The future of Firaxis

[Urban Ranger]

Vel,

No idea. Sometimes the middle of the road is the best approach, sometimes people fall through the cracks.

I wouldn't be saying scratchware = bad graphics, or having good graphics is essential to success. Europa Universalis doesn't have "gee wiz" graphics yet it manages to be a hit game, even if it is just a hit game within a small market. Space Empires IV is another example.

Have you played the classic game M.U.L.E.? It is a game for Atari 400/800 and Commodore 64. Very anicent, but still a lot of fun to play. If you can find it, try it out.

[Colon™]

Velociryx, my apologies if I missed something but if you’re successful in your real estate ventures, why wouldn’t an investor pressure you to shed off the unprofitable game developing bit of your project?
Secondly, do you expect others to emulate this model? Why wouldn’t they just go for real estate investment? (as far as I see it, it would be as if an investor uses half his funds to invest in bonds to support a newborn supermarket chain)
And thirdly, if I may know, since when have you successfully been investing in RE? (for your project and otherwise)

[Urban Ranger]

He can always spin off the game division into a privately held company. If it is losing money, he can buy it himself for a song.

[Colon™]

Not sure what you're getting at. An investor would invest into the entire project (RE+game development) to spin the gaming bit off with a loss? If so, the question remains why he wouldn't just invest into RE without bothering about gaming.

[Velociryx]

Hey guys! I'm glad to see there's sufficient interest in the topic that it's still drawing comments! Thank you all!

To questions/comments aimed in my direction, I'll get started there first:

GP: Excellent point about surrendering control (or even some measure of control re: investors....where possible, I DO wanna minimize their impact, and that means playing a highly political game, at least for a while...I hate politics, but would do it for the sake of speed, if necessary. Still, your and Rav's comments later point out that there are strong advantages to remaining fully independent, and that is, in fact, my first choice....but, as a real possibility of an option, I didn't wanna shut that door or burn that bridge....

Rav: I know you said you lurk on the Candle'Bre site, but I guess it just didn't sink in that you'd seen the thread there regarding my past... 's been an interesting 33 years, that's for sure! Ahhh, and I knew you were kiddin' about the whole Lands of Lorraine thing, but you're right...I could just see some investor who also likes fiction givin' it a read and thinking...."Hmmm...and we just gave our money to this guy?" LMAO.....that'd be golden, actually! As to the company itself and just how everything fell together though....it still makes my head spin. I have no idea how we....got here....you know? *chuckling* It's just one of those things that sorta took on a life of it's own....it's really, really cool though, and I'm glad to be in the midst of it....most fun thing I've ever worked on before!

UR: Absolutely rock solid point regarding scratchware and graphics...and yeah...MULE is....unbelievably cool....

Colon: I can honestly tell you that I've never once been in the position to apply the knowledge I've gained regarding real estate markets. It may be the case then, that I've overlooked some key piece of the puzzle, and it'll wind up being much harder than I realize, but I don't think so. Will keep ya posted though....even if I crash and burn, it'll make a good story....

As to the question about being under pressure to drop the unprofitable computer game element of the company....I dunno...that *could* be the case, but it also presupposes that the game will never turn a profit....I believe it will. I think it'll be a solid, innovative, addictive game that'll sell. I believe it enough that I'm ditching my more traditional and largely assured retirement with the bank to try it out....

-=Vel=-
(who promises to have fun, regardless of what happens next!)

[Urban Ranger]

Originally posted by Velociryx
UR: Absolutely rock solid point regarding scratchware and graphics...and yeah...MULE is....unbelievably cool....

Wouldn't it be awesome if somebody can create a M.U.L.E. lookalike with some better graphics that can be played on the Net?

That can be such a killer

[Skanky Burns]

SIR, the "Hint Detector" is going off the charts!

[FrustratedPoet]

*makes mental note to check out M.U.L.E as soon as possible*

I assume I can get an emulated version of it on the 'net somewhere ... I seem to have misplaced my Atari 800 and C64

[Colon™]

Velociryx, I don't know... In essence, you're taking in-house the job the financial industry does. It's difficult enough to make that work in a multibillion company and I don't believe it's possible at all in an upstart.

But then again, I’m probably too sceptical to ever start a business in the first place so I still wish you the best of luck.

[TCO]

Vel,

a. I'm worried about the funky ideas in your business scheme (in and of themselves)

b. I'm worried that you can think this way.

I reccommend getting a smart business partner and/or running the company on standard methods. You should concentrate on making good games...not on business schemes...

[notyoueither]

GP.

Is there something wrong with someone who is successful in a business using some of his wealth to fund a project of his passion in another field?

It sounds to me now as if Vel hopes to be successful in real estate so that he could subsidize game development. I don't know if he has said that being successful in real estate is necessary for game development. If he had, that would be a mistake.

I think he will learn as he goes. Maybe, he will do both well. Maybe he will only be able to carry off one or the other. At this point he won't go anywhere unless he dreams. Reality will come soon enough.

Only word of advice I would offer Vel. Don't ever tie the one to the other so closely that one could drag the other down. I think that's what has GP concerned (me too).

[Urban Ranger]

The way Vel links two unrelated areas of businesses is certainly unorthodox. It seems, however, that it is no weirder than quite a number of conglomerates: what, tobacco and food?

[TCO]

At least they are consumables that use a common channel.

[Velociryx]

Unorthodox is my middle name....heh

But seriously, NYE summed up quite eloquently the crux of the matter. I view real estate as a hobby, and game making as a passion (along with my writing career, which is also thrown less-than-silently into the mix, btw). The synergy exists in combining hobby and passion, not into a single entity necessarily (tho the structure currently allows for that, so there's no real harm in it), but under the same umbrella in a way that one can finance the other. This is actually not so uncommon as it might seem. The 3M company, for example, uses profits from its company to fund a variety of research projects, many of which have little or nothing to do with their core business, and yet, many of the fruits of their research labors show surprising profits, either by them assuming the manufacture OF those new ideas, or simply selling/leasing them to some other company.

So....yes, NYE's synopsis is an excellent one....the success of my hobby finances my passion.

It's not the sort of synergy the business gurus talk about, but it's synergy in its own fashion....

-=Vel=-

[ravagon]

Originally posted by Urban Ranger
The way Vel links two unrelated areas of businesses is certainly unorthodox. It seems, however, that it is no weirder than quite a number of conglomerates: what, tobacco and food?

The big advantage however is the diversification factor - more a case of not having all eggs in one basket rather than one dragging down the other IMO.
Besides which, the longer Candle'bre goes without requiring an injection of outside funds - the more established it will be and the risk involved will be reduced accordingly.

[Velociryx]

It's me...burning the midnight oil...lol....and Rav, you bring up another excellent point that has, in fact, been the topic of discussion between me and the two people on my "business development" team in the Candle'Bre Group.

The phrase "don't put all our eggs in one basket" has come up more than once, and the two people on the Business Dev. Team have been pretty excited about the prospect of acquiring hard assets that produce a recurring income stream for us (rents from Commercial Real Estate holdings) in order to pay the bills.

That (diversification), coupled with a developmental safety net is an important advantage, IMO. Combine that advantage with the fact that we don't have to hawk our game to a publisher until it's polished, ready, and we're happy with it, sets us up the bomb...er...no, sets us up in a position that's perhaps not unique in the industry, but fairly uncommon....at this point, the publisher needs us more than we need them. We don't rely on the sale of the next game for our very survival, so we can pick and choose when it comes to a distribution deal.

I like that very much....

-=Vel=-

[Scouse Gits]

Wow - what an interesting thread - a treat to read and not a flame in sight.

The very best of luck Vel, may you succeed in all your endeavours and can I sign up as a Beta Tester please?

SG[1]

[ravagon]

Originally posted by Scouse Gits
Wow - what an interesting thread - a treat to read and not a flame in sight.

The very best of luck Vel, may you succeed in all your endeavours and can I sign up as a Beta Tester please?

SG[1]

Possibly due to the fact that the original topic has, er, fallen by the wayside?

I'm guessing the beta-testing phase is still a long way down the track but I'll sign up too if they're looking. Particularly for the "stress test" phase.
[I'm told by our system support guys that if I can't break something then it can't be broken. And sometimes I can break things that were previously thought to be unbreakable. - I'm real popular on Friday nights. ]

[Velociryx]

Hey Scouse Gits! And thank you very much, by the way! I'm not sure I can explain the "no flames" phenomenon, except to say that on the board I've been running for going on three years now, we've had a grand total of two flame wars erupt, and since the inception of the Candle'Bre forums, we've not had the first flame there. Disagreements and differences of opinion, absolutely (especially with regards to the society model--commercial release, and the initial "open source or no" debate we had)...but not the first flame.

I like that. I think it says good things about our chances, and I'm glad to see that the "no flame" thing seems to have followed Candle'Bre back here where it began (also with no flames in the beginning, now that I think on it).

As to testing....here's how we've got it set up:

The code team is currently working on v0.1 of the game. This is a REALLY bare-bones version that is essentially a test of the three-tiered combat system we've put together, movement, the map, and a couple other basic features. This one will remain entirely "in-house" so we can make sure the major components work as advertised, and once we get that nailed down, we'll start adding components sequentially (Fate Card Engine and Research Module will be next, IIRC).

Starting then, we'll begin expanding our circle of testers with that, and each subsequent release. Best way to make sure your name doesn't fall through the cracks is to head to my site (http://www.angelfire.com/sc2/hartpence), click on the "Discussion Forums" link, and then to the "Candle'Bre" section, and make an entry in the "Sign In Thread" as a tester. Just leave me your e-mail addy there, and as soon as we reach that stage in the game, we'll have our testing crew at the ready!

We're also putting no particular limits on people....I know that a lot of companies don't want testers who can't give at least x hours a week...Bah! Who cares...if you like games, and if ours intrigues you, you're welcome to sign on!

-=Vel=-

[TCO]

Internal diversification to companies has no inherent financial value. This is a part of CAPM theory. Maybe you learned this in econ class.

[Velociryx]

GP: What you say is true, however, it is clear that internal diversification of companies provides the same protection to a company as it provides an investor who diversifies his stock portfolio.

With a company, a stronger, established division that's making regular profits NOW can be used to help bouy up a new division until it gets its feet under it and becomes well established.

With an individual investor, if you keep all your stocks in small cap tech firms, and the internet bubble bursts suddenly, you find yourself losing most of the value of your portfolio overnight. If you have diversified, your losses in one sector are offset (or at least mitigated) by gains in another.

While it provides no inherent financial value, it often (usually) makes good financial sense. Companies who tie their futures too closely to a particular market or product risk complete obsolesence if conditions change over time. Diversified companies can weather those changes on the basis OF their diversification, because it gives them more time to react to the changing environment.

My goal is not so much to structure the company such that it gains protection from becoming obsolete, as it is to use one "leg" to provide financing for the other. Again, even though there is no natural synergy to be found in the two things I've chosen, there is a certain synergy and symmetry to be found in that I enjoy both, and would have pursued the Real Estate angle even if I hadn't stumbled into making a computer game....

-=Vel=-

[TCO]

I worry that you will not have focus to succeed in either if you try both. It is hard enough to take one avocation from hobby to career. But two?

Also, you can not really rely on real estate income until you rpove that you can make money there. I would look for other sources of funding for your company or at least spend a year or two doing real estate speculation/rental management to show that you can make money here.

[Sarxis]

The terms early retirement and pass the torch come to mind when I think of Firaxis.

Or maybe just more Golf based games. Maybe they should do what Cyan did.

[Velociryx]

GP: Believe me, I worry on that as well. In fact, I would say that although our plan spares us (or potentially spares us) from running afoul of some of the more common pitfalls that other companies face when starting up, it opens up some new dangers as well, the one you mentioned being chief among them.

Actually, it's made slightly more complicated than just that, cos as I mentioned, in addition to those two elements and holding down my dayjob, I'm also pursuing my career as an author. Worked for a couple hours on the next book last night, as a matter of fact.

So...juggling a hobby and two passions, trying to take all three to the next level, and doing that while holding down a day-job...yes, it's taxing. No doubt about that. I've been surviving on 3-4 hours a sleep a night for as long as I can remember...lol

There's a possibility that the end result will be a totally burnt out Vel who crashes and burns the whole thing, with nothing getting accomplished for trying to do too much at once.

I can't deny that as a possibility, cos it's out there.

I can say though, that the thing that has kept it from happening so far is that none of this stuff FEELS like work. I'm having a great time, exhausting or no. It's been....fun. I think as long as I'm enjoying myself and the journey, the liklihood of burnout is lessened. Should that change, however, it's time to take a long, hard look at slowing down.

Mostly, I think it's a recepie for a short life...lol...can't keep that pace up long without killin' yourself, which means I'd better hurry. I got no plans on dying just yet....

-=Vel=-

[TCO]

Make it simpler. Ditch the real estate speculation. It doesn't "smell good" and has no synergy with the other two. If you need more funds appeal to family, or work a night job. The author/game creation seem to have reasonable synergy. For instance you could use research for the Cour de lane game (or whatever) as background for a story.

[FrustratedPoet]

Why do the business areas need to have synergy at all?
It seems to me that Vel's ability to succeed (or perhaps not) in any one of the areas has no effect on his ability to succeed in any of the others.

His writing skills have nothing to do with making computer games. How do these two areas have synergy?
As long as no two areas of the business become so integrated that any struggling ones drag down the successful ones (as has already been mentioned) then it shouldn't matter what money-making avenues are explored ... should it?

I have no training in business or economics, so I might be talking out of my a$$ here ... but I really can't see the necessity for having a business with synergy.

It is important however, not to overstretch yourself. While it may seem you won't succeed unless you put in long hours, or however much you enjoy the 'work' , there will be no faster path to failure than trying to do too much, too soon.

Just my $0.02.
Also, this is a great thread by the way ... a very humane thread-jacking, the original topic didn't suffer and you put it out of it's misery ...

[TCO]

game creation and writing are both capital lite, creative pursuits. Several novels have been made from games and visa versa.

[Velociryx]

Hiya Stoo!

Synergy is a coolio word. The word first came into wide spread use thanks to a man whom I regard as being quite possibly the most brillant mind ever, R. Buckminster Fuller. Some of the ideas he patented in the 30's are ahead of their time even today, and he wrote a pair of books on the mathematical concept of synergy...essentially the notion that the whole of a thing is greater than the sum of its parts. The best physical illustration of this in the body of Buckminster Fuller's own work was the creation (discovery?) of the Geodesic Dome. A dome that can be built of any size by individual pieces you can put together by hand.....the larger it gets, the stronger it gets, it's the most efficient building ever made in terms of ease of environmental control, overall structural integrity, ease of assembly, and encloses the greatest amount of interior space with the least amount of material. A simply amazing piece of design.

In the 80's, the corporate world caught the fever, and turned it into a buzz word, organizing their businesses around the notion that there are certain efficiencies to be had in corporations branching out into related businesses that could share certain resources in common. The best new-economy example I can think of is Wireless Companies. Generally, wireless companies offer a range of services that all use the wireless (satellite based and driven) resource....thus, these companies can branch out into paging, cell phones, and hand held internet devices....three very different services they can market, but they all load-share the common (satellite) resource. Thus, relatively fewer dollars need be spent on infrastructure because the businesses DO have things in common.

A thing to keep in mind is that all businesses, regardless of type, have a certain amount of synergy, simply by being businesses. That is to say, all businesses require an accounting department, and all businesses share a need for a purchasing function, so these two things, if nothing else, can be shared, regardless of any other synergies that exist, however, a corporation that enters into a radically different business than their core business must have a certain level of expertise in the field, and must build the bulk of the infrastructure to support the new area of business from the ground up (or, the alternate plan, which does not really apply in our case, is to buy a smallish, well staffed company (there's your expertise) that's currently in the business you wanna break into.

So...do business units REQUIRE synergy in order to function side by side? Absolutely not. There's nothing stopping a chicken farmer from pouring his profits into creating a computer manufacturing outfit, and if the farmer has good working knowledge of both fields, or hires a good front man for the one he knows little about, he can thrive at it. Having said that though, synergistic business units have some attractive advantages (chief among them being load-sharing of resources in common...resources that the company already has access to and expertise in).

Whew...LOL...okay, THAT was quite the little ramble...sorry 'bout that....BUT....that's the essence of why synergy is a good thing.

Do we need it? Not necessarily, but it's cool when and where you can find it.

-=Vel=-

[Velociryx]

D'oh! Sorry folks...lol...it appears my ramble on synergy killed the discussion....

Now back to your regularly scheduled programming!

-=Vel=-

[TCO]

Look what happened to Alan...he thought he knew how to change the industry also...

I suggest getting some time as an employee at a game shop before marching out on your own. You will learn a lot that will help you...