buying a complete system from someone.
Cons: Have to figure out how to actually build the PC, have to fit sometimes barely compatible pieces together and make them work, sometimes getting up to date drivers is a nightmare (files hard to find, or are to large to fit on a floppy, etc).

2) Research and buy a PC from a reputable dealer, example, Dell, Alien, a local PC store that has a good history.
Pros: Can get a complete, custom system like you want without having to piece it all together and make sure it works like it should, if anything breaks you have a very good warrantee so someone else will come to your house (in case of Dell and some local shops, not sure about Alien) and fix it for free. Can buy "package systems" that include monitors and speakers.
Cons: Systems typically more (sometimes a LOT more) expensive.

3) Have a friend who knows about PC's build you one.
Pros: Do not have to know about how to build PC's, can get a custom system. Cheaper than buying from a PC store (generally).
Cons: May have problems if the PC breaks, your friend may not be available or become irritable and charge you more if you break the system a lot.

There you have it, the three main ways I know to get a new PC (legally ). I can do 1 but chose to do 2 (modified by me when the system came from Dell ) because I didn't feel like building another PC since I deal with them all day at work. If you don't know much about PC's then I would suggest option 2 because if you choose the right company you can get a good deal on a PC and not have to worry about fixing the system (1,2 or 3 year next day on site warranty available from Dell).

Whatever you do, for the love of whatever deity you worship, do NOT buy a HP or Compaq system. These companies are the Yugo manufacturer's of the PC world!!

[monkspider]

Don't buy a Dell ever!!! Nor a Compaq, from my experience I have found HP to be the most reliable (and easily upgradable) of the "super power" brands. Gateway, Compaq and Dell should all feature a sticker which reads "Abandon all hope, all ye who enter here".

[dainbramaged13]

monk, u are crazy
i hvae an hp it is complket++++inaccessible, no agp slot, only space for 256 mb ram... they really gypped me for a year-and a half-old comp

all the (new) gateways ive seen are incrediibly easy to work with, and usually come with good motherboard specs.

i dont know dells or compaqs so i cant say

[monkspider]

Really?
I appologize, but my Girlfriend has one that is exceedingly upgradable. My aunt has one as well that seems to be fine. I have a Gateway, and it is almost comically impossible to upgrade, and my friend's Dell is virtually impossible to upgrade as well.
I'm sure my girlfriend's and aunt's may be not be indicative of the entirety of HP's computer products, but from my experience, I have yet to witness any problems with them.

[monkspider]

My gateway has no AGP slot, no extra bays for CD-Rom or DVD drives. It only has a tiny PCI slot that can only hold video cards that are about the size of a postage stamp.
My friend's Dell seems to be similarly hopeless in terms of possible upgrades.

[Jaybe]

Wow, guys, I really appreciate all the (conflicting) advice!

I printed out your responses. I now have a handle on appropriate questions to ask, which should keep me busy for the next 3-4 weeks!

(Or, I could just be really patient and wait for the Mac version.
After all, while it may suffer somewhat in performance, it IS a much better machine). It's those DLL Library problems and system re-installs that make me want 'KISS' it. See what a little knowledge can do to you?
Understand, I come from a graphics layout/desktop publishing background (see my profile).
Really, I would rather NOT wait.

[dennis580]

Yea this is why the PC sucks as a gaming platform. Just too much hassle, trouble, and expense. If TBS games ever start getting ported to consoles I will be finished with PC gaming for good. I can only hope that the PC as a gaming platform will continue to die off.

I have my PC about 2 and a half years(400 AMD2 with 128 RAM and a Voodoo card and I have never downloaded new drivers or upgraded it.

[Sabre2th]

I can only hope that the PC as a gaming platform will continue to die off.

Continue to die off? If anything, it's getting better. The only thing holding back PC gaming is the software. Computers can do pretty much everything consoles can do, plus a heck of a lot more.

I have my PC about 2 and a half years(400 AMD2 with 128 RAM and a Voodoo card and I have never downloaded new drivers or upgraded it.

This would explain why you think the PC platform sucks.


On Topic:
Jaybe: I have a Dell and it is much better than any HP I've ever seen. Gateways aren't as bad as some say they are, but they certainly don't compare with my Dell. I haven't used Compaqs too much, but I do know that I don't like Mac. At all. They're not worth it.

I highly recommend getting a PC. If you can't build your own, get a Dell, but I must stress that it's not always the brand so much as what you get inside. More often than not, the basic package sucks. You should pick and choose what you want and upgrade accordingly.

[Sarxis]

What a joke! Someone even thinking that the PC is a dying game platform.

I think the only reason why consoles do so well is because there is a lower standard of taste in the console community. That's why they can pretty much 'bulk' up production of games that are of low quality, and then say that consoles are successful (at $60 a game, they'd better be... uh hum.. successful).

Of course, I have seen some really good console games lately (well, at least decent), but the fact remains that there is MORE community around many of the various PC games, and there are a lot of PC game types that consoles can never touch (TBS, RTS, MMOG and others).

[Sarxis]

double post

[Ozymandous]

Originally posted by monkspider
My gateway has no AGP slot, no extra bays for CD-Rom or DVD drives. It only has a tiny PCI slot that can only hold video cards that are about the size of a postage stamp.
My friend's Dell seems to be similarly hopeless in terms of possible upgrades.

Hmm, don't buy a Dell because you bought a bad version?

Wrong answer.

I have bought two Dell PC's in three years, each with an AGP slot and 4 PCI slots each. While this wasn't as many slots as some PC's have it was more than enough room for the NIC card, modem and soundcard for the PC with a slot left over.

Compare this to the P.O.S. HP system my girlfriend had that was 1/2 the size of my Dell (her's was a "micro-tower" that had EVERYTHING except the video card and hard drive as proprietary equipment that you had to talk to HP when you wanted to upgrade or replace.

If you want a smal, CHEAP, PC with NO drivers available to download then buy a HP or Compaq. If, on the other hand you want a PC that you can replace the operating system on and still get the drivers (HP & Compaq can only use the restore CD, their modems and sound cards have the same drivers that even WIndows 2000 doesn't recognize) then get a Dell.

I have yet seen a Dell PC either that I, or any friends or relatives own, or the old systems that we have at work (switched to Cpmpaq, egad, bad choice!) crash so bad that they couldn't at least be re-formatted and working perfectly in an hour or two. You cannot say that about the POS HP and Compaq systems I have seen.

Monk, if your friend had a bad experience with a Dell what kind did he have? Did he know anything about PC's?

No offense, some HP and Compaq systems are ok, but the vast majority of them that are sold to "average" consumers in stores like Circuit City, Best Buy, CompUSA, etc, are very cheap and are made to fail in less than two years. They are like the old Packard Bell series, you find a good one occasionally, but who wants to buy 9 bad systems in hoping to find one decent one?

(edit: forgot to add system specs for my PC in case people are curious.

P3 1 GHz processor
20 GB hard drive (later upgraded)
4 PCI slots
2 USB ports
2 PC133 RAM slots, currently fitted with 2 128 MB sticks (also on sale at Best Buy)
ATI Pro 16 MB video card (swapped out for a Vodoo 3000)
Soundblaster Pro integrated sound card
Intel Intergrated NIC for those fun LAN games
56K modem
50+ speed CD-ROM
2 year on-site warrenty (heh, lazy with my home system).

Base cost: $620 after $150 sale and free shipping.

I used the 17" monitor speaker, Iomega zip and old video card from my old system to boost my new one better but you can get a complete system for still under $1000. My girlfriend got an upgraded version of my same system with monitor, speakers, 32 MB ATI Raedon DDR card for $1400 total cost.

As I said initially research what you want and don't just go by price because you could pay more in the long run for the decision you make today.)

[dainbramaged13]

monk, when were the pcs bought. i must admit the gateeays i have seen are about 6 months to a year newer than my hp

[Rakki]

everyone has their own preferences when it comes to buying their own computer.. of course, people who have bought a Dill/Comcrap/Hpee and the things worked would no doubt vouch for it with all their heart yada yada yada.

But building your own is the only true way to go.... that way you get the bits that YOU want and not what some bean counter figures you'll put up with. Particularly those damn things that have half the computer's hardware integrated onto the moterboard (video, audio, network, and godknowswhatelse) so you need a freakin' bios flash to upgrade drivers..... those are nothing but trouble in the long term.

Might cost a bit more to build your own, but at least you'll know exactly what your 'puter is capable of !

[Colonel Kraken]

There's one option that none of you have mentioned. Get a Computer Shopper magazine and purchase a computer through one of the mail order/online computer manufacturers. Most of them are very reputable and use NO proprietory hardware. Nearly all of them use OEM versions of off the shelf hardware. Most of them will list out exactly what each piece of hardware is on their machines. They even let you go online and custom build a machine, even choosing thngs like which motherboard you want!
These companies are VERY affordable! Much better than the big 4.

An example is Cyberpower computers. Check it out here:
cyberpowersystem.com

Click on Customize Systems. You get drop down menus for nearly every component on the machine. Great prices too!

[Ozymandous]

Originally posted by Anunikoba
What a joke! Someone even thinking that the PC is a dying game platform.

I think the only reason why consoles do so well is because there is a lower standard of taste in the console community. That's why they can pretty much 'bulk' up production of games that are of low quality, and then say that consoles are successful (at $60 a game, they'd better be... uh hum.. successful).

Of course, I have seen some really good console games lately (well, at least decent), but the fact remains that there is MORE community around many of the various PC games, and there are a lot of PC game types that consoles can never touch (TBS, RTS, MMOG and others).

I agree, the PC is not a dying platform.

Consoles do so well because they have ONE standard. You get a system with exact specifications that never change. Even if the console technology is years old you cannot upgrade.

Since consoles have only ONE standard they are easy to build games for and easy to optimize games for. When companies can do this the graphics can be amazing, but this doesn't mean the consoles have better grapphics it just means they are better otimized.

Yet PC's can do much more than games. If you buy a PC and never upgrade the drivers or components then of course you'll fall behind the technology curve. Try as you will a console game still cannot match a PC for some kinds of games that require a mouse and keyboard controller. Play the original Diablo for the PC and then try it for the PS1. Big difference.

Console games also cannot be modified by their fans. When was the last time you saw web pages dedicated to modifying a console game, you don't.

PC's and consoles both have their uses but neither is better than the other, IMHO, just like the MAC and PC have differences but both are strong in their repescted uses as well.

[dennis580]

LIke I said The PC as a gaming platform is just way too hassle, trouble, and expensive and that's why I hate it.

TBS games are the only reason I still play games on my PC, but if TBS games ever started to get ported to consoles then I would be thru with the PC as a gaming platform..

I predict the PC as a gaming platform will be virtually dead in 2 years. PS2 sales are already closing in on 20 million and thier it's almost certain that thier will be a price drop next month and with a AAA KILLER APP like MGS2 sales will explode.

[Earthling7]

If the PC dies as a games machine, I die as a gamer. I shall not be investing in a console. No!