FMKs Screenshots! - Page 2

klesh · October 30, 2001, 21:31

From what i can tell, there is no mention of events in the editor. It is rather odd though, for there is not even the slightest mention of even scenarios at all or anything having to do with them in the printed manual. Nothing! Not even a bad chapter at least like in Civ2. The manual for Civ3 is pretty much the same size as my MGE one, 235 pages through to the index. I don't know why nothing is included about creation.

Anyway. I recall someone asking particularly about the units. Well, let me tell you. There are individual folders for each unit. They consist of seperate wav files, as well as what I assume are seperate animation graphics. You know, like if you let the guy stand idle for a bit, i think the scout unit perhaps... he goes for his canteen and has a drink. I have attatched a shot of all the contents of the Russian Cossack. There are several variations however!!! Some folders have several sounds for individual units. I will attatch a few to show the depth of creatability of individual units. Perhaps too much customization here....5-6 seperate wav's?

Steve Clark · October 30, 2001, 21:32

I know, Xin. Here's the fundamental question I've been asking. If a custom dialog or message box is displayed based on an action in a scenario (like capturing a key city or special unit), what is the mechanism for making that happen?

klesh · October 30, 2001, 21:34

The Winamp Media Files are .wav's.
Here we see only some of the many animations for a worker...
dig mines, irrigate etc...

Steve Clark · October 30, 2001, 21:38

FMK, you are doing great work. But the question remains, can you build a "scenario" worth playing? What does Firaxis call a scenario???

klesh · October 30, 2001, 21:49

I dont know steve.

The thing is...there are apparently soo many little gfx files now. It would be tremendous work to get something to look professional and consistant..and yet look differenty than the default (in terms of menu's and colours and things of the such). It is a monster of a game. My computer barely handles it with 16 Civs going. The music crackles and pops when I click buttons and such. It is a more more in depth game from Civ2. Making 'scenarios' as we used to know them, would be very very difficult, imho.

Here we see some of the list of items within the terrain folder. Note here we are now using PCX Image Documents...
:Hmmm:

Xin Yu · October 30, 2001, 21:57

Quote:

Originally posted by Steve Clark
Here's the fundamental question I've been asking. If a custom dialog or message box is displayed based on an action in a scenario (like capturing a key city or special unit), what is the mechanism for making that happen?

Those are build-in events which do not allow user input.

techumseh · October 30, 2001, 22:08

quote:

Originally posted by techumseh
Civ3....................49.99
Civ3 Scenarios......49.99
Civ3 Multi-player...49.99
Civ3 Gold Edition...49.99

Get the picture?

I hate to quote myself, but it seems this really is the scenario (so to speak). Remember the original Civ2 game.txt file had lots of references to multi-player, but it couldn't be used until MGE was marketed. Civ2 was designed to be multi-player from the start, but that feature was TURNED OFF to force us to buy MGE. I suspect it's the same here. No scenarios, no events - wait for the upgrade CD. In a year or so, for another $49.99. And a year after that, another one with multi-player for another $49.99. And so on...

Steve Clark · October 30, 2001, 22:10

I may not be using the correct terminology, sorry. Here's what I mean...

Quote:

@IF
UNITKILLED
unit=Man'o'War
attacker=English
defender=Americans
@THEN
TEXT
English sink an American Man'o'War! 600 gold was siezed from the ship before it sank and added to the English treasury.
ENDTEXT
CHANGEMONEY
receiver=English
amount=600
PLAYWAVFILE
Shipsink.wav

Quote:

@IF
CITYTAKEN
city=London
attacker=French
defender=English
@THEN
TEXT
London has fallen into the hands of their long time enemy the French! Now it is only a matter of time before all of England is in French hands. The French celebrate while the English mobilize what they have left to retake their prized city, before the sun finaly sets on the British Empire.
ENDTEXT
MOVEUNIT
unit=ANYUNIT
numbertomove=ALL
owner=English
maprect
93,1, 78,0, 78,30, 93,31
moveto
91,19
@ENDIF

techumseh · October 30, 2001, 22:27

It's (semi) official:

http://apolyton.net/forums/showthrea...threadid=31200

Does anyone want to do anything about it?

DarthVeda · October 30, 2001, 23:33

Read my lips:

THERE ARE NO EVENTS.

Firaxis has ****ed all of us mod makers in the ass!

H Tower · October 30, 2001, 23:40

were any scenarios included w/ the game?

techumseh · October 31, 2001, 00:29

I just picked up the first copy in Edmonton, just out of the packing crate. I tried a few turns. It really reminds me of Call to Power with respect to the general look of it and the interface. Which is why I never even finished a game of CTP.

The tech tree, units and improvements are pretty much the same as Civ2, with a few new additions. Same old, same old.

There is definitely NOT an events editor, or multiplayer. Interestingly, there IS a text file, called "Jackal" which seems designed to control some aspects of multi-player games. So perhaps it IS designed for multi-player and they've turned it off, as they did with Civ2

So I'm disappointed, but I'll give it a more complete play through before deciding whether to consign it to my discard shelf.

klesh · October 31, 2001, 00:55

Quote:

Originally posted by H Tower
were any scenarios included w/ the game?

Nope, there are however 2 world maps

Gee, its almost like Christmas

klesh · October 31, 2001, 00:58

oart of the opening menu... sure looks like it comes with scen's huh?

ravagon · October 31, 2001, 01:31

Quote:

Originally posted by techumseh

There is definitely NOT an events editor, or multiplayer. Interestingly, there IS a text file, called "Jackal" which seems designed to control some aspects of multi-player games. So perhaps it IS designed for multi-player and they've turned it off, as they did with Civ2

Could it be that they've just ignored references to events at present, while still including them in the game?
Could somebody try inserting a civ2 events file using the old macro language with a simple text message to be brought up if a particular unit is killed and then kill one of those units or something (I'm desparate

).

No events at all would be a major disappointment.

techumseh · October 31, 2001, 02:23

Quote:

Originally posted by ravagon

Could it be that they've just ignored references to events at present, while still including them in the game?
Could somebody try inserting a civ2 events file using the old macro language with a simple text message to be brought up if a particular unit is killed and then kill one of those units or something (I'm desparate

).

No events at all would be a major disappointment.

A good idea Ravagon, and worth a shot. Perhaps some of our more skilled colleagues could find a way to activate events and/or multilplayer. Anyone game to try? It would serve Infogrames/Firaxis right if they ended up losing $millions in undeserved profits on some "Gold Edition" or "Test of Patience."

BTW, here is a fraction of the "Jackal" text file:

#FILEFIND_NOCD
#xs 320
#caption Sid Meier's CIVILIZATION III
#button Retry
The CIVILIZATION III CD-ROM was not detected. Some game features
will not function without the CD in the drive unless you have
performed a "Complete Install".

#NETCONNECT_JOIN_OR_CREATE
#xs 320
#caption Host or Join Session
Would you like to host a new game or join an existing one?

Host
Join

#SELECTSERVICE
#xs 320
#caption MultiPlayer Setup
Select a service...

#FILEWIN
FILE NAME

Henrik · October 31, 2001, 03:37

The Jackal.txt is a leftover from SMAC, thats the SMAC engine (SMAC had MP, but not events).
So I don't think you will have any luck toggling stuff there.

And about events

This is an exerpt of a chat, posted by Locutus on CivFanatics (although it originaly comes from the apolyton chat yesterday) :

Quote:

"[LoQtus] does Civ3 have an event/macro/scripting language of any sort or anything even vaguely resembling it?

[connorkimbro] An addition to LoQtus's question. . if there isn't one yet, how easy would it be to add one, and is that something that is planned?

[LoQtus] that's exactly what I wanted to add myself too

[Mike_Breitkreutz_FIRAXIS] A scripting language was not implemented for civ3 because we do not have any in-game support for events. I may or may not add scripting language support in the future but it will most likely be more of a visual script akin to StarCraft's editor."

kobayashi · October 31, 2001, 03:39

I KNEW it. I just Knew it!

No support for Scenarios.

50 graphic files to make a single unit.

Well looks like its back to Civ2 (Didn't we learn our lesson from ToT, CTP etc.)

ravagon · October 31, 2001, 04:57

Words fail me ......

Xin Yu · October 31, 2001, 05:28

Quote:

Originally posted by techumseh
Civ3....................49.99
Civ3 Scenarios......49.99
Civ3 Multi-player...49.99
Civ3 Gold Edition...49.99

Get the picture?

Or, it could be:

Civ3....................49.99
Firaxis aquired by Microsoft
All Civ3 team members layed off
Some team members join BigHugeGames
Microsoft sells Firaxis part to BigHugeGames
Civ3: Multiplayer becomes a project of BigHuge
--------

SetuSinger · October 31, 2001, 05:42

No Events in Civ3?????
I think, we should forget about creating planed civ2 scenarios in civ3, like some people wanted to do, because with no events, they'll gonna be very booooooorinng!

Case · October 31, 2001, 05:59

This may be something which has already been answered, but is it possible to place units, cities, etc to create basic scenarios? Or are we, to use an Aussie term, completly rooted?

(translation: completly f**ked)

Gramphos · October 31, 2001, 07:28

Henrik, how did you get your hands on Civ3?

Henrik · October 31, 2001, 07:52

Quote:

Originally posted by Gramphos
Henrik, how did you get your hands on Civ3?

I didnt, as the thread name sugests, this is FMKs shots

I posted most of them for him.

Gramphos · October 31, 2001, 08:02

Quote:

Originally posted by Henrik

I didnt, as the thread name sugests, this is FMKs shots

I posted most of them for him.

Thread names, pah (I followed a link.)

klesh · October 31, 2001, 09:39

it really is disapointing. But you guys, if you play the game, you'll see that I almost wouldn't want to play a scen on Civ3!!! So far, its so choppy and takes so long, I feel like io am playing CivII for Playstation. I can't imagine what it would be like with hundreds of tanks from the start. At least I can continue with Stalingrad on CivII and I dont have to upgrade it.

I think they really really turned alot of would-be loyal scenario makers off.... waaaaaaaaaaaaay off.

-FMK.

DarthVeda · October 31, 2001, 12:14

Words defy the anger I have towards Firaxis right now... they flubbed even bigger than Acitivision with the original CTP. Their oversite is... simply astounding!

CTP2 however, was a good game, and looks to be better than Civ3. It is superior in all respects in scenario making (perhaps aside from ease of use), and has a very, VERY extensive macro language (so extensive as to make it unfriendly). I've just never had time to experiment with it because I like Civ2's ease of use and I'm STILL working on Kyokujitsu

I like ToT, and I think it will be the safe haven for we mod makers who want more than Civ2 but are fed up at Civ3's inept creation.

Viva la Civ2!!! I guess we have to wait for CTP3 or Civ4!

Case · October 31, 2001, 17:46

Quote:

Originally posted by Field Marshal Klesh
it really is disapointing. But you guys, if you play the game, you'll see that I almost wouldn't want to play a scen on Civ3!!! So far, its so choppy and takes so long, I feel like io am playing CivII for Playstation. I can't imagine what it would be like with hundreds of tanks from the start. At least I can continue with Stalingrad on CivII and I dont have to upgrade it.

I think they really really turned alot of would-be loyal scenario makers off.... waaaaaaaaaaaaay off.

-FMK.

FMK, how does your computer compare with the minumum requirements for Civ 3?

RobRoy · October 31, 2001, 18:33

Quote:

Originally posted by Case
This may be something which has already been answered, but is it possible to place units, cities, etc to create basic scenarios? Or are we, to use an Aussie term, completly rooted?

(translation: completly f**ked)

Sorry...completely rooted!

The lack of an event support is just the tip of the iceburg. Much more fundamental is the complete inability to place units and cities on a map. Unless there is an undocumented cheat mode hiding somewhere, scenarios just aren't feasible.

Some interesting modpacks are possible, but all you can do is monkey with the rules and specify the starting location of a civ (and even that appears to be randomized).

Map creation ability is decent, but irrelevant without scenario tools. If you hadn't heard, no worthwhile maps are included, and certainly no scenarios - two lame earth maps, masquerading as "scenarios", render the western hemisphere somewhat okay, but everything else is awful. But this is minor compared to the inability to create scenarios.

I, too, regret not waiting. The game is otherwise an adequately rendered facelift for Civ2 (but it is not as much an improvement over CivII as CivII was over the original Civ). Losing multi-player functionality (which I was aware of before I bought the game) and scenario support (which I was not aware of before I bought the game) are hardlly worth the new features you get in CivIII, though, IMHO. Most of the changes appear to be basic rules changes with the exception of the different mechanisms for diplomacy and trade. I never get real excited about graphics, anyway, and can't judge these, but they don't look as complicated as ToT graphics were from a scenario creation perspective (assuming the other elements of scenario creation are enable sometime soon).

Me, I'll probably keep the game, rather than trying to return it...but I doubt I'll keep it on my hard drive after fiddling around for a few weeks...I suspect I'll find EU or some good ole fashioned CivII scenarios will have more recurring interest than the new features in CivIII.

So, BeBro, don't slack off on that update for Cross and Crescent...ya hear! Let me know if you need some playtest help...I should have some free time in the next few weeks.

Case · October 31, 2001, 18:51

Quote:

Sorry...completely rooted!

I thought so

This is a very big disapointment - I may wait untill Firaxis release a scenario/MP pack next year before buying the game