Ming! Polls can't count as new threads! - Page 3

War4ever · October 23, 2001, 19:13

Quote:

Originally posted by rah
Ozzie has

3. accused Ming of blowing him off. (must get that image out of my head)

*snicker*

ic two issues here....... the moderator enforcing rules as he has for over three years now with generally good results......

individuals who think they are above the rules and i am not singling out anyone..... this occurs in the OTF as well.....and is rampant throughout this forum

its oil and water.....

complain to Mark or Dan..... if he disagrees with Ming then you win and its poll heaven...... if you lose ....then drop it..... and try to respect what Ming does around here as it is a thankless job....

Do you really think Ming gets off on banning people, reducing post counts, and closing down threads.......

I don't ...in fact it interupts the weekly a$$kicking i give him in civ

That all said..... i don't think we need to waste more space with threads about rules....... if its not in the FAQ and you don't like how the moderator has ruled....email the owners and i am sure they will sort it out.....

The owners support Mings judgement most of the time..... so ..... your going to need a pretty compelling case to win this one i think

The Capo · October 23, 2001, 21:49

As I've said before, and will continue to say. I think Ming is an *******, he's very abrasive when he does what he has to do, and sometimes favors rules over common sense, which can seem overbearing at times in a forum like this.

But although I'm totally in support of the Ozman on this one, I'm going to have to say that Ming has seen things come and go, Ming has delt with a lot of crap similar to this (and believe me, HOTW2 has been one of the biggest contributors). One can imagine that it is quite the chore enforcing the rules that he is supposed to enforce, it is his job and we shouldn't hold that against him on a personal level.

I think the problem Ozzy has here, and I share the same mindset as far as that goes, is one that would probably read like this; Civ2 - Multiplaying is my niche, this is where I post, this is the forum that I like to "be" in, I learned a genre that I enjoy (Diplogaming) in THIS forum, hard work has been put into this diplogame easily by over 30 individuals, its not that its more important its that a lot of hard work, LITERALLY, has went into this game and continues to do so, in the interest of the game (which many, if not all, of its contributors LIKE to consider a revolutionary game) I'd like to impliment a new feature which would allow more than seven people to be involved, this has also revived my interest. A poll can not be change once it has begun, therefor numerous polls are required.

I think that sums it up, I may have left a few detailed points out but that is what Ozzy is saying in general. It is difficult for him to span forums (or sites for that matter) because this game was born and bred here in the MP forums. I would be more than happy to move it to CivFanatics if I didn't share the same loyalty to Apolyton (or more specifically the MP forums) that I have, I am sure Ozzy feels the same way.

But Ozzy, this is a plea to you and in effect the entire HOTW2 crew; if Apolyton isn't going to allow us to creatively expand upon this game and through that its genre CFC has offered to accomodate us. I have spoken to them and they have told me that they would allow us to do what we must in order to persue our creative avenues, they said they welcome HOTW2 as the figurehead of diplogames (which they want to start doing regularly over there). Despite how loyal we may be to Apolyton, they are not loyal to us, therefore I suggest we make the move.

Maybe the community there isn't as established as this one is, sure, but you've gotta start somewhere. From where the Capo's sitting it looks like a good idea and it would offer HOTW2 a very nice change of pace and possibly a revitalization in our game's purpose.

Remember guys, this game isn't about the end, its about the story; The journey IS the thing!

OzzyKP · October 24, 2001, 22:01

Capo you did a good job of describing my feelings on the topic.

The Apolyton folk have pissed off many people but yet I know many people here, like Capo said I feel comfortable here. Right now i'm in favor of keeping the main thread here and putting all our side threads at CivFanatics, i'm thinking that will be good to get both crowds interested in the game.

I just popped into CivFanatics the other day and someone was trying to get a Diplogame started, it seems the will is there but they don't have any Diplo-vets to guide them through. Maybe if we go over there we can introduce a new group of people to the genre. I don't know, i'll deffinatly have to think about a total move but I don't the nervous feeling I am getting by posting here feeling that any minute the thread is going to be shut down and deleted and our history will be gone. We deffinatly need to back-up the HOTW2 thread to be safe from any Mod purges.

rah · October 25, 2001, 09:58

Quote:

Originally posted by OzzyKP
I don't know, i'll deffinatly have to think about a total move but I don't the nervous feeling I am getting by posting here feeling that any minute the thread is going to be shut down and deleted and our history will be gone. We deffinatly need to back-up the HOTW2 thread to be safe from any Mod purges.

Talk about Paranoia, geeze.

Or is that comment just to try to solicit sympathy? It didn't. It was just plain silly.

RAH
"Mod Purges"

OzzyKP · October 25, 2001, 11:19

He deleted my second poll. I still have yet to receive an explanation for that. Who knows what he may decide to destroy now.

And Rah I really have no idea who you are and I really don't want your sympathy, I don't give a damn what you think of me or us.

Ming · October 25, 2001, 11:51

Quote:

Originally posted by OzzyKP
He deleted my second poll. I still have yet to receive an explanation for that. Who knows what he may decide to destroy now.

In case you have forgotten... It was deleted because you violated the rule on multiple threads about your game... It is the only thread that has been deleted. But I forget.. you don't think a poll is the same as a thread

You make it sound like I have a personal vendetta against you.
That I'm purosely going out of my way and destroying the history of your game for personal reasons... get a life.

Again... if that was the case, this thread would never have lasted more than one post... I would have deleted ALL your threads.
I would have restricted you for being a jerk.... but none of that has happened... has it.

YOU BROKE THE RULES, so I deleted one of your polls to make it clear to you... since you obviously had repeatedly disregarded the rules. Again... you deserve no better treatment than anybody else should have.... live with it.

You have stated that you don't like my attitude... take a look at your own before you cast a stone.

I have nothing personal against you or your game... However, if you continue to break the rules... I will continue to take action against rule breakers... which is my job.

rah · October 25, 2001, 12:10

Quote:

Originally posted by OzzyKP
He deleted my second poll. I still have yet to receive an explanation for that. Who knows what he may decide to destroy now.

And Rah I really have no idea who you are and I really don't want your sympathy, I don't give a damn what you think of me or us.

GOOD, now you know how most of us feel about your damn game.

And no one here begrudged you a thread and a poll for your game. We just get annoyed when you feel that's not enough because your game is more important than ours, and then whine out it. The second you whine about it here, I'm entitled to voice my opinion since we ALL share this forum.

RAH

deity · October 26, 2001, 02:32

I can't believe all this.

We don't think HOTW2 is more imporant than any other game and the subtext in the way you guys write is as though you are jeolous we have such a great and intensely enjoyable game going. I enjoy your threads. Why don't you guys get a life and be a bit more positive and encouraging about others civ games?

I just don't get it... and where are the Mods rules written down? Are they? Sorry if I missed it but rules SEEM to be made on the run.

I started a new thread for HOTW2, thinking we had rweached the post limit and Ming closes it down, then says we can have 1000 posts, not 150....

My earlier thread was not properly answered I don't think.

I find it a bit depressing and oppressive here now.

I know capo, ozzy and drake and others get excited but so what?

There is abuse of power going on here, I'm sure of it.

deity · October 26, 2001, 02:37

mod·er·a·tor (mŏd'ə-râ'tər)
n.
One that moderates, as:
One that arbitrates or mediates.
One who presides over a meeting, forum, or debate.
The officer who presides over a synod or general assembly of the Presbyterian Church.
Physics. A substance, such as water or graphite, that is used in a nuclear reactor to decrease the speed of fast neutrons and increase the likelihood of fission.

----

Think about it!

Rasputin · October 26, 2001, 02:49

lets get it straight. not all HOTW2 players are pissed off with the mods over this isseu ( i am pissed off being regarded as a spammer but i cna live with that) so lets not generalise with comments.

This is th elongest running game around (some think that is the best reason not to paly civ) so it shows the passio nthat the palyers feel, so please forgibe them if they post some abusive posts, I dont condone them i jsut understnad them.

Ming i reaaly think this debate has gone on long enough and it reaaly isnt going anywhere, i would suggest closing this thread to prevetn others adding their opinions (which when i do it is regarded as spamming, but when others do it it is regardedas good posts)

The HOTW2 thread will remain here and we wil ltkae the polls elsewhere.

Thankyou

The Capo · October 26, 2001, 02:58

Its not that there isn't a whole lot going on in the MP forums, there is nothing going on.

There are other games, the HOTW2 group (Deity, Rasputin, Drake, Ozzy, Prometheus, Belinda and myself to make things clear) is enjoying this game. I know for a fact that more than half of us actually take time to think about what we put into our posts for anyone who wants to read them, I know for a fact that people DO read them, and I know for a fact that when our website was up it had amazing hits.

I am not saying our game is superior to any other game, our game is the same as any other game as far as importance, and let's face it; no game is important in the sense of the word. This is entertainment. But at the same time we put TONS of effort into this game, I post regularly and I worked for hours on the mod for this game just to make sure it was impecable. The entire group collaborated for a good MONTH on exactly how the rules would play out and where everyone would be. Pains were taken by Drake to put up a website for this game in order to offer much more in depth explainations. Our group, BY FAR, has outposted any other diplogame, and if you take out all of the spam any other game there has been.

The group has been working on ways to make diplogaming better, to make it more personal and to realize what diplogaming was created to realize. Now I know the majority of Apolytoners don't give a rat's ass about diploaming. But the community IS there, sadly the posts in the MP forums are not, therefore we are utilizing a rule (as Deity has pointed out; which is not written anywhere at all) that is very general and doesn't take into consideration a plethora of variables, for the sole purpose of protecting posts which DO NOT EXIST.

That is a very stupid thing.

The group is willing to accept the fact that we will no longer be allowed more than one "thread." But regardless, SOMETHING should change. The rule serves no purpose at all at this juncture, the rule isn't written anywhere, when I signed up for Apolyton never was I told that this rule was in effect. I read Apolyton and click its links every now and again so it can get good ratings, no I don't deserve special treatment for this, but I should at least be allowed to enjoy the forums and to enjoy the game I come here to enjoy.

Now some stupid and pointless rule is being used to help spoil this game, its a good damn game. It may not be the best played game out there, but this is one f*ckin amazing game. We are doing things that have never been done on such a scale, but its okay.

We have no problem putting our stuff elsewhere, everyone's cool with that. But regardless, something should change.

Peace.

Ming · October 26, 2001, 07:35

Quote:

Originally posted by deity
There is abuse of power going on here, I'm sure of it.

Just enforcing the rules that have been in place for years...
One game... One thread...

I bet when you get pulled over for speeding you blame the cop

Hydey · October 26, 2001, 08:07

Its my Birthday today.

I was feeling SHlTY because I had to work 12 hours and I missed out on going out for tea tonight due to late finish.

I came and read this forum and all my problems seem so insignificant when compared to the problems you guys have .
Ming is picking on People again enforcing these rules which we all should know, Rah is stiring the pot , Raz is spamming

, Deity is whining, Ozzy and the Capo are firing up and the rest are adding there 2 cents or throwing petrol on the fire .

I am so glad that the problems in my life are so small and numerous to prevent having such huge problems such as whether we can have 1 thread and 1 poll or 2 threads or even more polls.

Thanks guys .

Life is back in perspective now

rah · October 26, 2001, 08:44

One last stir and then I'm done.

Quote:

Originally posted by deity
I can't believe all this.

We don't think HOTW2 is more imporant than any other game and the subtext in the way you guys write is as though you are jeolous we have such a great and intensely enjoyable game going. I enjoy your threads. Why don't you guys get a life and be a bit more positive and encouraging about others civ games?

Jeolous

I can't imagine a more boring way to play the game. But that's why the game is flexible. So we can all enjoy the game in our own way.

The importance that you guys are putting into the extra threads leads me to believe that you are the ones that need to "get a life".

But if I implied that you thought your game was more importance than others, I probably read more into your comments, which apparently seems to be untrue, and for that, I apologize.

On the other hand, I'm glad you guys are getting so much fun out your game. You enjoy civ your way, and I'll enjoy it my way. As long as we all enjoy the game, fine.

I have no problem with you argueing/asking for clarification of the rules here either. But when you start using terms like "blowing us off, abuse of power, overstating the importance of your game to the community, etc." Expect there to be some dissagreement/discussion.

Ok, I'm done.

RAH

Hydey · October 26, 2001, 09:28

Thanks RAH

Chris 62 · October 26, 2001, 11:17

Ming accused of being a tyrant....

Rah stiring discontent...

Ozzy being pationate for his game...

Capo trying to reason with all....

Ras spamming and spelling things badly (sorry Ras, couldn't resist!

)...

Actually Ras saying to take the game elsewhere...

Drake rebelling against percieved double standards...

Diety accusing people of not having lives...

Hydey mocking the players....

All this, and so much more!

now THIS is a thread!

The answer is simple, as my fellow CFC mod SunTzu said, bring the polls to Civfanatics, and keep your thread here, and everyone is happy. We don't care how many polls you put up about your game, so go for it.

I think this is your best course, not fighting with Mingy and the boys, but that is up to you guys, it's your game.

War4ever · October 26, 2001, 19:33

Deity no one asked you to read our boring threads..... so pi$$ off..... follow the rules.... when i step out of bounds Ming snaps me back into place..... thats the way of the boards.....

Deity if you don't like it you can take your slow connection to another forum

SunTzu · October 26, 2001, 23:10

AoA's right, why such hatred War4Ever?
Don't be

Be

deity · October 26, 2001, 23:21

I was joking War. I actually find all threads quite interesting, even the lame ones

There is not a clearly advertised code of laws for posting or a code of conduct for moderators. If there are can they please be posted. As i see it rules are made on the run and you are thrown in the slammer for breaking rules you don't know about! Interesting that the police analogy was used. It proves my point that the approach taken is one of 'policing' yet even the police have a strict set of laws to manage that are passed by parliament who are elected by the people.

I thought moderators were there to keep out porn, bad language like yours, false claims of cheating etc. Also if I was a moderator I would adopt a positive approach that nurtured the game and the enthusiasm of the players.

Ming, can you post your rules here please?

Do all moderators adhere to the same code or is there no consistency across forum?

Does Mark G know/support you standards?

Forgive me if I've got this wrong but the feeling I get is that there is a clique of players in the Ming group who are an Apolyton culture that discusses what's the go on the boards. Based on this Ming makes decisions and then acts.
It seemed he suddenly decided to increase threads from 150 posts to 1000 posts and then jumps on someone for starting a new thread after 150 posts!

Also, when did this one thread per game start?
I've never been aware of it and even if it did exist, once we got the poll device surely some flexibility can be allowed? The poll I posted was not a HOTW2 specific poll but was derived from the HOTW2 game. Ming closed it. Ming allowed ozzy's first poll vote but as soon as my broader one surfaced Ming said that he'd been nice to allow one but no more! How do I know when a moderator is being 'nice', which smacks of a grace and favour approach, or making decisions based on consistent rules??

I'll take War's advice and do more of my posting at Civ Fanatics with links here sometimes.

I know there is a strong layer of humour in all this but underneath it all I'm trying to finger a very serious issue and pose some questions.

War4ever · October 27, 2001, 02:16

Hey Deity, i don't think your threads are boring

perhaps one poll every two weeks per game could be allowed for diplos.... either that or we need a diplo forum.... no one wants you to really leave of course...... perhaps a thread starting a debate about a seperate civ 2 mp diplomatic forum could be established and maybe we would see an increase in these types of games.... but in a seperate forum.... it wouldn't take much to moderate...just a sign stating : Enter At Own Risk!

Ming · October 27, 2001, 03:07

Quote:

Originally posted by deity
There is not a clearly advertised code of laws for posting or a code of conduct for moderators. If there are can they please be posted.

One more time... One thread per game... A rule that has been in place for as long as I can remember. No game is allowed more... it's that simple. the rest follows the posting FAQ...

As far as the conduct of moderators... the conduct is simple... we enforce the rules. If you don't agree, you can always bring it to the attention of the admin.

Rasputin · October 28, 2001, 23:05

gee this is incredible, not only is the HOTW2 thread one of the biggest threads in Apolyton, but the thread discussing what we can and cannot do on the thread boards with HOTW is now the second longest thread in Civ 2 MP...

i think this shows the true deep feelings of those involved with this issue.

Obviously ming can only do as he is programmed to do, rules are rules...

and Rah (who i seriously think is really Evil Mings nicer DL not his twin

) keeps throwing fuel on a fire that should have gone out long ago.

Peace people... lets jsut paly the game and have fun...

Ming · October 29, 2001, 09:52

Quote:

Originally posted by Rasputin
gee this is incredible, not only is the HOTW2 thread one of the biggest threads in Apolyton, but the thread discussing what we can and cannot do on the thread boards with HOTW is now the second longest thread in Civ 2 MP...

Peace people... lets jsut paly the game and have fun...

While I will disagree with your first point since I see two other threads on page one that are longer... I will agree with your last point.

Keep on Civin'