Carefully Optimistic

[Sirotnikov]

Generally my attitude has changed towards Civ III.

I was worried for it, and I still am disappointed in some points.
Many things I expected to find their way into gameplay are absent.

Many things I expected out, are still here.

Many things I didn't expect (Unique Civs and top of all - Unique Units) are also here.

But I read the attacks on Firaxis.

Then I watched the screen shots and read the Firaxis replies.

I saw the developers' reactions in the video of the pre-ordered game bonus (that I downloaded Sorry FIRAXIS ) and seeing how sure they were about this game... made me think that maybe we're being too judgemental.

Sure, I'm disappointed aobut a lot of things.

But people worked on this game to make it fun, and it appears they believe in it, even though it does seems as if it was rushed along the way, to be released before MOO3, for which I will hold Infogrames accountable if Civ III turns out a flop (knock on wood, through salt over left shoulder, spit three times to the right).

I think they deserve the benefit of the doubt, and generally, I feel that even with all the minuses, Civ III does sound like a very good game.

Sure, it's not the game I visioned in my wet dreams (and I had a dream about getting Civ III and then giving it up in order to post here - even posteed aobut it) but it's still a good game.

Long ago I feared that we would boil in our own juices and fantasies about Civ III and all be disappointed. Mainly since each person visions the perfect Civ III in a different way, and no game will ever satisfy them.

So let's cool down a bit.

They guys worked hard to give a good game, a good AI, good experience. And then they come here and go "well now they are again blaming us for not adding this and that".

Civ III will have a limited set of features. There is an unlimited set that it WON'T have. We should hope they included the most important ones.

I'm pretty sure that if we dig up we can find some AI scripting once someone decodes the game files (or most probably the good ancient TXTs ) and we can change the graphics as I believe.

Even if we don't, pressure / talanted fans can lead to good results. Firaxis will probably release some more editing tools, or someone will write some underground tools.

And though there may be many things wrong with how we percieve the game - let's play it first. It's not the game we wanted or expected. It's not Civ II or Civ I or Civ Sirotnikov. It's Civ III.

I'm not saying don't express yourself - I'm saying restrain yourself. I can only imagine how bad some developers might feel when someone posts "You F!R@X!@#$ didn't include a scottish pipe-bag player unit!!!!".

They did't include it, but included other things which they thought were cool and would feel good for you. So give them some credit and some break.

I have a good feeling aobut this game and I won't let you ruin it, nor do I want you to insult Firaxians so much that there won't be Civ IV.

[Simpleton]

Yah, I feel bad about my pessimistic attitude and comments about Civ3/Firaxis but I guess I am a little apprehensive since the last two Civ efforts (CTP1 and CTP2) failed miserably. I wonder to myself tha perhaps Civ2 is as good as it gets? Perhaps every effort from now on will be a let down?
I hope they pull it off because Civ2 is my favorite game and I would love to see Civ3 top it!!

Don't feel too bad about pessimism - Firaxis IS just a company.
My attitude towards Civ3 is also one of cautious optimism. I'm looking forward to resources, borders, and cultures. I think Unique Civ things are a neat idea.

I think over-optimism kills good things. The Phantom Menace was as good as any other SW movie, but let's face it, no movie could have satisfied the hype. Same with Civ3. I'm sure it will be a descent game.

Two big problems though -
(1) Animated leader art does NOT fit in with the look of the game. The game has an autum color scheme and looks very nice over all. Just like that tower of babel picture the feel of the game was supposed to derive from. Then come the cartoon buffoons which violate the rather magnificent art that exists throughout the rest of the game. A goofy hippie leads Babylon. Tim Curry is the queen of england. Alexander looks like a dork. This is awful! I WILL be replacing the leader pics (and many of the leaders!). But after Activision and its CTP series, I was hoping I would not have to mod Civ3.
(2) No scripting language. This will severely limit Civ3 as a development platform for building scenarios and working around faults that creep into the game. In my opinion this is a giant step back.

Will I buy Civ3? Yes.
Will I enjoy it? I'm sure I will
Is my optimism guarded? You bet

[Imran Siddiqui]

You do know that CtP and CtP2 weren't made by Sid, right?

[Simpleton]

Originally posted by Mister Pleasant
I WILL be replacing the leader pics (and many of the leaders!). t

How would you do that? Wouldn't that be an awful lot of work since they are animated?
Just curious...

PS: Yes, I realize that Sid, thankfully, didn't have a hand in the CTP1 and 2 bombs. But I am still cautious....

[ixnay]

IIRC, you can replace the leader pics with static images.


Countdown to Prince: 18 posts

[Nenad]

I'm very optimistic and the strongest reason for that is Firaxis' claim that they played the game a lot and then had made the decisions what is going to be in or out. I don't see better way to make such a decision, and I have a complete trust in Sid's good taste.

[Madine]

I think it will be a good game. Not perfect, but good.

[Skanky Burns]

Im definately looking forward to this game. So far, Firaxis have done quite a lot that we were asking for (inhibiting ICS, powerful editing tools, etc) and have made the right decision regarding MP, even though it wasnt popular.

I believe that single player Civ 3 will be the best Civ SP experience so far, and when MP comes out, they will have devoted the effort that MP deserves, and it will be the best Civ MP experience ever.

I think it will be a good game. Not perfect, but good.

Well said!

I'm very optimistic and the strongest reason for that is Firaxis' claim that they played the game a lot and then had made the decisions what is going to be in or out. I don't see better way to make such a decision, and I have a complete trust in Sid's good taste.

Uhh, what do you think? Firaxis would come out and say the game sucks if it did? And I had trust in Sid's "good taste" right up until I saw Hippie Hamurabi.

You do know that CtP and CtP2 weren't made by Sid, right?

Your point? Sid didn't make the Med Mods, and they were great. Wes, Dale, and Locutus didn't make civ3, but I won't hold that against civ3.

[Nikolai]

I'm very optimistic! I just love the game already!!!

Oh, I can't wait!

[Sarxis]

Optimism?

Yeah!! I have Optimism up the wazoo for CivIII

[Nikolai]

I don't know what wazoo is, but I'm sure it is promising! Or?

[Stuie]

Originally posted by Mister Pleasant

And I had trust in Sid's "good taste" right up until I saw Hippie Hamurabi.

I remember when Civ2 came out, I saw the advisors and heralds and thought "What a load of crap." Then I noticed something: they had no impact on gameplay!. Imagine that.

So who cares what Hammurabi looks like - it has no impact on gameplay.

As for being apprehensive about this game based on any CTP release, that makes no sense to me. They were created by a completely different development team. Let's base our apprehensions on what Sid & co. have put out in recent years:

Sid Meier's Civil War (Gettysburg and Antietam)
SMAC
SMAX

What do you know! I've played and enjoyed every single one of those games. Now I'm feeling optimistic.

But, I still think the advisor and herald animations in Civ2 were crap.

[Th0mas]

Having now seen the video, trawled through Civ3.com, Read and sometimes responded to all the arguments on this forum....

..... I am starting to get this feeling

I am beginning to feel very confident about what will be revealed once CIV III has eventually been released. This excitement hasn't really hit me since CIV II was due for release.

I certainly began 'carefully optimistic' based on the great work that fraxis had already delivered + some of the initial interviews. As time has marched on and the day of release gets ever nearer my optimistic barometer has been steadily rising.

I know what people have said about the graphics - but I love them - even the animated leaders- in the same way that in CiV I 'the cheesy soldiers marched into the captured city' just added to the whole game experience)

For me this has all come together - I believe the game will have that undescribable 'thing' that makes a great game (you know what I mean - you begin to really care about you civs!) ... I can't justify this feeling or even argue for it in a logically way...

.... I may be heading for massive disappointment - but I don't think so.........CIV III is going to be the greatest game I've ever played

......so b*ll*cks to Carefully optimistic !

[Tjoepie]

I want to play it first before judging, but I'm very optimistic!

Sid's TBS games have allways been worth there money up to now, so why would he let his newest version of "Sid Meyers Civilization Series" be any different?
Especially since this is not Railroad Tycoon ( no offence intended) but the follow-up of the legendary CivII!

I for one can't wait to get my US ordered LE ASAP!

[Th0mas]

I may be being unrealistic..

......but I say stand and be counted

I remember when Civ2 came out, I saw the advisors and heralds and thought "What a load of crap." Then I noticed something: they had no impact on gameplay!. Imagine that.

So who cares what Hammurabi looks like - it has no impact on gameplay.

Sure it does - it interferes with my emersion in the game.
Anyway, I didn't say the goofy leader pics made me doubt the gameplay (about which I am cautiously optimistic), rather it destroyed any belief I might have had in Sid's good taste.

[Asesino_Virtual]

Yep, i like them. There are a lotta of people who probably will not like this or that thingie, but that´s what they are, thingies.
Civ has fulled a lot of my expectations:
Borders
Lot of CIVs to play simultaneusly.
Really improved diplomacy.

Has over fulled my expectations:
Culture!
16 CIVS at the same time!!
Better graphics.
Smooth interface.

And in some ways, hasnt satisfied
That awful roads (i hope, the captions were taken with a lotta of zoom).
No expanded tech tree.

And in other stuff, i dont know, as:
Will be able to offer other civ to break a pact in exchange of other stuff (tm)?

But well, what the heck!. This year, is my last year at highschool.
Next year, start the University and get a job. I dont want let the days just pass quickly, but for this game... i will. Coz it deserves it.
Coz CIV is one of the few games that i will buy original. And when my friend say to me "did u spent 60 bucks in THAT, when u could get it for 5 bucks?" i will respond "Yeah. Coz its not only a game.
Its C-I-V-I-L-I-Z-A-T-I-O-N"

[Sirotnikov]

Where are all the evil minded soothsayers I expected?