Civ3 site just updated.

dennis580 · October 5, 2001, 16:12

NM

KrazyHorse · October 5, 2001, 16:13

Arrrggghhh! Mounted Warrior! What a screwup.

KrazyHorse · October 5, 2001, 16:15

Quote:

Though the Iroquois rarely used horse-mounted warriors in combat due to the wooded terrain they usually fought in, many other tribes frequently made use of them (notably the Sioux and other tribes of the Great Plains), and to great effect

They know it's not true, but they put it in anyway...

SerapisIV · October 5, 2001, 16:17

Nice to see that North American political correctness beat out the Incas when deciding Civs

HalfLotus · October 5, 2001, 16:19

Quote:

Originally posted by SerapisIV
Nice to see that North American political correctness beat out the Incas when deciding Civs

How true.
I can't believe I'm looking at an Indian on a horse.

Dauphin · October 5, 2001, 16:21

This is even worse than the English/British debacle.

dennis580 · October 5, 2001, 16:24

Well you have to balance realism with gameplay. I sure most people have no idea that the Iroquois rarely used mounted warriors.

SerapisIV · October 5, 2001, 16:25

Yeah but most people are idiots.

Dauphin · October 5, 2001, 16:26

Could be interesting for a horse unit in a land that historically didn't have horses until the 16th Century.

Will the Earth map have horses in North America?

Satis5d · October 5, 2001, 16:26

Look guys, there was no way they were going to be able to handle this hot-potato without someone getting burned. The native-American issue is one that even the most politically correct stumble around in. Seems everyone's an expert in "Indian affairs" these days.

That said, I think this civ looks like one I'll consider playing as.

Mars · October 5, 2001, 16:32

How stupid. They shouldn't have given them a mounted unit

Satis5d · October 5, 2001, 16:32

Try not to forget that this is a game - not a history textbook.

dennis580 · October 5, 2001, 16:36

Well I guess that makes me a idiot too. Listen most people are not history experts.

Dauphin · October 5, 2001, 16:40

But why perpetuate a mistruth?

Why not educate people with things that were true, not what they think are true.

RedWhiteArcher · October 5, 2001, 16:42

I don't care if someone doesn't know history at all. There where NO I REAPEAT NO HORSES IN AMERICA until they where exported from Europe during the colonization. Its ok to have mounted unit if they somehow manage to get horses or play on random map. But this is a joke if the mounted unit is their UU.

Felch · October 5, 2001, 16:46

Actually there were American horses back in prehistoric times. Or rather relatives of horses, that were about the size of a typical dog. Nothing you could put mounted warriors on though.

FrostyBoy · October 5, 2001, 16:54

I know almost nothing about Indians, and even *I* thought it was weird.

Surely Firaxis studied before they created?

It's things like this that always make me skeptical about the rest of the game.

SerapisIV · October 5, 2001, 16:59

Quote:

Originally posted by dennis580
Well I guess that makes me a idiot too. Listen most people are not history experts.

Wooah...I wasn't getting personal. It's true though, how else can you explain Boy Bands?

Dauphin · October 5, 2001, 17:00

Quote:

Originally posted by RedWhiteArcher
Its ok to have mounted unit if they somehow manage to get horses or play on random map

As I said above, what happens on the Earth map? How can they build their UU?!?!?!

dennis580 · October 5, 2001, 17:03

Yea but at some point Indians got horses. I remember watching a movie called Custards Last Stand or something like that and the Indians rode horses.

SerapisIV · October 5, 2001, 17:05

The only reason why Native American tribes got horses was because the Spanish brought them over. There were no horses prior to the 1492 in the the Americas. Only mules

Dan Magaha FIRAXIS · October 5, 2001, 17:06

Quote:

Originally posted by RedWhiteArcher
I don't care if someone doesn't know history at all. There where NO I REAPEAT NO HORSES IN AMERICA until they where exported from Europe during the colonization. Its ok to have mounted unit if they somehow manage to get horses or play on random map. But this is a joke if the mounted unit is their UU.

There weren't any Americans in America until they were exported from Europe, either, but you can still start a game of Civ III as the Americans...

We wanted the Iroquois to be representative of all the indigenous tribes of North America. When you play the Iroquois, Sitting Bull, Red Cloud, and Tecumseh are some of the potential great leaders who may appear, even though none of them were Iroquois. This is not accidental, it's the best compromise.

Dan

RedWhiteArcher · October 5, 2001, 17:08

Big Crunch:
I'm 100% in the same line of thought. Looks like they won't get the accurate resources mapping at all.

dennis580:
They got horses at the point where Europeans came and this is the begining of the end. Surely it wasn't an early era like the decription says.

dennis580 · October 5, 2001, 17:10

I consider myself a casual history fan. Most of history knowledge is limted to the Histoy Channel, A&E, TLC and the Discovery Channel.

With the exception of Napoleon, who is my hero. I have search the internet for content on Napoleon and have thought several times about buying some books on Napoleon, but just never have got around to doing it.

RedWhiteArcher · October 5, 2001, 17:12

Quote:

There weren't any Americans in America until they were exported from Europe, either, but you can still start a game of Civ III as the Americans...

Good point but but this subject also brought many arguments if American Civ should be included. Obviously the greatest reason fot the inclusion is the market.

I will have no problems at all if the world map will not have horses as resources in America

Dan Magaha FIRAXIS · October 5, 2001, 17:13

Quote:

Originally posted by Big Crunch

As I said above, what happens on the Earth map? How can they build their UU?!?!?!

Why do you assume that there are no horses on the Earth map?

Dan

RedWhiteArcher · October 5, 2001, 17:16

Dan he obviously meant that how they will have horses if they play the Earth Map since if the resources will be placed acuratly there will be no horses in their continent.

Dan Magaha FIRAXIS · October 5, 2001, 17:25

Quote:

Originally posted by RedWhiteArcher
Dan he obviously meant that how they will have horses if they play the Earth Map since if the resources will be placed acuratly there will be no horses in their continent.

A-ha, but there are clearly horses on North America right now.

"But," you may say, "there were no horses until the 1500's when the Spanish brought them over."

This is true, but resources appear on the map when its corresponding technology has been discovered. So, if you're *really good*, you could concievably find Uranium in the 1500's, even though at that time it hadn't been discovered yet, much less refined and understood.

Dan

RedWhiteArcher · October 5, 2001, 17:28

How hard is it to discover Horseback riding? Why just not leave horses out of America but let them be generated there later when one of the resources on the map has expired?
Or maybe we should have an option of somehow moving the horses as a resource?

HisMajestyBOB · October 5, 2001, 17:34

Maybe we could say that its a what if horses never died out in N. America? Jeez, if you want a game that is very historical, get EU (well worth your money

)