Sencho-b-gone too.

[Imran Siddiqui]

A shovel not being a sufficient tool for the size of the hole they're digging, it appears that they've switched to a backhoe. We may need to locate a steam shovel next.

You said it.

I mean, don't they see they are alienating the hard core fans here? I mean, you thought Firaxis hurt Civ3 sales by their bad PR... nothing compared to QS, I tell you!

[Straybow]

[stranger deactivates lurker cloaking device]
Looks like if I want to chat with some of my favorite MOOers I have to reappear here at Apolyton.

[SnowFire]

On the plus side, since this game is being aimed at a much broader market than just the hard-core fans, I'm sure that most prospective buyers aren't likely to have read any of this stuff...

Yes, but don't underestimate the power that hardcore fans have in spreading the good word. MOO3 has less man-on-the-street buy this than Civ3, but it could have had incredible word of mouth if they pumped out a classic, or anything close since that's what some people were expecting.

And Imran, in fairness, QS had a lot more to lose. Before now, they had built up quite an impressive base of hard-core fans for its size.

SH: So what were these comments that Storm made that were so "bad" as to get deleted?

[Hywel Dda]

Is it really getting this bad? Someone tell me these threads are a joke. Aren't we too late for April Fool?

I thought MOO3 was all sweetness and light. Less than a day ago it still seemed to be our best TBS hopes. Now the storm clouds are approaching...

Of course we can argue for weeks about what's true and what isn't, and who's in and who's out, but that doesn't stop the fact that the reputation of this game seems to have collapsed overnight.

[13Matt13]

They aren't just aiming for their feet, that's already been taken care of w/Sencho and Storm. They are progressively moving up the body and I think they are soewhere around the kneecaps now....

[Steelsky]

Well, anyone can be pleasant and nice to people when things are going well.

True character is when you are able to do it when things are going bad as well.

/Steelsky

[CharonX]

Originally posted by Stormhound
On the plus side, since this game is being aimed at a much broader market than just the hard-core fans, I'm sure that most prospective buyers aren't likely to have read any of this stuff...

Well, it is true, they might not take an too big hit from Hard-Core gamers not buying it, at least not in the beginning...
But it is exactly those hard-core gamers (if I may use the name geek) that allow it to survive the "time" - why is Halflife still a big hit? Because there are TONS of mods out there, because there is a living community surrounding it - if it had been "dead" after the initial 5 months we´d never have seen the O F expansion or the Blue-Shift quasi-expansion.
Take Space Empires 4 - a living community, keeping the game well and kicking.
Without the hard-core gamers the game will be "in" mainstream for a few months, probably get a few good reviews, then slowly become forgotten again, because while the mainstreamers like & play the game they´d never have the idea to create a DECENT fan website surrounding it - just imagine Orionsector, this board & co would shut down (and I have to admit, the big head execs @ QS would deserve it)

[Stormhound]

Okay, I have to chime in again...

I suppose I should've put "[mild sarcasm]" around the "broader market" statement...I keep forgetting that it's not obvious.

I've been playing computer games for 23 years, and computerized games since Pong. Yes, you definitely need a hard-core community to thrive in the long term.

[Zealot]

Stormhound, about the banning on Storm:
You can be certain that you can speak freely and all that you want at Apolyton. The moderators in here are quite reliable (as I'm sure you already know).


Sencho, having more time to play a little more MOO 2 with me?

[Sencho]

Not until July Zeal. I need to devote time to graduating first.

After that, we'll work together another game.

[Stormhound]

If I were not already convinced of the reliability and impartiality of the mods, I wouldn't have come over here to make the second (and longer) announcement that I'd been laid off.

The board has earned its good rep, and frankly is probably far better for not being a "house organ" as the Delphi MOO3 board is.

[madmario]

I find phallic suggestion in "house organ" particularly apropo there.

-mario

[TCO]

Actually Stormpuppie,

I think that BB brouhahas are overrated. The company needs to concentrate on making a good game and on magazine hype err I mean marketing.

I skied for a week with a veteran game programmer and he said the whole BB community thing is overrated. Buncha people who think their $50 is 100 times more important than that of other customers.

The big screwup by QS is PROJECT MANAGEMENT as I alluded to long, long ago in my trolling...err I mean thought provoking threads (sorry backspace not working ) several months ago.

[Urban Ranger]

Originally posted by GP
I skied for a week with a veteran game programmer and he said the whole BB community thing is overrated. Buncha people who think their $50 is 100 times more important than that of other customers.

Newbie gamer: Hey, is this MoO 3 game any good?

Grognard: Nah, not worth $50. Wait till it is in the bargain bin.

Newbie gamer: What about this Civ 3?

Grognard: Pretty cool game that one.

Newbie gamer picks upCiv 3 and leaves


----------

Newbie gamer 2: I heard this MoO 3 game is good.

Newbie gamer: That's not what Joe said.

Newbie gamer 2: Oh. I guess I better spend my money elsewhere.

[TCO]

Newbie Gamer 3 (tries game): I like it!

Newbie Gamer 4: should I buy it?

Newbie Gamer 3: yeah!!

Newbie gamer 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, etc. etc. etc.:

I saw this game on the cover of my favorite magazine. I want it!!!

[Urban Ranger]

YMMV, but most gamers tend to be cautious these days. Having too many bad games on the market make gamers a lot less likely to buy a game impulsively. Worthless reviews certainly doesn't help.

[TCO]

yeah. Things are changing. But gamers still tend to be young and to flit from one thing to the next...and to have desire to have the faddish game RIGHT NOW. Just look at the buying habits.

[Ozymandous]

Hrm...

Just because people switch from one game to another doesn't mean they are "new" or "faddish". I know I swap between 2-6 different games as my mood strikes and still go out and buyt a new game every 3-4 months if there is one I like.

Some of us don't expect every game to be perfect and to have that ONE game provide more than the 40 hours or so most of them give. Sure games like Half-Life and others that are modded can have HUGE life-spans, but do you really expect every designer to make a game that you buy once and then never buy another game for another 2-3 YEARS? That's seriously costing them money because people don't typically pay for patches or mod's that others do.

If I buy a game and like it I'll play it till I get burned out on it (after 40-60 hours of playing it exclusively) and swap to another (not necessarily new) game and then swap back when the mood strikes me. I think there are more gamers like me than the people who only play ONE game consistently for years, although I did play MOO and CIV (original versions of both) almost exclusively for 2.5 years so been in that camp as well.

[Ace Pace]

well for the ones who care, (this is a bit late) , sencho is back in delphi.

[Straybow]

Yes, but I'm not. There's nothing going on there, and will likely be nothing worth going there for because QS will not be leaking much information until MOO3 is released.

[TCO]

I remember Don don!!

[Straybow]

Yello, GP!

[Noise of rusty memory gears grinding]

Was it Clash of Civs???