Deity settings for scenarios

Exile · January 3, 2001, 01:17

OK, I created a small scenario (small map, 7 civs, customized graphics, simplified tech tree, locked govts) but set the original parameters for "deity" level play. After watching it play out several times, I noticed that the AIs really do go for the throat at the high settings. A 20-city empire was gobbled up by its neighbors on either side in about 60 turns. That seems pretty quick. It seems that Jesus Munoz Fernandez' comment about the higher complexity settings is correct. Anybody else have something to add?

Wrestling w/whatsit,
Exile

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Lost in America
"a freaking mastermind." --Stefu
"or a very good liar." --Stefu

Snog · January 4, 2001, 09:31

Could you provide a link to that comment? Are you talking about a scenario you created starting at deity level, and now the AI seem to play better even at the lower settings? I have always happened to do exactly that with my scenarios but i wasn't sure if it made a difference.

This doesn't have to do with the fact that the computer cheats at deity level does it? You're talking about the lower levels, too, right?

Exile · January 4, 2001, 12:53

Yes, that is exactly what I am saying. I created a small scenario at deity level and then, upon playtesting it and specifically watching for more effective play from the AIs, noticed that the AIs WERE playing more effectively. More aggressively, more intelligently, and with a ruthless determination to exterminate their foes. Also; I was testing this small scenario on prince, and I almost always play scenarios on prince that are created w/prince initial settings. So playing a scen created on deity but played on prince, was striking.

This seems like a trivial issue, until you think about the variant results of the initial game settings. For example, if you want a "limited war" mentality among your AIs, then prince setting seems to work. If you want a "jihad" mentality among your AIs, then creating the scenario on the deity setting seems to be the way. I don't know about everyone else, but what is most frustrating in an historical scenario is the failure of the AIs to "cooperate" in one's attempt to recreate history. If the initial game settings DO effect the AI's "killer instinct" I would like to know about it prior to any more designing.

Comments?

Wrestling yatatatata,
Exile

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Lost in America
"a freaking mastermind." --Stefu
"or a very good liar." --Stefu
[This message has been edited by Exile (edited January 04, 2001).]
[This message has been edited by Exile (edited January 04, 2001).]
[This message has been edited by Exile (edited January 04, 2001).]

Snog · January 5, 2001, 05:14

I looked into a bit, and now I'm pretty sure that the game has no recollection of the difficulty level a scenario was created under. The only difficulty level it knows is the one you are currently playing.

The default difficulty level is always the one you were using when you last saved the scenario.

So that leads me to believe that if you go to start a scenario and the dot is sitting in the deity box, but you change it to say, king, the program will now consider the default difficulty level to be king. Then there can be no effect from what the previous default difficulty level was.

[This message has been edited by Snog (edited January 05, 2001).]

Exile · January 5, 2001, 09:14

You could well be correct. The viciousness of the AI that I've seen could be due to the artificial effects of higher settings; less production necessary to turn out units, etc.

But I wish that I knew that for certain. In an email from J. M. Fernandez, he made the comment that I should have designed a scenario on the Deity setting rather than the prince setting. Now, I thought, what difference does it make? But then he mentioned something about civil unrest. I have forgotten the details (and my email service erases messages after a few days so I cannot retrieve his original statement), but it seems that, for some purposes, using the deity setting when designing DOES change things. Certain knowledge would be preferable, however, to the sort of "feel for the game" type knowledge I using.

Salutations,
Exile

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Lost in America
"a freaking mastermind." --Stefu
"or a very good liar." --Stefu

SCDARS · January 6, 2001, 01:10

The point is, at higher levels people are not as content as they are on Chieftain for example. So if you create a scn. as deity you have designed under prince, he is likely to get BIG problems with civil unrest, especially in his first turn.

That is the reason why you schould always create scenarios using deity, if you want to assure that the senario starter won't have such happiness problems.
But even then you should keep in mind that the happiness for AI civs is calculated different. This means you must "change human player" before you go through the cities to check civil unrest....

P.S.: One can even add "higher" difficulcy levels by adding further lines to the entry in game.txt

Snog · January 6, 2001, 01:28

Yes, SCDARS has just reminded me why I always create the scenarios with deity level first. It is to make sure that no player ever has to start a game in the midst of civil unrest, no matter what level he chooses.

So I believe it is wise to begin creation at the hardest level you choose to offer, if for no other reason than this.