figured out my dead army... a question for WesW and other modders

primemover · March 16, 2002, 22:51

(see Medieval mod killed my army post below)

Ok... after some spending some time looking into what is happening and learning some SLIC... I think I have found the problem: It is the kill slaving units and old units routine in the the file MM2_SLC_Wouter.slc. I built the two units I could that wouldn't be destroyed on turn 400 (which is the year that they all seem to die). They actually survived the massacre...

Which brings me to a few more questions...

I changed the file by commenting out that entire section. But it still happens! (but my non-listed units still survive). Is the SLIC saved as part of the saved game so that rules are constant throughout a game?

And a question for WesW...
Why do you do that... kill all those armys off? For crying out loud... some of my militia are of the type that get killed off. (In other words... I only have two or three conventional units that aren't on that kill list for year 400.) Now the only conventional units I have are the four units that I built to see if they would survive.

-prime mover

Martin Gühmann · March 17, 2002, 13:20

Quote:

Originally posted by primemover
I changed the file by commenting out that entire section. But it still happens! (but my non-listed units still survive). Is the SLIC saved as part of the saved game so that rules are constant throughout a game?

Yes, therefore you have to reload slic, just open the chat window by typing the apostrphe key (') and enter: /reloadslic

That should it be, by the way a nice feature for slic debugging, you don't have to leave the program just to change something of your slic code, if it does not work as intended.

-Martin

WesW · March 17, 2002, 23:37

Quote:

Originally posted by primemover
(see Medieval mod killed my army post below)

Ok... after some spending some time looking into what is happening and learning some SLIC... I think I have found the problem: It is the kill slaving units and old units routine in the the file MM2_SLC_Wouter.slc.

Yeah, this is what I said in your initial thread.

Quote:

And a question for WesW...
Why do you do that... kill all those armys off? -prime mover

It was an attempt to get the AIs to upgrade their units. The code which should do this seems to not work, so I figured that if we disbanded really obsolete units for them, then the AIs would be forced to re-build their armies with modern units.

If you play with the unit updater code, this will be redundant, but there is not really any way to fix it.

primemover · March 19, 2002, 02:56

Thank for the help Wes (and Martin see below). I understand now the reason for the code. I guess it is just a pain when you intentionally handicap yourself. I did as you explained in one of your Medieval readmes and disbanded my second settler on the first turn of the gain and so I am WAY behind everyone else in tech (for now...) THerefore, when those years came, all I had were those units and my entire army went.... well you know how that ends.

Anyway... in spite of the difficulties, it's been a nice challange. I don't like to catch up to my enemies until the modern age. I am making my own modifications as I go along... to play how I like to, but I was tired of getting to the modern age and being able to take on everyone at the same time and still not have it be challenging.

As for your suggestion Martin. That is a great one... too bad I had already past the last year by the time I got it. But I think I will keep it in anyway... because its nice being evenly matched in army strength. Still... I wish there was another way to get them to build their armies... maybe you (Wes) or even I could provide an initial handicap variation of the mod that starts the human off with one settler and then somehow compensates for this by skipping the human player when cycling through the armies to get the AI to rebuild. Assuming everyone is still going to be ahead of the player... this might work.

Just a thought.... anyway.
-prime mover

WesW · March 20, 2002, 02:26

The disband code should not catch you, unless you are *way* behind the timeline. IIRC, the ancient units don't get disbanded until the middle of the Renaissance. If you are that far behind, you probably need to drop down a level in difficulty.

Pedrunn · March 20, 2002, 13:47

I always thought that the diband unit code should be based on advances and not timeline.

The time goes by differently every game, you can just define the year of the disband.

Have you ever thought disband the units after Human Rights is researched by anyone of the civs in the game?

Or even better when the Emancipation Act Wonder is built?

That way you can blaime someone for the lost of your Army (A message would be nice too)

WesW · March 20, 2002, 23:54

Yeah, it should be possible to make the code activate on advances rather than turn number, unless I have forgotten something. I still don't think the code should give anybody any problems under normal circumstances.

primemover · March 22, 2002, 19:06

Pendrunns ideas sound good. however.... some explanations may help understand what could be happening.

First of all, I cannot go down any difficulty levels. This is the only one that presents a challenge (of course... maybe I could and then perhaps handicapp myself there) but so far... the game is going as I have wanted... its even making me revise my strategy a bit in order to catch up in technology (I have caught up as much as I need to in other areas -- I am on top financially).

The changes I have made to the timeline should not affect the passage of time as far as the code is concerned since g.year is based on TURN and not actual year. But it may have something to do with my strategy...

The reason I fall behind at the beginning of the game is because I start out with a (rather extreme) expansion strategy... even with this mod if I keep my cities relativley close I can get enough cities to help my growth occur exponentially instead of the linear fashion the computer usually ends up having (this only works with the bigger map systems because of the change in the number of cities you can have). This of course has trade offs at the beginning of the game because naturally, I spend a lot of resources on settlers and lack in the stats since it does not consider land ownership an advantage. Eventually though, I usually catch up with a vengeance. This is why I have made several of my own modifications:

I like to have a big empire... I like to live in different areas... So my modifications have focused on having the AI be more expansionist as well. The timeline mods were to extend the length of the game before I realized you could change the game end year. I've kept it this way out of habit.

-prime mover.