Empire split

ramses II. · April 2, 2002, 01:43

In one of my games (deity, 7 civs, raging, other parameters medium), it happened, that the Egyptian Empire was split into Egypt and Persia during a civil disorder. I've never seen this before. It seems it doesn't happen often.
Who knows the special conditions for that?

Smash · April 2, 2002, 01:59

hehehe..wasn't too long ago we haggled over this.Studies were done.Debates were heated.Statistics flew back and forth

well not really

basically
1.less than 7 civs in the game.The new civ needs a slot of the seven.
2.Must capture opposing civ's capitol(they cannot have enough gold to instantly relocate 1000 gold iirc)
3.They must be higher in something.Either powergraph,population or ranking

take your pick.They basically coincide with each other anyway.

saibagginz · April 2, 2002, 15:10

If an enemy civ is building their spaceship a split causes them to abandon it. A usefull last resort if an enemy civ is about to win the space race (the production and pollution advantages the CPU gets on diety are pretty hidous.)
It doesn't always work though. Now thanks to Smash's post I know why.

Cyrion · April 3, 2002, 02:40

saibagginz: About the spaceship

I believe that, as it is built in the Capital, if you take it the spaceship is destroyed!! And I think it's true even if it has already been launched (is that correct??).

So you don't need to make the civ split, taking the capital is enough

Messer Niccolò · April 3, 2002, 03:41

Quote:

Originally posted by Cyrion
And I think it's true even if it has already been launched (is that correct??).

Correct!

Marquis de Sodaq · April 3, 2002, 09:55

The civ that captures the other's capitol must be lower on the powergraph - but when that is calculated is not clear. Over at Civfanatics I was in a discussion with someone who was testing this. It's possible that the powergraph comparison is made upon the declaration of war, not the turn the capitol actually gets sacked.

Thoddy · April 3, 2002, 10:31

See this older thread

http://apolyton.net/forums/attachmen...&postid=637118

geofelt · April 5, 2002, 11:34

I think the spaceship is destroyed only if the civ did not have 1000 gold to build a palace in another city when you captured it's original capitol.

La Fayette · April 6, 2002, 17:08

2 more details:
1) It is possible to split the enemy empire twice in a row during the same turn. I did that once (playing ww2 scenario as Spaniard IIRC): take Berlin = empire split = Bremen, new capital of one of the new German empires = take Bremen = new split = much easier to take care of the 3 newborn German empires.

2) It is possible to make the enemy capital move twice in a row during the same turn, even without splitting the Empire: take capital = capital moves = take new capital = the AI is 2000 gold poorer at the end of the turn (very efficient to get rid of rich AI civs with big costly cities: after a few moves the civ's treasury falls under 1000 gold and the AI cannot rebuild a new capital before quite a while, and you can bribe other cities for cheap in the meantime).

(a picture of La Fayette, just after taking Bremen)

Smash · April 6, 2002, 17:12

any of the hall of fame highscore type games are very good to test this and see for yourself.Shadowdale's game at CF can be split 3 times iirc.

finbar · April 16, 2002, 08:56

I've been playing a few SP games recently. Out of boredom, I play till I wipe out the first AI Civ to attack me. Be that as it may, I've managed to split a couple of Civs. Having taken part in many of the earlier debates, I immediately saved the game each time and checked the PG. Not that the PG is the be all and end all, but that's another argument.

Anyway, Smash, typically, was right. In each case, the split Civ was higher than me on the PG, but not always topping the PG. Once it was, and on the other occasions it was second and third.

And I'm still none the wiser.

ColdWizard · May 4, 2002, 15:38

i'm playing the 21st century scenario, and (based on powergraph) the 2nd most powerful civ (ai) just split the 3rd most powerful civ (ai)

finbar · May 4, 2002, 20:50

Who knows? As Smash said, the Civ that splits has to be bigger and better in something. Maybe they had more Burger Kings.

What really annoys me is that there's no reference to civ splitting in either the manual or the "Cic 2 Strategy Guide", a book that is, otherwise, chockers with trivial info about the game.

ColdWizard · May 4, 2002, 21:54

Quote:

Originally posted by finbar
Who knows? As Smash said, the Civ that splits has to be bigger and better in something. Maybe they had more Burger Kings.

i don't think the third world has more burger kings than the americans

maybe it's totally random...

Marquis de Sodaq · May 4, 2002, 22:17

Quote:

Originally posted by Marquis de Sodaq
The civ that captures the other's capitol must be lower on the powergraph - but when that is calculated is not clear. ... It's possible that the powergraph comparison is made upon the declaration of war, not the turn the capitol actually gets sacked.

Please note this comment! The logic behind it would simply be that a civ losing its capitol is quite likely getting its ass kicked - and is not at that moment necessarily at the top of the powergraph.

Has anyone tried to calculate what each civ's score would be at the moment of capitol capture? Maybe that's the trigger, not powergraph (tho the civfanatics test really do suggest it is).

ColdWizard · May 5, 2002, 00:10

in my game the americans have always been higher on the PG than the third world, even after i took washington and at the time of the capture of the third world capital, the americans had long since moved their capital to hawaii

Thoddy · May 6, 2002, 05:22

In a testgame of mine the largest AI civ
(more than 30 Cities) take the capitol of a 5 cities civs and the 5 cities civ splits.
See the older Thread
http://apolyton.net/forums/attachme...=&postid=637118.