Agnostics. - Page 2

General Ludd · May 22, 2002, 15:10

Quote:

Originally posted by SlowwHand
Osweld, you speak English in Canada? Or are you French?
What you quoted says, Athesists say they don't believe.

I know what you said, and the point of my post - which you seemed to of missed (Duurr do you speak english in Texas?

) - is that antagonists are not 'sitting on the fence' and I don't see how there is even a 'fence' to sit on. And I asked you how you came to this conclusion.

But I take it you can't answer me, since you seemed to have just made a lame attempt at patronising me, rather then actually adressing my post.

SlowwHand · May 22, 2002, 15:14

Quote:

Originally posted by orange
i don't agree, but man that title had me laughing

You can't say balls.

SlowwHand · May 22, 2002, 15:15

Osweld, I explained my line of thought. That's all there is to it.
If you want it to go deeper, sorry.

General Ludd · May 22, 2002, 15:23

Quote:

Originally posted by SlowwHand
Osweld, I explained my line of thought. That's all there is to it.
If you want it to go deeper, sorry.

So you have no real line of thought behind it? You just - for some unkown reason, with no explenations or reasons as to why - think that agnostics are somehow being indecisive? I should of know.

Texans.

SlowwHand · May 22, 2002, 15:29

What other explanation other than indecisive is there Osweld?
Are you undecided about being agnostic? Now that's really bad.

Caligastia · May 22, 2002, 15:30

Quote:

Originally posted by Boris Godunov
I don't know the true nature of God, nor does anyone, and I don't think humans can ever know the true nature of God

You are correct. Humans cannot possibly know God fully, we must first ascend through many lifetimes of experience.

SlowwHand · May 22, 2002, 15:30

That's one line of thought, Cal.

General Ludd · May 22, 2002, 15:36

Quote:

Originally posted by SlowwHand
What other explanation other than indecisive is there Osweld?

Maybe that they have decided that they don't care?

God exists: whop-de-do
God doesn't exist: whop-de-do

Either way, it means nothing to an agnostic. They do not care one way or the other. There is no fence for them to sit on.

SlowwHand · May 22, 2002, 15:42

I think the basic problem here is that you don't understand the term "sitting on a fence".

General Ludd · May 22, 2002, 15:46

Quote:

Originally posted by SlowwHand
I think the basic problem here is that you don't understand the term "sitting on a fence".

Yes I do - you are saying that agnostics can't decide whether god exists or not, or that they are leaving their options open. When, infact, the existance of a god is a complete non-issue to an agnostic.

Bereta_Eder · May 22, 2002, 15:49

basically agnostics have CONCLUDED that it is impossible to know if God exists or not.

Usually there is also the complimentary but not obligatory feeling that they don't care eitherway.

agnostics are primarely interested with what is happening down here and now. bettering the world they live in without wasting time in supernatural dilhemas for which there is no answer. (that is basically there life philisophy)

SlowwHand · May 22, 2002, 15:53

Quote:

Originally posted by Osweld

Yes I do - you are saying that agnostics can't decide whether god exists or not, or that they are leaving their options open. When, infact, the existance of a god is a complete non-issue to an agnostic.

You're a total lost cause.
The very word AGNOSTIC exists purely for the reason you say is not an issue.

Caligastia · May 22, 2002, 15:58

I have more respect for an agnostic who has the humility to admit that he doesnt know whether God exists or not, than for an atheist who arrogantly states that he knows God doesnt exist.

MrFun · May 22, 2002, 16:00

Slowwhand, what have you been smoking when you initiated this thread??

I'm not agnostic nor atheist -- I'm a non-conformist Christian, in that I do not belong to any Christian denomination. Yet, I have strong beliefs in Jesus Christ, and that there is a God in the universe -- only one, true God.

But I'm sure you can find something wrong with that Slowwhand, with your refusal to elaborate on your premise.

But don't worry -- reading these posts here that you made is good for one thing -- comic relief.

SlowwHand · May 22, 2002, 16:00

Not me. As least an atheist is committed to a belief of some kind,
whether I agree or not.
An atheist is too wimpy to cast their lot one way or the other.

And MrFun. I explained it once, twice, thrice for Osweld.
If you can't follow the bouncing ball, it's not my responsibility.

Caligastia · May 22, 2002, 16:04

Better edit that post again sloww...

General Ludd · May 22, 2002, 16:05

Quote:

Originally posted by SlowwHand
The very word AGNOSTIC exists purely for the reason you say is not an issue.

Yes - it exists because people debate about the existience of god, but agnostics don't participate in that. Are agnostics "sitting ont he fence" because they don't care about that debate? Are they "leaving their options open" simply because they don't give a **** about what everyone else else does?

MrFun · May 22, 2002, 16:09

Quote:

Originally posted by SlowwHand
Not me. As least an atheist is committed to a belief of some kind,
whether I agree or not.
An atheist is too wimpy to cast their lot one way or the other.

And MrFun. I explained it once, twice, thrice for Osweld.
If you can't follow the bouncing ball, it's not my responsibility.

Ok -- I reread your posts. So you did make your arguments. Still, thanks for the comic relief.

Caligastia · May 22, 2002, 16:12

Quote:

Originally posted by SlowwHand
Not me. As least an atheist is committed to a belief of some kind,
whether I agree or not.
An agnostic is too wimpy to cast their lot one way or the other.

To me its more wimpy to give in to the arrogant egoism that says "I know God doesnt exist" than to admit "I dont know for sure because I dont know enough about the universe".

Those who exercise self-control over egoistic impulses are not "wimpy" IMO.

SlowwHand · May 22, 2002, 16:16

Oh come on.
Religious people don't want to burn in Hell, so they do what they are trained is right.
Atheists don't believe in Hell, so screw it all.
Agnostics are just busy pissing their pants over what to believe.

Clear Skies · May 22, 2002, 16:19

I don't know if I count as a proper agnostic or what - my beliefs are seriously screwed at the moment, just like everything else about me.

I was thinking about this at the weekend, and I thought that no-one had ever explored the possibility that the best thing is just to go into the unknown with your head held high. I used to be a Christian but fell out of the faith because I wasn't up to it or good enough; I tried being atheistic but I know there's someone out there. Sometimes I shiver and feel like someone's watching over me, or something like that.

I know all this sounds pretty insane, but bear with me. I figured I didn't need to believe in what was going to happen when I died, I figured I could just...let it happen. Sounds a bit apathetic. I don't know how to explain it any better - it's like I don't really want to know what's going to happen, I want it just to happen, so I can react to it however I think best. I do believe that things don't just stop after you die, but I don't go any further than that - I want to find out rather than be told.

Someone call the men in white coats, cos I think I need them. Unless that made any sense to anyone.

Tiamat · May 22, 2002, 16:20

Quote:

Originally posted by Osweld

Texans.

Hey....hey HEY NOW!

So I'm a bit like Mr.Fun. I was raised in the church, have gotten away from it but still have my belief that there is something out there so what does that make me? An Agnostic?

SlowwHand · May 22, 2002, 16:20

Mortal man can't grasp it, Fanatic. Not to worry.

Caligastia · May 22, 2002, 16:22

Quote:

Originally posted by SlowwHand
Oh come on.
Religious people don't want to burn in Hell, so they do what they are trained is right.

You are over-generalizing. While I agree many in organised religion are there because of a fear of hellfire, there are also many "religious people" who are religious because they have experienced God in some way.

Quote:

Atheists don't believe in Hell, so screw it all.

Many "religious people" dont believe in hell either. I dont. What do you mean by "religous people" anyway? People who believe in God or people who practice organised religion?

Quote:

Agnostics are just busy pissing their pants over what to believe.

You could say that anyone who is unsure about anything is just "pissing their pants".

MrFun · May 22, 2002, 16:27

I think spirituality and religion are two separate concepts.

You can have both in whatever you believe, or you can be spiritual without religion.

However, I don't think you can be religious without being spiritual.

I guess since I'm a non-conformist Christian, I am spiritual but not religious.

SlowwHand · May 22, 2002, 16:27

Quote:

Originally posted by Caligastia

You could say that anyone who is unsure about anything is just "pissing their pants".

Exactly. Now we're all clear on the subject.

Caligastia · May 22, 2002, 16:28

Quote:

Originally posted by SlowwHand

Exactly. Now we're all clear on the subject.

It must be great to be so sure of everything, or are you one of those "pant pissers"?

SlowwHand · May 22, 2002, 16:30

Oh no. I know that the only automatic wrong decision, is no decision.

General Ludd · May 22, 2002, 16:30

Quote:

Originally posted by SlowwHand
Oh come on.
Religious people don't want to burn in Hell, so they do what they are trained is right.
Atheists don't believe in Hell, so screw it all.
Agnostics are just busy pissing their pants over what to believe.

I'm agnostic because I think that people who bicker at each other about whether god exists or not, who's god is better, what gender God is, ect.. are completely missing the point of religon, and are taking it all way too literally. Religon, in it's most basic form, is about philosphies, teachings, stories, and legends - not about whether or not there is a big guy in the sky.

I believe that there are a million different deffinitions of "God" - it's just a word, or a medaphore, for life, the workings of the universe, and existance.

Bereta_Eder · May 22, 2002, 16:39

putting people in neat little boxes based on whether they are atheists, religious or agnostic doesn't really stick.

There are religious people who are great just as they are some who are disgusting.

same with the other 2 "categories".

in the end of the day is the system of values that one holds that counts and that is NOT confined in one of the 3 categories.

you can find a religious person and an agnostic or an atheist who share virtually the same system of values.