Tech Lead???

[GarethDaragon]

well, i started my first regent game on friday afternoon... babs, standard map, 6 civs... i managed the diplomatic victory in ~1900... the disappointing thing is that without the UN, i probably would have lost the game. i was sitting second in points to england at that point, and no matter how hard i tried, i couldn't take a tech lead.

using my GA in the mid-middle ages, i did manage to take the lead through the early industrial, but i promptly lost it before i could exploit a serious unit advantage. i guess i spent too much time on warlord with a dominate lead in tech. how do you accomplish the lead on the harder difficulty levels.

i see the wisdom of keeping the tech development at 10% to maximumize gold intake until you develop a lead (a technique that is VERY against my preferred way to play). but once you take the lead you have to up the slider don't you?

i'm actually doing quite well on my second game... i'm soundly in first but unfortuantely i have only made contact with two other civs (china and aztecs)... china is already gone and the aztecs and i are sharing a large continent. unfortunately it is early middle ages so no magnetism and there is no path to another landmass even with the great lighthouse. (what a waste of the great library)...

any advice would be really appreciated. sorry this is so long, had to work today (sunday and i'm bored)...

[GarethDaragon]

since i don't want this to end up at the end of the list before someone (anyone) replies... i have another "newbie" question.

is there a way (other than keeping notes yourself)... to know when a 20 turn deal is about to expire.

specifically in the game above, when the war with china started, i formed an alliance with the aztecs. i had 20 turns left on my great library at the time, so i figured once the gl was built, i could sue for peace with china. three turns after the gl was finished, i settled things with china (they only had a few measley cities left)... and of course the aztecs went from gracious to cautious. sounds to me like i broke the alliance eventhough it SHOULD HAVE BEEN OVER.

any help? anyone?

[punkbass2000]

Perhaps your production was increased and you built the GL faster than expected. Anyway, you can check on all your deals with an AI by clicking on the 'active' button at the bottom of the diplomacy screen, beside 'new', which is the default, as you're typivally discussing new treaties.

As to your science problem, it's difficult to say what exactly to do without a game example, but, generally, it's good to have a lot of cities, be a scientific civ, and lots of commerce that goes into science. As you may have noticed, these are vague, self-evident bits of advice, which is why we need a more specific example to determine more specific suggestions. Oh, and build roads everywhere, to produce commerce. Knowing when to switch from tax to science is indefinable, you just have to know when. Generally, you should be even with the current tech leader and be able to research new techs in 4-8 turns, depending on level.

[notyoueither]

How many cities did you have?

Did you build roads everywhere?

Did you build any of the science wonders? GLH, CO, NC.

Did all of your productive cities have Libraries and University?

Were the English twice your size?

Do you still have a save to post?

[notyoueither]

PS The Alliance will stay in effect until you either cancel it manually (you can't before 20 turns are up) or make peace with the target of the alliance.

So, you have an alliance with Bozo to go after Clarabell. You made the alliance with Bozo 23 turns ago. Now you want to make peace with Clarabell. You go to diplomacy, call up Bozo, select the Active option (as pb2k said) click on the alliance. That will bring the alliance to the negotiation table. Exit. Alliance finished. Go make peace with the other clown.

If you don't end the alliance first, you will have dishonored your agreement with Bozo, even though the alliance is over 20 turns old.

The only deals that automatically expire are those for gold per turn. If you trade Ivory and 5 gpt to Bozo for Incense you will get the Incense for 20 turns and pay the 5 gold each turn. After 20 turns, you will still get the Incense and ship out the Ivory unless either you or Bozo actively cancel or renegotiate the deal (he will usually). You will no longer pay the 5 gpt if the deal remains unchanged.

[GarethDaragon]

hey notyoueither... thanks alot for the info on cancelling treaties and agreements... can't believe i never figured that one out. i was wondering why in my last game i had a mpp with england for the entire game.

as for my game where i lost the tech lead, no i don't have a save. i was just looking for some general ideas for maintaining a science budget.

i think my major problem is the way i build up my cities. i tend to build every available building in EVERY city. this is a lot of upkeep. in my new game, i am being much stricter with my use of courthouses and police stations once i get to them. i'm guessing that this will seriously alter my available tax base for science.

also, i think i spent a little too much cash on rushing improvements in far away lands (i let my total value drop below 300gp, so my interest/turn was low.)

as a follow up... generally do you think it is better to use wealth alone when a city is not producing something... or to change as many workers to scientists and tax collectors along with wealth. is there any info on which provides more cash??? just thought of this possibility, so i'll have to try it out in my new game.

the other major problem i had was that i couldn't get access to coal until late industrial age, so i probably wasn't able to up my commerce as early as i would have liked. actually it was the modern age before i was able to finish my rail network...

anyhow, thanks to all for the advice. depending on how my present game goes, i MIGHT be ready to move up to monarch. depends just how backwater i am when i finally get to magnetism and i can explore....

BTW... only having contact with one civ when you have the great library REALLY, REALLY SUCKS!

[Purple]

I may have overlooked a reply to your question about time remaining on a deal between you and another player. The answer is found on the diplomacy screen, at the bottom. Click on Active to see the number of turns left for each deal.

[GarethDaragon]

BTW... only having contact with one civ when you have the great library REALLY, REALLY SUCKS!

actually i stand corrected. only having access to one other civ while you have the great library ROCKS...

when we finally managed to make contact with the rest of the world (bought my way to contact with all 5 remaining civs not on the continent), i was excpecting that the tech advances would come fast and furious upto education and that was it...

however, even after being notified that the great library was obsolete, on the same turn, the tech advances just kept coming... all the way upto the industrial age. talk about getting your money's worth.

[Nym]

During my current Regent game as India I mostly use tech trading to keep my tech lead. I try to put 90% to 100% of my commerce to science and cover expenses with tech (and luxuries/ressources) trade. For this, micro management of commerce slider is very useful. I only sell a tech when I need money (about all 20 turns) and sell it to all other players.
I also try to keep a tech as long as possible when it is one necessary to build a wonder I want or when it is a military tech.
Otherwise, of course, build science city improvements and roads.


FYI : I had quite a chance to discover other civs (Brits, Japs, Frenchs and Russians arround me) or get contacts (Germans on the same continent, Iroquois, Egyptians, Aztecs and Americans on another continent) during ancient era, which helps a lot for tech trading.

[Shaka II]

I did the same thing in building the GL when I only had contact with 1 civ. Just me and the Russians alone on a small continent. I had a choice between Pyramids and GL to rush build with my Great Leader. I forgot that the GL only worked with civs that you had already contacted.

So, I got busy and researched map making ASAP to find the other civs (asssuming you were also stuck on a small continent). I have done this a number of times before discovering Navigation, etc. This is how I do it, there may be a better way:

Start building a few galleys (2 or 3). At the extremities of you're continent closest to where you think the super continent might be, start in shallow water on a new turn and proceed in uncharted water. Usually you lose one galley or maybe two, but usually the 2nd galley will make it a foreign shore. Standard map size, continents.

Anyway, in that game I was rewarded by not only catching up in tech and not allowing the Russians to meet anyone else, but in the mean time, I had built quite the road infrastructure, etc. so I could assume the tech lead shortly after.

Get used to spending 80% - 100% on science after you're roads and other buildings are in place. Trade techs to finance this (except for wonder techs as Nym points out; at least not until you have them half built). I usually only research up to Horses and Ironworking and buy everything else. V1.17 is forgiving in letting you catch up, but not as easy to be tech leader.