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View Poll Results: Would consumers benefit if Firaxis and Activision collaborated on Civ4?
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Absolutely! That just might be "the greatest game of all time!"
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6 |
15.00% |
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Yes, but I don't think it would be "the greatest game of all time."
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6 |
15.00% |
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Yes, but I don't think it'd be much better than Civ3 or CtP2.
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2 |
5.00% |
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No way, man! The game would suck raw fish eggs!
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6 |
15.00% |
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NOOO! It'd be an ok game, but it wouldn't be worth the effort.
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4 |
10.00% |
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NOOO! They should never collaborate! That would limit consumer choice!
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3 |
7.50% |
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I have no earthly idea.
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3 |
7.50% |
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It really doesn't matter to me.
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1 |
2.50% |
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You want the impossible, man!
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0% |
I can't make up my mind. "Here have a banana, instead." 
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9 |
22.50% |
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April 4, 2002, 19:27
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#1
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Warlord
Local Time: 16:36
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: "I'm gonna speak softly, but carry a BIG STICK!!!"
Posts: 123
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Do you think consumers would benefit if Firaxis and Activision collaborated on Civ4?
Both Civilization III and Call To Power II have their pros and cons. But what if Firaxis and Activision collaborated their ideas and developed a Civilization IV game that has elements from both of these two previous games. And even added a little bit more of their own magic to bring the game to life! What then? Do you think consumers would benefit? Do you think they could really make "the greatest game of all time?"
Exercise your right to vote!
__________________
HAVE A DAY.
<--- Quote by Former U.S. President Theodore "Teddy" Roosevelt
"And there will be strange events in the skies--signs in the sun, moon, and stars. And down here on earth the nations will be in turmoil, perplexed by the roaring seas and strange tides. The courage of many people will falter because of the fearful fate they see coming upon the earth, because the stability of the very heavens will be broken up. Then everyone will see the Son of Man arrive on the clouds with power and great glory. So when all these things begin to happen, stand straight and look up, for your salvation is near!" --Luke 21:25-28
For the Lord himself will come down from heaven with a commanding shout, with the call of the archangel, and with the trumpet call of God. First, all the Christians who have died will rise from their graves. Then, together with them, we who are still alive and remain on the earth will be caught up in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air and remain with him forever. --1 Thessalonians 4:16-17
Last edited by Mr. Nice Guy; April 4, 2002 at 23:17.
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April 4, 2002, 19:44
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#2
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Deity
Local Time: 15:36
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: Las Vegas
Posts: 17,354
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I thought they collaborated for civ3? 
__________________
Focus, discipline
Barack Obama- the antichrist
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April 4, 2002, 19:49
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#3
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Warlord
Local Time: 16:36
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: "I'm gonna speak softly, but carry a BIG STICK!!!"
Posts: 123
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Quote:
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Originally posted by Dissident
I thought they collaborated for civ3?
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Uh, nooooooooooooo. 
__________________
HAVE A DAY.
<--- Quote by Former U.S. President Theodore "Teddy" Roosevelt
"And there will be strange events in the skies--signs in the sun, moon, and stars. And down here on earth the nations will be in turmoil, perplexed by the roaring seas and strange tides. The courage of many people will falter because of the fearful fate they see coming upon the earth, because the stability of the very heavens will be broken up. Then everyone will see the Son of Man arrive on the clouds with power and great glory. So when all these things begin to happen, stand straight and look up, for your salvation is near!" --Luke 21:25-28
For the Lord himself will come down from heaven with a commanding shout, with the call of the archangel, and with the trumpet call of God. First, all the Christians who have died will rise from their graves. Then, together with them, we who are still alive and remain on the earth will be caught up in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air and remain with him forever. --1 Thessalonians 4:16-17
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April 4, 2002, 20:33
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#4
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Emperor
Local Time: 16:36
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Dec 1998
Posts: 3,215
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It'd probably be good. Mabye not great, but good at the least.
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April 4, 2002, 20:41
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#5
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Prince
Local Time: 09:36
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: of the Barbarians
Posts: 600
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So what features do you think would combine the best of both games?
From CTP2:
* Terrain variety - desert mountains and so forth. Or at least give us desert hills so we can have hills in the desert that don't produce food.
* Armies.
* Combat.
From CIV3:
* Diplomacy.
* Strategic Resources.
* CIV3 Food / Commerce / Shield system (because it's not opaque like the CTP2 system).
* Managing the tiles that individual citizens work in the city radius.
New features:
* Hex Map - As a gamer, I hate the inconsistencies that square maps must introduce when simulating a circle. We're most of the way there already with the isometric map. Why not finish the job?
* Better tech tree. Techs having a maximum of 2 prerequisites is too limiting and makes the CIV3 kludge of "eras" necessary. An ideal tech tree would allow a player to research what they wanted at any time, but the prerequisites should make impossible such absurdities as researching Flight before researching the Wheel. Each tech should have up to 6 prerequisites.
* New trade system. Bring back Caravans! I would make them cost 20 shields, but have a pure trade role (no wonder construction). To trade between two cities, connect them with a Caravan to create a trade route. You can build up a trade network this way. Enemy troops can disrupt the trade route if they can get on it. To trade with another civ, they must be sent there.
__________________
None, Sedentary, Roving, Restless, Raging ... damn, is that all? Where's the "massive waves of barbarians that can wipe out your civilisation" setting?
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April 4, 2002, 23:14
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#6
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Prince
Local Time: 17:36
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 915
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I waited over five years for a Civ III that is a big disappointment. Within a month after it was released people started hoping for Civ4 (tells you how good Civ III is).
I really don't feel inclined to eagerly wait another five years for another bomb.
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April 4, 2002, 23:21
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#7
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Warlord
Local Time: 16:36
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: "I'm gonna speak softly, but carry a BIG STICK!!!"
Posts: 123
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What's in it for a name?
I have an idea as to what to name the new game. Instead of naming it Civilization IV how about something like this:
ULTIMATE CIVILIZATION
THAT NAME ROCKS!!!
__________________
HAVE A DAY.
<--- Quote by Former U.S. President Theodore "Teddy" Roosevelt
"And there will be strange events in the skies--signs in the sun, moon, and stars. And down here on earth the nations will be in turmoil, perplexed by the roaring seas and strange tides. The courage of many people will falter because of the fearful fate they see coming upon the earth, because the stability of the very heavens will be broken up. Then everyone will see the Son of Man arrive on the clouds with power and great glory. So when all these things begin to happen, stand straight and look up, for your salvation is near!" --Luke 21:25-28
For the Lord himself will come down from heaven with a commanding shout, with the call of the archangel, and with the trumpet call of God. First, all the Christians who have died will rise from their graves. Then, together with them, we who are still alive and remain on the earth will be caught up in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air and remain with him forever. --1 Thessalonians 4:16-17
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April 5, 2002, 05:04
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#8
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Prince
Local Time: 22:36
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Great Britain
Posts: 671
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Personaly the next Civ type game I would like to see in development would be CTP3 
__________________
I have walked since the dawn of time and were ever I walk, death is sure to follow. As surely as night follows day.
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April 5, 2002, 05:35
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#9
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King
Local Time: 06:36
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Sep 1999
Location: Australia
Posts: 1,515
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That'd be like adding vinegar to sawdust with the expectation of producing chocolate fudge ...
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April 5, 2002, 05:36
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#10
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Deity
Local Time: 00:36
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Nov 1999
Location: De Hel van Enschede
Posts: 11,702
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First of all, if anything should be fixed to create a better game than Civ3 and/or CtP2, get rid of the bean counters! They are the ones responsible for both CtP2 and Civ3 being released too early...
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Quote:
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Originally posted by Deathwalker
Personaly the next Civ type game I would like to see in development would be CTP3
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Hear, hear!  (I've seen the design docs for CtP2 and some of the most exciting ideas were eventually not implemented - it would be great to see those in a sequel)
If you want to bring the Activision team together again, why would you weaken it by adding Firaxis people to it? I mean, the Firaxis's idea of the sequel to Civ2 is Civ2 + strategic resources. Sorry, not good enough for me, I want actual innovation. Also, I want the developers to care about customizability and be open for fan-input, which Firaxis hardly was; Activision OTOH 'hired' a whole team of fans to alpha-test the game and also took numerous suggestions straight from the forums here on Apolyton and implemented them in the game (i.e. MAD). I don't think I have to bring up customizibility. Now, if you wanted to add Brian Reynolds to the team, that might be open for negotiation...
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April 5, 2002, 05:59
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#11
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Local Time: 18:36
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Dec 1969
Location: on the corner of Peachtree and Peachtree
Posts: 30,698
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::shudder::
CTP people corrupting another Civ? As long as Sid gets to be in charge, then, I guess .
And, btw, I highly doubt there will be a CTP3 (Thank God!) judging by the way Activision bailed on the 2nd version of that horribleness.
__________________
“I give you a new commandment, that you love one another. Just as I have loved you, you also should love one another. By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another.”
- John 13:34-35 (NRSV)
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April 5, 2002, 06:09
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#12
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Civ4: Colonization Content Editor
Local Time: 23:36
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Dec 2001
Posts: 11,117
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This whole discussion is plain theoretical. As far as I believe, at this point, there will be neither a Civ4 nor a CtP3.
The result of a merge would be quite crappy anyway. CtP2 fans would get mad if they had suddenly to deal with workers, and Civ3 fans wouldn't agree with stealth units and such. Well... that's a matter of taste. At least I can see my attorney, and my priest... others may consider them invisible... 
Thus, BA-NA-NA! 
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April 5, 2002, 06:15
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#13
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Deity
Local Time: 16:36
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: of naught
Posts: 21,300
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Quote:
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Originally posted by Locutus
If you want to bring the Activision team together again, why would you weaken it by adding Firaxis people to it?
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To get an AI that can at least give a semblence of a challenge out of the box?
To get other interesting ideas on diiferentiation of terrain that CtP's Civ Rip-Off programmers never dreamed of?
To get a game that can be enjoyed in it's simplicity because it works that way? Played Go?
To bug the h*ll out of you?
No, No. OK. I'll admit. What we need is another 16 civs.
__________________
(\__/)
(='.'=)
(")_(") This is Bunny. Copy and paste bunny into your signature to help him gain world domination.
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April 5, 2002, 10:22
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#14
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King
Local Time: 19:36
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: of Natal, Brazil
Posts: 2,555
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No Earthly idea.
Unles they do the best wich is CTP2 + Civ3 strategic resources + Civ3 culture + Civ3 interface
star mouse,
Dont forget Slic code, Special units and future.
And manage the workable tiles is also one of Activision ideas, in CTP1. And in both CTP games you can have more than 6 prereqs.
__________________
"Kill a man and you are a murder.
Kill thousands and you are a conquer.
Kill all and you are a God!"
-Jean Rostand
Last edited by Pedrunn; April 5, 2002 at 10:45.
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April 5, 2002, 11:00
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#15
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Civ4: Colonization Content Editor
Local Time: 23:36
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Dec 2001
Posts: 11,117
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Quote:
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Originally posted by Locutus
Activision OTOH 'hired' a whole team of fans to alpha-test the game and also took numerous suggestions straight from the forums here on Apolyton and implemented them in the game (i.e. MAD).
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Do you want to say, the dull and poor CtP2 out of the box version was TESTED and APPROVED by the fans? Yuck, now I'm really disappointed...
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April 5, 2002, 11:16
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#16
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Deity
Local Time: 00:36
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Nov 1999
Location: De Hel van Enschede
Posts: 11,702
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Quote:
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Originally posted by Sir Ralph
Do you want to say, the dull and poor CtP2 out of the box version was TESTED and APPROVED by the fans? Yuck, now I'm really disappointed...
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It was tested, but not approved by the fans. Like I said above, if you really want to ensure the next civ game is good, get rid of those f*cking paranoid and money-minded bean counters  
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April 5, 2002, 15:10
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#17
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King
Local Time: 22:36
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: Gone Fishin, Canada
Posts: 1,059
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Judging from today's news item (the interview with Ike Ellis) the REAL sequel to Civ2 (and CTP2) is on the way.
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April 5, 2002, 17:28
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#18
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Prince
Local Time: 13:36
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Alaska
Posts: 434
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The problem with this, is that if you get rid of the "f*cking bean counters", then the company doesn't make as much profit. Even if they make a better game, they don't release it at the right time, they don't ship it to the right markets, whatever. And if the developing company doesn't make as much profit, then patches could be a long time in coming.
Steele
__________________
If this were a movie, there'd be a tunnel or something near here for us to escape through.....
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April 5, 2002, 19:45
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#19
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Deity
Local Time: 08:36
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Dec 1969
Location: In a tunnel under the DMZ
Posts: 12,273
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Firaxis collaborates with Activision?
That would be the blind leading the blind wouldn't it?
Great
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April 5, 2002, 23:11
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#20
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Deity
Local Time: 06:36
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: May 1999
Location: The City State of Noosphere, CPA special envoy
Posts: 14,606
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It's not the bean counters it's the marketers they need to remove. Or at least the management must keep the suits in their place so they don't go around thinking themselves as kings or something.
I don't think mixing the <em>CtP</em> team and the Firaxis team will do anything constructive. It is not like they don't have ideas. Even we contributed lots of them. What they incorporate into the game is the most important design decision for them to make.
To many diehard <em>Civ</em> fans they did a horrible job of that, but seeing how Firaxis isn't doing so badly, while Quicksilver is feeling the crunch now, just might tell you why Sid & co did what they did. There is one thing called financial reality and it'd be foolhardy for a company to ignore it.
Face it, Sid didn't really want to do another <em>Civ</em>.
__________________
(\__/) 07/07/1937 - Never forget
(='.'=) "Claims demand evidence; extraordinary claims demand extraordinary evidence." -- Carl Sagan
(")_(") "Starting the fire from within."
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April 5, 2002, 23:20
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#21
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Emperor
Local Time: 17:36
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Dec 1969
Location: Texas
Posts: 4,253
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That is a horrible idea. Activision is dishonest. When making CTP, they called it the official Civ3. Its worse then stealing Derek's glove and selling it. You can't work with people like that.
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April 5, 2002, 23:46
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#22
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Local Time: 09:36
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Skanky Father
Posts: 16,530
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Quote:
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Originally posted by Urban Ranger
It's not the bean counters it's the marketers they need to remove. Or at least the management must keep the suits in their place so they don't go around thinking themselves as kings or something.
I don't think mixing the <em>CtP</em> team and the Firaxis team will do anything constructive. It is not like they don't have ideas. Even we contributed lots of them. What they incorporate into the game is the most important design decision for them to make.
To many diehard <em>Civ</em> fans they did a horrible job of that, but seeing how Firaxis isn't doing so badly, while Quicksilver is feeling the crunch now, just might tell you why Sid & co did what they did. There is one thing called financial reality and it'd be foolhardy for a company to ignore it.
Face it, Sid didn't really want to do another <em>Civ</em>.
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I was going to post something like this before, but couldn't find the right words.
Thanks, Urban. 
__________________
I'm building a wagon! On some other part of the internets, obviously (but not that other site).
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April 6, 2002, 09:58
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#23
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Emperor
Local Time: 17:36
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: New York
Posts: 5,117
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...looks like bananas win again...
anyway, i still haven't got civ3... so i don't know...
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April 6, 2002, 16:54
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#24
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Warlord
Local Time: 16:36
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: "I'm gonna speak softly, but carry a BIG STICK!!!"
Posts: 123
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Quote:
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Originally posted by Caesar the Great
...looks like bananas win again...
anyway, i still haven't got civ3... so i don't know...
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***********WARNING!!!***********
RED ALERT!!! RED ALERT!!! RED ALERT!!!
*******************************
DON'T WASTE YOUR MONEY ON IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
__________________
HAVE A DAY.
<--- Quote by Former U.S. President Theodore "Teddy" Roosevelt
"And there will be strange events in the skies--signs in the sun, moon, and stars. And down here on earth the nations will be in turmoil, perplexed by the roaring seas and strange tides. The courage of many people will falter because of the fearful fate they see coming upon the earth, because the stability of the very heavens will be broken up. Then everyone will see the Son of Man arrive on the clouds with power and great glory. So when all these things begin to happen, stand straight and look up, for your salvation is near!" --Luke 21:25-28
For the Lord himself will come down from heaven with a commanding shout, with the call of the archangel, and with the trumpet call of God. First, all the Christians who have died will rise from their graves. Then, together with them, we who are still alive and remain on the earth will be caught up in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air and remain with him forever. --1 Thessalonians 4:16-17
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April 6, 2002, 17:14
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#25
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Warlord
Local Time: 17:36
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: Drinking the blood of the Proletariat
Posts: 200
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Bah, why bother with Civ when you can play EU? Go Paradox!!!
__________________
A proud citizen of the only convicted terrorist harboring nation!
.13 posts per day, and proud of it!
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April 6, 2002, 23:56
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#26
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Emperor
Local Time: 14:36
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Dec 1969
Location: I live amongst the Red Sox Nation
Posts: 7,969
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at least the C:CTP series had an excuse when the "just one more turn" senario didnt' work out for them
but Sid created civ3, it was a major flop as SP game IMO and doesn't look good for MP.....
what's their excuse....oh yeah...the all mightly dollar......
__________________
Boston Red Sox are 2004 World Series Champions!
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April 7, 2002, 00:11
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#27
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Deity
Local Time: 06:36
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: May 1999
Location: The City State of Noosphere, CPA special envoy
Posts: 14,606
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I felt that Firaxis did some noteworthy updating to the <em>Civ</em> franchise. The resource model and culture are excellent ideas. Maybe may of the old timers aren't satisfied, and indeed there were many sloppy bugs in the game that are inexcusable.
However, do not forget that Sid games are suppose to be fun, not realistic.
For all you people who are so full of good ideas, why don't you join one of the current <em>Civ</em>-lookalike game projects such as <em>Freeciv</em> or <em>Manifest Destiny</em>?
__________________
(\__/) 07/07/1937 - Never forget
(='.'=) "Claims demand evidence; extraordinary claims demand extraordinary evidence." -- Carl Sagan
(")_(") "Starting the fire from within."
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April 7, 2002, 11:23
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#28
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Emperor
Local Time: 23:36
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Cádiz, Spain
Posts: 3,442
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It would be better if they both sell the rights to a third company looking for a place in the markets
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April 7, 2002, 14:16
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#29
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Warlord
Local Time: 16:36
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: "I'm gonna speak softly, but carry a BIG STICK!!!"
Posts: 123
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Quote:
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Originally posted by Waku
It would be better if they both sell the rights to a third company looking for a place in the markets
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That would be my company then.
__________________
HAVE A DAY.
<--- Quote by Former U.S. President Theodore "Teddy" Roosevelt
"And there will be strange events in the skies--signs in the sun, moon, and stars. And down here on earth the nations will be in turmoil, perplexed by the roaring seas and strange tides. The courage of many people will falter because of the fearful fate they see coming upon the earth, because the stability of the very heavens will be broken up. Then everyone will see the Son of Man arrive on the clouds with power and great glory. So when all these things begin to happen, stand straight and look up, for your salvation is near!" --Luke 21:25-28
For the Lord himself will come down from heaven with a commanding shout, with the call of the archangel, and with the trumpet call of God. First, all the Christians who have died will rise from their graves. Then, together with them, we who are still alive and remain on the earth will be caught up in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air and remain with him forever. --1 Thessalonians 4:16-17
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