The Matter with GNP

dexters · June 5, 2002, 01:09

I'm sort of attracted to the economic data in Civ games. I noticed that in Civ 3 and in Civ 2, the GNP figures doesn't seem to reflect what it would be like in the real world.

I know I know. This is just a game, and trust me, I'm one of the biggest advocates of that argument, but this is also just a statistic. Making it reflect the mammoth GNP of a superpower like the US should be easy, right?

Below, I've attached a pic from a Civ 3 game I'm currently dominated. Economic data are highlighted. Note that I'm the world's foremost industrial power. I'm in the modern age.

My population is 27,800,000 (approx)
My GNP is listed as 1,652 Million or in other words 1,652,000,000 To use North Americans that translated only into 1.65 BILLION or 1,652 Million to the Brits.

Canada's GNP is around 800 Billion US Dollars and it has a slightly larger population than my own Civ. In Civ II, there was the same result. I once played a game I've already won and milked it for all it was worth. Building a whopping 250,000,000 population. Almost the size of the US population. And my GNP was up at around 5 or 6 Billion

Couldn't Firaxis just add 3 extra zeros? That would push the figures closer to what I'd expect to see a superpower gross. My 1.65 billion in GNP will become 1.65 Trillion.

Any insights? comments? insults?

dexters · June 5, 2002, 01:10

Forgot to attach image

Here it is.

King of Rasslin · June 5, 2002, 01:40

The demographics were too complicated. Firaxis made them user-friendly.

delsolsi · June 5, 2002, 01:57

Is there a way to see demagraphics for the other civ's? I know F11 will show my demagraphics but I'm curious where the other civ's rank but I don't know how to see theirs.

Adagio · June 5, 2002, 06:03

Quote:

Originally posted by delsolsi
Is there a way to see demagraphics for the other civ's? I know F11 will show my demagraphics but I'm curious where the other civ's rank but I don't know how to see theirs.

I don't think that's possible, but I'd like to see the who's number one, written next to the numbers, as in earlier Civ games...

MiloMilo · June 5, 2002, 12:54

Dexters: look at it this way: economic info does not represent dollars, it represents one unit of trade, or one gold. Notice that you average annual income is 12 per capita. Obviously that's not 12 dollars. More like $12,000, or maybe even $120,000 if you were very built-up. So, I think the zeros you are missing are implicit.

dexters · June 5, 2002, 15:50

interesting thought their Milo. I think you've got a good point.

ricardojahns · June 6, 2002, 12:47

GNP= number of GOLD your cities produce (go look at the advisor screen and you will find the same number as a total)

Manufactured Goods= number of SHIELDS your cities produce (go count them and you'll see)

Land area= number of TILES divided by 100 your civ controls

Productivity (this one i'm not sure about, have to check furhter)= number of resources your cities produce (trade+shields+food), but i'm not sure

C-ya

Rebel Rick

Panag · June 6, 2002, 15:29

Quote:

Originally posted by dexters
Forgot to attach image

Here it is.

hi ,

they should do something about "income" , always so low , ...

have a nice day

AIL · June 7, 2002, 03:29

Is the corruption included in the GNP?

The Viceroy · June 7, 2002, 04:08

Milo you took the words out of my mouth

I wonder if anybody out there has attempted to put a $ value on 1 gold

actually, the value of 1 gold is dictated to by the timeline .. think about it, 1 gold per turn when the turn = 20yrs is going to be different from 1 gold per turn when the turn = 1 yr .. or you could look at it another way, and say its still the same value, its just economic realities of 3000BC mean your 20 times more inneficient .. ???

The next problem is that civ doesn't give a set population rate per person, if you have a city of 1, (i think thats 10,000), a city of 2 (30,000) etc .. the 1 worker/citizen is not equally reflected .. basically a city of 1 has a citizen say generating 1 gold per turn.. so 10,000 people make 1 gold per turn, in a city of say 12 .. 1 citizen could be over 100,000 people .. also only making 1 gold per turn. so its very difficult to calculate how much 1 actual person is earning per year.

That really messes up any real economic data unless you compensate for the distortion.

not counting the fact that in the real world, a free market dictates much of the value of currencies .. so its not easy to really work out ..

recommend you simply calculate all the other civ's outputs, compare and work on a % slice of the world economy .. and then compare it to todays % slice .. work that out in todays dollar rate, and hey presto .. a $/gold conversion rate

anybody know what 100% of the worlds economy is in $value ??

Panag · June 7, 2002, 07:45

Quote:

Originally posted by AIL
Is the corruption included in the GNP?

hi ,

it should not be , after-all that is "black" money , ....

have a nice day