new type of tribe

krakenkiller · July 11, 2000, 19:02

I think that a new type of civilization might be useful: a harsh land tribe. they would fill lands never occupied like mountains or deserts with harsh terrain bonuses and high mobility. because historically tribes like the mongols in civ2 operated in settlements that were not permaent due to the nature of the plains, which did not support year round cultivation.
maybe it is possible to give these barbarian civs a way of moving their settlements, maybe with a bonus on plains and weakness in scientific growth, to parallel their historic weaknesses. probably controlled by AI, they would periodically swoop down on the agricutural civs. they should have full diplomatic capabilities, exchanging fast mercenary units for money, food.
new unit: encampment- which has normal city manufacturing caps but limitations on non plain lands.
this civ might be useful in desert or harsher land types which are usually wasted,plugging up the vast siberian forests or himalayas.
feel free to volunteer comments or suggestions.

Napoleon I · July 11, 2000, 19:32

Krakenkiller:

There was the idea of instituting nomad tribes, and there was a thread in this forum that was discussing it. I'll try to find it and bump it up so you can read it and see if your ideas agree with the ideas expressed in there.

Tell us what you think about it.

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Napoleon I

July 12, 2000, 02:29

Mountain Peoples? Like Tibetans, those people who built great citadels. Some harsh areas have stationary settlements, the Incas are another example.

However the encampment is a good idea, perhaps it could have a 'protection area', which, if you enter, it may create some warrior units and attack.

phunny pharmer · July 12, 2000, 11:52

Are you talking about a separate civ or mobile huts?

I think that the huts were supposed to represent weaker factions. However, they don't do a very good job...

Napoleon I · July 12, 2000, 13:04

I would think that this idea would be useful to incorporate in the game in the form of passive barbarians. These barbarians would not be able to produce settlers, instead they would start out with a predetemined number of weak units that would occupy a certain area and a few cities that would not produce anything.

The player then would have to subdue them when exploring the territory. This would serve as a good representation of the indigenous people of Siberia, South America and other areas that were not quite sufficient to produce a civilization but existed nevertheless.

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Napoleon I

Youngsun · July 13, 2000, 02:00

Just make the huts like the ones in Colonisation so we can at least interact with the huts rather than getting an instant tech or money. Has anyone wondered how come these primitive tribes own superior techs than the most advanced civilisation in the world?

Deathwalker · July 13, 2000, 08:09

I agree, the idea from colonization was great but could do with retunning.

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I have walked since the dawn of time and were ever I walk, death is sure to follow

Grier · July 13, 2000, 08:59

quote:

Originally posted by Youngsun on 07-13-2000 02:00 AM
Has anyone wondered how come these primitive tribes own superior techs than the most advanced civilisation in the world?

Yeah, like the small amazon tribe that have been perfecting nuclear fusion for the last thousand years.

Az · July 14, 2000, 10:42

encampment ? sounds good . but I prefer it not as a unit but as a ... well something between a tile improvement and a command .

like ... nomadic units command menu:

pillage
..
..
..
encamp

this tile improvement will have a menu.
and will be able to production . you will be able to mobilize the whole population and transfer them to warrior/horsemen units in 1 turn . ...... or am I going too far ?!

Dalgetti

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Prepare to Land !

Shadowstrike · July 15, 2000, 14:58

What about mobile cities? In history, many tribes were nomadic, so should Civ tribes. Maybe with a size limit of 3 or so (when you have too many people, it becomes hard to migrate)

UltraSonix · July 16, 2000, 06:37

With these nomad civ suggestions, it's hard to see how they'll get tech/money, grow etc. So maybe a larger civ'll have a chance that unhappy outlying cities in difficult terrain (yes, lots of conditions) can possibly break away, but not forming normal civs, but the aforementioned "hrad terrain civs". The breakaway harsh terrain civs would get all the techs of the civ they broke from, so this would solve the "how do they get techs?" problem.

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No, in Australia we don't live with kangaroos and koalas in our backyards...

Az · July 16, 2000, 16:04

I actually don't understand how can you build units . or maybe the population is the units ?

jdlessl · July 16, 2000, 16:35

I brought up something like this a while ago. For the nomad tribes, the population is the units and so the rate of increase is dependent on the number of units available. Heavy losses in battle will thus put a nomad tribe out of action for a while.

As for tech, these guys will have very high skill levels (assuming that's implemented) and can make up for lower tech until they capture a city. At that point they have 2 choices: Take over the city and start a new civ or pillage it into the ground and continue their merry way. If the latter, the tech they steal will of course be one with military potential (ie, not Banking).

To be realistic, you'd have to put in many of these tribes, and they will happily fight each other and you at the same time. Civs can deal with them, pay them to attack other civs, or to defend your borders against other civs/barbarians.

Most importantly is establishing an upper limit on the tech level for these guys. I got really pissed off in Civ 1 & 2 when the 'barbarians' showed up with tanks, howitzers, APC's, etc, etc in huge numbers. Maybe they could do that on a smaller basis, but with no cities or industry, they'd have to buy the equipment from civs. Make them mercenaries or something.

Jared Lessl

Christantine The Great · July 18, 2000, 21:34

I made a thread about nomads. I will try to find it.

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"Adorare Christantine!!!"
Republican Decree #1

UltraSonix · July 21, 2000, 23:37

quote:

Maybe they could do that on a smaller basis, but with no cities or industry, they'd have to buy the equipment from civs.

I can't imagine a NOMADIC tribe (nomadic means no permanent home) buying modern military hardware. Terrorists maybe, but not the people who live off the land, say in the Australian outback.

And I still think my how-do-they-get money/techs problem still applies.

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No, in Australia we don't live with kangaroos and koalas in our backyards...

Az · July 23, 2000, 17:42

well it is possible , of course . civs are actually nations , tribes right ?

so say you are a nomad civ . you have just agriculture and diamond trade . you want an apc unit . you send a message to you local
cheap military equipment dealer country and ask to buy or even , if it's the country's interest to equip you with it free of charge.

it makes sence. take a look at african nations

Dalgetti

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Prepare to Land !

Stuff2 · August 1, 2000, 15:57

I have an idea.

The first unit u get when you start a game is a nomad. A nomad will if not seattled eventually become two nomads. The underlaying terrain will decide how fast a nomad will 'grow'. A nomad work like this. It collects resources from the square it's on but it always have to move to a new square every turn. It is extremely slow on research except military research, on the other hand it can in a turn transform it self into military units (i suggest atleast two military units per nomad).
U as a player can choose to instead of seattle move around as a nomadic tribe and eventually invade another civ ones you are strong enough. There are no diplomatic penalties since you are an barbarbian and not supposed to behave better. Nomads can also benefit from piracy.

Christantine The Great · August 1, 2000, 16:53

Would piracy be attacking caravans/freight or capturing cities or both?

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"Adorare Christantine!!!"
Republican Decree #1

Deathwalker · August 2, 2000, 05:00

I think this is a good idea the huts were never very good nor were the barbarians. So how about the Incas and other in new world, that could be a good idea.

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I have walked since the dawn of time and were ever I walk, death is sure to follow

DarkCloud · August 29, 2000, 22:10

Mobile Huts which move around the map, and yet work like the regular huts or like the Colonization huts would be a great addition to civ considering it would enhance the 'Tribes' part of the game.