How Good are you at Moo2 ?

system370 · June 15, 2002, 20:28

How Quickly can you Kill the Guardian?

How Many turns does it take you ?

Settings:
Galaxy Size : Medium
Galaxy Tech : Average
Galaxy Type : Organic

After turn 150
Before turn 150
Before trun 140
Before turn 130
Before turn 120
Before turn 110
Before Turn 100 !!! - Tell Me how !

vmxa1 · June 15, 2002, 21:10

Can't say as I play on those setting. I am not sure if you can rely on anything anyone says on the web unless they they give details to be verified (hum trust but verify). So I do not know if a poll is valid, but it may be interesting. I see all kinds of post (not here) about winning at impossible level in a given size in so many turns, using some set of traits, that can not be duplicated. I did find one post that showed major milestones up to turn 190 and it was exactly accurate and reproducable. Anyway, I do not want to go after Orion untill Plasma Cannons are researched. I am in no hurry to finish the game and end it before I have done all the tech tree.

genius23 · June 15, 2002, 21:35

u cant realy say someone is 'good' in moo2, since even a trained chimp could take orion early with 2 EMG mercs battleships if he uses a decent race, has some planets for housingcolonies and does the refit empty frigate trick every turn, but it is just no fun, when i play moo2 i want to evolve my race and fight hightech spacebattles.
taking orion early and leveling the entire map with the avenger is imo as cheap as is the refit frigate trick.

Zealot · June 15, 2002, 23:10

What refit frigate trick?

Please, do tell!

vmxa1 · June 16, 2002, 00:57

That is one point. Many people cheat like crazy and then crow about how they did this or that. I see all kinds of post about non creative races doing stuff by 100 or so turns. On imposible maps if you play straight, you can not do them.
The refit deal is : if you build something and it finishes with out using all of the production, the unused productions stays until you post trade goods to collect it. I you build such an item, and then put say an empty frigate in to be refitted then each turn put it back in the que to be refit, the production will just build up. You can generate tons of BC's this way. At least that is what I have heard, I have not tried it. It is some what like what happens if you add an item to the build each time it finsihes that last item, you get the left over used for the next item, a bug, a cheat. Most MP leagues use Housing to prevent it. If you add Housing to the bottom of the queue and never remove it, that stops it. To me if one plays that way, then why not just save all the labor and use an editor to give your self the money, what is the difference? It is not proper. I suspect many of the post I use to see boasting about this or that, used these tricks. It does not take much to see the ones that are actually earning their way.

Skanky Burns · June 16, 2002, 20:32

I see there is someone else as 1337 as me!

I take over 150 turns to do that. I like taking my time, and generally suck at building up fast

Zealot · June 16, 2002, 22:56

Oh that cheat! Hey, you don't need a frigate to do that. Any building/ship/spy can make you earn some extra BCs!
So yes, you should always put housing in the bottom of every queue. Even below *Repeat*!

The Mad Monk · June 16, 2002, 23:00

That's a cheat?!

I always thought that production was supposed to carry over to the next item (like reasearch points in Civ2). This is the first time I've heard it refered to as a bug.

bbess1 · June 17, 2002, 00:58

The best place to research Moo2 strategy is at Geoffery Tobin's
ZOETROPE site. Here is the link
http://www.sff.net/people/zoetrope/
Click on the FTP downloads section
You'll find archives from SFF net's moo2 strategy boards which were active when the game was new. There are literally thousands of pages of stuff there, including blitz tactics that can win the game against the AI in around 100 turns, and in depth Guardian tips. Also scenarios, mods, and editors. It's a goldmine.

vmxa1 · June 17, 2002, 12:10

True, it does not have to be a frigate, that was chosen as it is the one of the cheapest items that can be used.

Spaced Cowboy · June 17, 2002, 17:40

I apparently suck at this game. I seem to like building rather than killing. I'm trying to change my ways though.

vmxa1 · June 17, 2002, 19:03

Me too, I prefer to build. That works fine at Hard, but at impossible it makes it a hard road to travel, at least in Prewarp. Non creative Prewarp causes you to not have so many things, that you need to go after people and soon.

moomin · June 18, 2002, 14:29

Like most other 4x games, early war really is the key to quick, decisive victories. Still, with Moo2 you can happily build your way to victory even om Imp, while I don't think a peaceful builder has a chance at all above monarch in Civ3.

Another reason Moo2 rocks!

vmxa1 · June 18, 2002, 22:05

I agree with you Moom. I played all the way to Deity on Civ3 and ran into all the patches and it can be rough trying to build unless you have a unique location. At the highest levels the AI starts with so many extra units, you have to cut them down ASAP. It is like Moo2 in that if the AI sees you as weak, it is all over you demanding and attacking.

Spaced Cowboy · June 19, 2002, 09:04

Yeah, exactly. I'm not sure I like the idea that the AI knows my strength level or that I know his. I've noticed that in Moo2, once you make contact with another race, you know the location of all of his planets whether they are in your "range" of not. Sometimes I wish there was a little more fog of war in both respects.

vmxa1 · June 19, 2002, 12:51

Well you know that a given race is there at that time, but you can not see the details. You do not know if that planet is a multiple plamet system or what they have for defences, if it is out of range. You do not know if they have lots of pop or just one.

Spaced Cowboy · June 19, 2002, 17:52

I know, but what I'm saying is that if it is within my scanning range, I should know a lot more about it than I do. If it is not, should I even know that the system belongs to them...especially in the early eras of first contact.

From the same repects, how do they know that I have no fleet?

vmxa1 · June 19, 2002, 20:41

Ok, I do not disagree, but it does not bother me.

Spaced Cowboy · June 20, 2002, 09:04

I guess that it makes for a better ai anyhow. If the ai did not know how strong you were, then they would always be hesitant to attack.

I also never have liked the strenght graphs....Sorta takes the fun out of the game when you see that you are already ahead.

R:PM

Bladz · July 1, 2002, 09:26

Oh no.. I think I read someone say that you can't play the hardest setting of MOO II without creative and kick butt! I win with 8 races on huge map about 70 % of the time.
Allow me to intoduce myself. hehe
Really, I don't choose creative ever. 8 points just isn't worth it to me. The only game setting I ever play is the hardest.
Cheats? Why do they even exist? I never understand why people need cheats?
To me.. if you need the cheat.. drop down a game lvl until you get better then move up..
Ok, ok.. if you are already on the lowest... just keep dying till you figure it out! Cheats... how are they fun?

Spaced Cowboy · July 1, 2002, 10:10

Actually, the opposite. Some are saying that choosing the creative at impossible is a negative. You do not have time to build everything that you research.

vmxa1 · July 1, 2002, 12:44

To me it is just another trait, not better, not worse. By that I mean, it does not allow you to win, just because you choose it. Well, maybe at settings below hard and maybe even at hard, but at impossible it can be a hinderence. You gave up a lot of points for it and that makes you weaker at other aspects of the game. What I mean is that I can take it at impossible and win, but I could lose as well. As far as cheats are concerned, I sort of agree, you do not need them and they make you lazy. For testing hypothesis, you could use them. I wanted to test some build strategies and the best test bed was to use an editor to remove all but one AI planet. I just wanted to record the values at each stage of the build and not be concerned about anything else. Last night, I want to test a specific ship, so I used an editor to create it. Once I seen the results, I exit the game. So in other words there is a place for "cheats", just so you do not use them for actual play and pretend you did not.

vmxa1 · July 9, 2002, 11:43

system370, I should have taken note of your handle. At least it was not system360 or 1401.

Anguille2 · July 16, 2002, 08:25

I need big battle ships to destroy the guardian...
The thing is also that i don't like to lose ships, therefore is usually attack when i am pretty confident.

Anguille2 · July 16, 2002, 08:28

Quote:

Originally posted by Bladz
Oh no.. I think I read someone say that you can't play the hardest setting of MOO II without creative and kick butt! I win with 8 races on huge map about 70 % of the time.
Allow me to intoduce myself. hehe
Really, I don't choose creative ever. 8 points just isn't worth it to me. The only game setting I ever play is the hardest.
Cheats? Why do they even exist? I never understand why people need cheats?
To me.. if you need the cheat.. drop down a game lvl until you get better then move up..
Ok, ok.. if you are already on the lowest... just keep dying till you figure it out! Cheats... how are they fun?

Never use cheat neither...still i haven't won on hard since i made i break with MOO2 when Birth of the Federation came out....now i just can't do it anymore

vmxa1 · July 16, 2002, 12:07

Quote:

Originally posted by Anguille2
Never use cheat neither...still i haven't won on hard since i made i break with MOO2 when Birth of the Federation came out....now i just can't do it anymore

If you want a road map to a win on imposible go to Mirv Missile thread around 6/27/02 and look at a detailed run.
Wow someone else actually played BOTF.