Monarchy or Republic?

Xmudder · October 5, 2001, 21:04

Both Monarchy and Republic can be obtained early in the game; in fact, you have to obtain both of them to leave the ancient era. In Civ 2, Monarchy was superior in the early game, because you could support three free units and not lose 3 shields. Now that units cost Gold and not Shields, wouldn't Republic be more useful than Monarchy? The +1 trade per square will offset the cost of maintaining units.
I wonder what they did to balance Monarchy. 3 free units per city are quite useful, but boosting trade/commerce, and paying for your units from that, is far more useful. I also wonder what they did to make Republic a useful choice in the late game - in the new screenshot, it's 1760, they're researching Refining, I'm going to guess they have access to Democracy... what's so good about Republic?

connorkimbro · October 5, 2001, 21:07

remember, civ3 is going to be a different game. alot of things are going to be radically changed (trade) and some things will be completely new (culture) the civ2 models of government aren't going to fit the mechanics of civ3, therefor you can't really speculate about which is better, because we really have no idea of how the governments even work in civ3 yet.

Nemo · October 5, 2001, 21:07

republic was always better than monarchy. but putting them close together time wise is odd, albeit realistic. i, too, wonder how they will acomidate the use of monarchy when republic is also available. will monarchy be a quick jump instead of a time lasting governement? hmmm...

Christantine The Great · October 5, 2001, 21:12

Remember the Republic Senate. I hate that group of toga-wearing doves!

And the Republic has that unhappiness thing. They'll probably change that to units being unhappy if outside of your borders. Two points for Monarchy.

Republic is a bit superior to Democracy if your cities are close together for less corruption and if you have JS Bach, Sufferage, and Cure for Cancer with Shake's Theater in a big industrial city. With, effectively, a Colossus in every city you will pump out money and be able to use short, powerful wars to get what you want.

Inverse Icarus · October 5, 2001, 21:19

i dove for monarchy in civ2, then worked on philosophy, which ended up near republic. when i got republic, i usually had like 10-15 cities and i go into my pop boom

JellyDonut · October 5, 2001, 23:51

I usually went Despotism > Monarchy > Communism (if I want to win militarily) or Democracy (if I want to win by AC), but I think in Civ III it will be different so that you can choose Monarchy or Republic at about the same time, but your choice will depend mainly on the circumstances and your long-term plans, as each will have its pros and cons.

dainbramaged13 · October 5, 2001, 23:57

Quote:

Originally posted by Nemo
republic was always better than monarchy. but putting them close together time wise is odd, albeit realistic. i, too, wonder how they will acomidate the use of monarchy when republic is also available. will monarchy be a quick jump instead of a time lasting governement? hmmm...

lol i could never last a turn in republic
i am fully expansionist. you just cant say one is better than another. republic sucked ass for me because of the way i play.. maybe the way you play is different, but just dont go around declaring that one is better

JellyDonut · October 6, 2001, 00:09

Quote:

Originally posted by dainbramaged13
lol i could never last a turn in republic

Neither could I. Too much civil disorder

Nemo · October 6, 2001, 01:08

Quote:

Originally posted by dainbramaged13

lol i could never last a turn in republic
i am fully expansionist. you just cant say one is better than another. republic sucked ass for me because of the way i play.. maybe the way you play is different, but just dont go around declaring that one is better

yeah, we definately play differently then

i run for monarchy while building a defense. then i make a b-line for industrialization. but i stay with monarchy until i have womens sufferage...then i switch and stay with republic. (unless i have the statue of liberty, then i will end the game sooner by switching to and from fundamentalism

)

so, your right i should not declare one better than the other for by pure generalization. but for myself, that is how it is. sorry.

civcop · October 6, 2001, 01:22

As a conservative American, I view Monarchy as good and Republic as bad. Republic reminds me of liberal American politicians. The jerks in the Senate are always making peace with the most evil civs in the game and I'd like to strangle them for doing so just when I have the aggressive civ by the throat and am ready to off them. Shift+r is well used on my keyboard when I'm in Republic. I'm considering making a political contribution to the Hawk party this year.

Sarxis · October 6, 2001, 01:25

Quote:

Originally posted by connorkimbro
remember, civ3 is going to be a different game. alot of things are going to be radically changed (trade) and some things will be completely new (culture) the civ2 models of government aren't going to fit the mechanics of civ3, therefor you can't really speculate about which is better, because we really have no idea of how the governments even work in civ3 yet.

Exactly

I can't say this any better; so the quoting is justified.

Blake · October 6, 2001, 01:43

Elimination of pop-boom should help hurt Republic.

And speculation is pointless, goverments could presumably have all sorts of effects, indeed probably any effect seen so far in the unique civ attributes, then more. So goverments could (at a guess) effect the following
Build cost in categories (military, research, commerce, unit etc)
Growth
Unit Support Cost
Commerce
Unit Morale (experience)
Research rate
Police
Unihappiness (war discontent)
Pollution
....

JellyDonut · October 6, 2001, 01:48

Quote:

Originally posted by civcop
As a conservative American, I view Monarchy as good and Republic as bad. Republic reminds me of liberal American politicians. The jerks in the Senate are always making peace with the most evil civs in the game and I'd like to strangle them for doing so just when I have the aggressive civ by the throat and am ready to off them. Shift+r is well used on my keyboard when I'm in Republic. I'm considering making a political contribution to the Hawk party this year.

I once took a political quiz on the Net to see what political category fit you the best. Revolutionary Monarchist was last on the list, so now my friends and I always joke around about me being a revolutionary monarchist. I also view Republic as bad IRL because I'm an egalitarian, and all the other systems are bad too (keep in mind Firaxis' definition of Communism is similar to, say, Stalin's or Mao's [blech!] and Democracy is defined as a modern Republic, don't ask me what Republic means to them)

On topic, I don't choose governments based on what I like and don't like in real life. I choose them depending on the circumstances of the game and my long-term plans. I hate fundamentalism, though. Only 50% science? Come on! I'm glad they got rid of it.