Help on World Map & 28 Civs

[bartdanr]

Ok, I'm finally playing some CTP II again, after trying to enjoy Civ III (not that it's a bad game, nor is this the thread to complain...)...anyway, I'm trying to make a simple scenario.

I'm using the patched & modded CTP (Apolyton Pack 1.02) and I changed one itty-bitty line to allow me to have 28 civs. I downloaded Dorian Credé's 400 X 400 Earth Map, and I tried to make a scenario with 28 civs on this map. The scenario creation was pretty easy, after I saved the map as a map, then re-started with the changed line allowing 28 civs, and then I assigned civilization names to all 28 civs, placed one settler for each civ (in an historically accurate position, or reasonably close). I saved the scenario, it seemed to go smoothly.

However, when I try to launch the scenario, it crashes. (The computer doesn't crash, just CTP II does. The music keeps playing, though, even though it kicks me out of CTP II.) Oh, I'm running it on a 1.2 GHz Pentium III with Windows XP with 512 MB RAM.

I'm probably making some really stupid mistake (then again, are there any SMART mistakes?) Could someone take pity on me? Thanks!!

[hexagonian]

OK, I am speculating here for the solution, so don't take this as gospel, and I cannot promise that any of this will work either...

There are two different directories that the game can follow to activate the files for a game - the scenario directory and the default directory. Within the default directory, you also have the Modswapper option.

The secenario setup links to files that are within the scenario directories - those files have the same name as the default files too with no prefix in the name. A scenario will use the files in the scenario over the default game and will link up to the remainder of the files it needs in the default directory. For instance, the game needs the govern.txt file to work. If that file is in the scenario diectory, it will use that file - if it is not, it will go into the default directory and look for the govern.txt file that should be in that folder.

Modswapper files link up to files that have a specific prefix designated in a specially gamefile.txt file. These files are kept in the default directory. For instance, the Apolyton pack has a gamefile, probably designated as APOL_gamefile.txt. This file has the list of all the necessary files needed to run the game, and will look for the files as they are named in this file. That file may have the govern.txt listed as APOL_govern.txt, so it will look for that file istead of the default govern.txt file

The problem is that the Apolyton Pack works through Modswapper, and you are creating a scenario. Most likely, the game will not recognize your scenario if you are trying to launch the game through the scenario option, as it will then look for the files from the default game, not the APOL_ files.

1. What you may have to do is convert all the files that are altered for the Apolyton setup into the scenario setup. This will involve taking all of the files with the APOL_ prefix, duplicating them, removing the APOL_ prefix from the name, and then creating the scenario folder structure and placing those files into the correct directories within that scenario folder structure.

2. You will also have to go through the series of SLIC files used by the Apolyton Pack and all of the files that may have links within them to the APOL_files and rename them to link up. All files have to be able to link up correctly - miss one, and you will crash. I am not familiar with all the files that Dale has altered either, so I cannot tell you which files to look at.

After getting all of the Apolyton Pack files into the scenario structure, you need to be able to launch a basic Apolyton Pack game at that point, through the Scenario option when launching the default game - (you cannot use Modswapper to launch the Apolyton Pack) - and then recreate your map at that point in time. Your current map is linked into the Modswapper files, and will be looking for the files with the APOL_ prefix, so it is probably not salvageable.

Before going through all of that trouble though, what you can try is instead of saving your map with all of units as a scenario, save it instead as a 'saved gamefile' (as you would normally do if you were playing a single-player game) and then when you play the game, load it as a saved game after launching the Apolyton Pack thru Modswapper. This may also not work for your current map either because in attempting to launch the file through the the scenario option, the file may have been corrupted. Still, it is worth a shot.

Another thing to try is to take the APOL_gamefile.txt file, place it in the corresponding scenario folder and rename it gamefile.txt. It may allow you to link up with the files you need to link up. Again, I do not know if this will work...

One final thing - does the Apolyton Pack use GoodMod? If so, was the original map also created using GoodMod? Would there also be a file conflict here?

Anyone else have an opinion on this - as I said, I am guessing on whether this is the case, but having worked in both the scenario and Modswapper setups in the past, this seemed to be what happened.

[bnmac3]

And when your done, post it on here so I can download it PLEASE!!!!!

Thanks

[Martin Gühmann]

Actual there is no need to copy all the text files to the scenario structure and create than the map. If you put files without the prefix into the scenario folder and use the ApolytonPack over the Modswapper option than the game will use the files specified in the gamefile.txt. So if you are using the APOL_gamefile.txt than the game will use the ones of ApolytonPack. So if your scenario is based on the ApolytonPack and you want to create a scenario for this mod than you have to put files with APOL_ prefix into the scenario folder. If you only want to create a map for APOL'Pack than you only have to create a map while you are running APOL'Pack. In the end you only have the map-savegame in the folder. So only what you have to do is to export the map from the original game and improt it again afterwards you changed the mod.

BTW you can find here two maps in this forum for ApolytonPack 1.02. The only think you have to do is once you loaded it and want to use it with APOL'Pack 2.0 you have to open the chat window by typing the apostrophe key and enter /reloadslic. That should be all.

-Martin

[bartdanr]

Ok everyone--here it is!!

Well...almost.

I appreciate everyone's comments, but it looks like the main problem was one of using 28 civs...I can only use 27.

Anyway, I have to prefece this by saying that 99.99% of this was done by *others*, *NOT* me. All I did was take Dorian Credé's scenario for 8 civs on Omnigod's world map, saved it as a map using the "save map" feature while running Apolyon Pack V2.0 in Ultra-Gigantic mode, then added additional civs in historical starting postions (or close to). Then I saved as a scenario, and it works!

Of course, it goes without saying that it runs pretty darn slow. Also, I haven't really de-bugged it, so comments (please be gentle, I'm a virgin to scenario making) would be appreciated.

[Locutus]

Great

I haven't had time to try it yet, unfortunately. Is this a finished scenario or still a beta that needs more testing/debugging? If it's finished, how about submitting it for the File Directory?

[bartdanr]

I'm in the process of playing it. So far, no bugs and I'm around 400 AD or so.

Two changes I might make in a more finalized version:

(1) Colors more suggestive of the underlying Civilization...for example, I think the Arabs should be green, as it is an important color in Islam.

(2) I may want more "historically current" choices in the civs. For example, "United States" isn't really historically accurate to start off at the stone age on the east coast of North America. Perhaps if this is to be a stone-to-stars scenario, then the choices should probably all be reflective of the civs in their original indiginous location, and their ancient name.

However, I think it *is* a playable scenario as is...I've never submitted to the file directory, but I'll give it a shot!

[Locutus]

Hmm, I tried to play this scenario but it crashed while it the game was loading...

[Martin Gühmann]

Originally posted by Locutus
Hmm, I tried to play this scenario but it crashed while it the game was loading...

That sound you use the wrong mod by accident Wouter, but one thing bartdanr mentioned in his initial post I consider as problem is that this scenario is made for ApolytonPack 1.02. Actual if I examined the files correctly there shouldn't be an problem of incompartibility just the /reloadslic thing. Actual this problem would occur if you try to load this scenario with GoodMod for ApolytonPack v.2.0X

-Martin

[Locutus]

D'oh! Yes, I was using the original game. I works fine now.

I don't think /reloadslic is needed, I think that already happens when you load the game. At least the city capture options work fine...

[bartdanr]

It looks like the scenario is now posted on the file database at here .

I'd like to eventually work on some more of these, now that I'm a "scenario virigin" no more!

Thanks everyone for your help!

[Locutus]

Yup, the file is now in the directory and a news item will follow later (if I post too many news items at once people will go nuts )

I for one am looking forward to seeing more scenarios from you!

[Martin Gühmann]

Originally posted by Locutus
I don't think /reloadslic is needed, I think that already happens when you load the game. At least the city capture options work fine...

Interesting but I think that was indented: First create the map, then modify all the files and put them into the scenario file structure.

Originally posted by Locutus
(if I post too many news items at once people will go nuts )

And if you post too less I will go nuts, because I see to many Civ3 ones.

-Martin

[bartdanr]

I've noticed that there have been quite a few hits on the file for this...but no reviews. Do people like it? Hate it? Helpful suggestions? Haughty mocking? Any feedback at all would be nice. Thanks!!!

[agva]

Hi there, I'm quite new on this forum but I often play civ3 and CTP2. I back to CTP2 these days bcos I think CTP2 can support more nations in a very large map(and slave is a very good point for me to play )

I tried to play this 400x400 huge map with 28 players, i followed the instructions(install ctp2, latest patch, super apolyton pack, modswappper) and play the game with pack, but when i end my turn, it crashed.

Did I do anything wrong??? Hmm they asked me to install modswapper 1.5 but there's only a modswappper 1.12 i can download. Also, I can't find the "Apolyon Pack for Ultra-Large Maps 2.0" file, I found the modswappper occassionally, note there's 3 "p"s. =(

I really want to play this map so please help~

[Turambar]

Install modswapper 1.21 it's the same as 1.5 apparently.

[Martin Gühmann]

Originally posted by Turambar
Install modswapper 1.21 it's the same as 1.5 apparently.

And I thought it was v.1.12. But anyway at least I downloaded v.1.12 from Wes' homepage, and it does work with all the mods so no need to worry. But maybe we should inform Locutus about it so he can fix this when he returns.

Unfortunatly there is no Ultra Gigantic Map option in ApolytonPack anymore, to be able to play with ultra gigantic maps just downlad GoodMod and use the according gameplay option.

-Martin

[Immortal Wombat]

I have a question.

Are the mods in ModSwapper sorted chronologically by installation date? When I asked Locutus, he said his were done alphabetically. Just wondering...

[J Bytheway]

I think they're sorted alphabetically by the name of the *_gamefile.txt, with original first. But I'm not sure. I'm fairly sure it's not by installation date.

[Martin Gühmann]

In my ModSwapper the mods are sorted chronologically and it claims to be v.1.12. I downloaded it as I said above from Wes homepage (a long time ago).

-Martin

[J Bytheway]

I just tested mine (v1.12) - I created an AAA_gamefile.txt and it appeared at the top, and an XXX_gamefile.txt appeared at the bottom, regardless of what the title of the mod was. Of course, both were most recent chronologically.

[Immortal Wombat]

Yeah, Martin's results copy mine, and JB's copy Locutus'. How bizarre.

All I want is all my Cradle options together...

[J Bytheway]

Originally posted by Immortal Wombat
All I want is all my Cradle options together...

Then just edit all the crade gamefile.txts so that the last modified dates are all the most recent. Surely that can be the only way they are sorted chronologically.

[J Bytheway]

Incidentally, I can't remember where I downloaded my ModSwapper from, but it wasn't WesW's site.

[J Bytheway]

Also... What file system are you using - I'm using NTFS. That might make a difference.

[Immortal Wombat]

Win98

[J Bytheway]

Well, as dangerous as it is to make a hypothesis on so little data, I guess that what's going on is that under FAT32 the built in loop-through-all-files-in-the-directory goes through in chronological order, but under NTFS it's sorted by name (to optimize file searches) and so we get them in filename order. But it could be a coincidence.

[Immortal Wombat]

Sounds reasonable. I'll have to upgrade

[Locutus]

Yes, it does have to do with the windows version (as I told you, IW, when we had that ICQ conversation ). I noticed the savegames have this same change in sorting order, so it does indeed appear to be an NTFS issue.

[Immortal Wombat]

You didn't tell me, you suggested it. And you didn't use big words like "FAT32", "hypothesis" and "optimize".