Moral values of Apolyton - Page 3

Boris Godunov · July 10, 2002, 23:04

Quote:

Originally posted by Shadowstrike
The difference is that same-sex relationships produce offspring, which is the point of reproduction. I hold that people should try to raise the child, put it up for adoption, or don't have it in the first place. While this may be idealism, our society should try to eliminate the 'need' for abortions with more active programs that encourage kids towards academics, sports or even hobbies, and away from drugs and sex.

Er, I assume you meant same-sex relationships do not produce offspring.

Why is this a bad thing? And surely you don't remotely think all heterosexual couplings are about reproduction? What about just being together with someone you love and care for, regardless of the gender involved? Your logic invalidates any heterosexual relationship where children aren't had. Should people only be allowed to have sex for procreation?

Six Thousand Year Old Man · July 10, 2002, 23:06

*feeling bad about himself for not thinking to champion the right to same-sex encounters before the right to kill in self defence*

Not that I've done either

Dr Strangelove · July 10, 2002, 23:07

Quote:

Originally posted by Six Thousand Year Old Man
Who are the 4 freaks (out of 45) who don't think reading / watching pornography is ok?

STYOM

Me.

Boris Godunov · July 10, 2002, 23:08

Doc, you pervert, you!

Dr Strangelove · July 10, 2002, 23:10

Quote:

Originally posted by Boris Godunov
I'm still amazed over 15% think drunk driving...is PERFECTLY OK!

God Boris, if I had a dollar for every guy who has told me that he thinks drinking alcohol improves his driving skill I could fund top quality AIDS treatment throughou Africa for the next ten years!!

Jon Miller · July 10, 2002, 23:11

I would be with Dr. Strangelove on this issue (not to say that I don't watch porn, I just feel it is wrong)

Jon Miller

Asher · July 10, 2002, 23:11

Christians.

Dr Strangelove · July 10, 2002, 23:12

Quote:

Originally posted by Boris Godunov

Er, I assume you meant same-sex relationships do not produce offspring.

Why is this a bad thing? And surely you don't remotely think all heterosexual couplings are about reproduction? What about just being together with someone you love and care for, regardless of the gender involved? Your logic invalidates any heterosexual relationship where children aren't had. Should people only be allowed to have sex for procreation?

No, he's really confused. Why don't you set him straight? Be gentle.

Six Thousand Year Old Man · July 10, 2002, 23:15

Quote:

Originally posted by Jon Miller
I would be with Dr. Strangelove on this issue (not to say that I don't watch porn, I just feel it is wrong)

Jon Miller

If I do it, it must be ok, is my motto

It's all part of my master plan to become infallible.

Shadowstrike · July 10, 2002, 23:16

Quote:

Originally posted by Boris Godunov

Er, I assume you meant same-sex relationships do not produce offspring.

Why is this a bad thing? And surely you don't remotely think all heterosexual couplings are about reproduction? What about just being together with someone you love and care for, regardless of the gender involved? Your logic invalidates any heterosexual relationship where children aren't had. Should people only be allowed to have sex for procreation?

Yeah. That was a spelling error on my part.

While I certainly don't think that not all couples are out to have the kids, my arguement is that the purpose of sex is procreation. So yes, people should only have sex for hte sake of having kids. Of course such a law would be impossible to govern either way. Trying to find "right" in morality is a vain endevour.

Jon Miller · July 10, 2002, 23:16

the only thing I have going for me is that I do not pay for it

Jon Miller

Asher · July 10, 2002, 23:17

Since when did sex only have one singular purpose?

Boris Godunov · July 10, 2002, 23:18

@Doc

On drunk driving: Well, more seriously, I had a friend in high school who died as a result of driving under the influence, so I guess my opinion is very emotionally tinged. But how anyone can justify the risks, not just to one's self but others as well, is beyond me.

Porn: I feel quite comfortable viewing it because I have never paid for it, thus can't be accused of contributing $$$ to the industry. But I can look at the naughty things all I want, unuhuhunuhuhuhn...

Sorry...

Six Thousand Year Old Man · July 10, 2002, 23:19

Quote:

Originally posted by Jon Miller
the only thing I have going for me is that I do not pay for it

Jon Miller

are you referring to the porn discussion or the same sex relationships discussion?

Jon Miller · July 10, 2002, 23:22

I was refering to the porn discussion

I don't pay for it

Jon Miller

Boris Godunov · July 10, 2002, 23:22

Quote:

Originally posted by Shadowstrike
So yes, people should only have sex for hte sake of having kids. Of course such a law would be impossible to govern either way. Trying to find "right" in morality is a vain endevour.

So I take it that were you to find yourself wedded to an infertile wife, you would either divorce her or not have sex at all? What if you end up being sterile, will you then never have sex?

Should infertile heterosexual couples not have sex because they can't procreate? Should a couple stop having sex once the wife has gone through menopause and no longer can have children?

Sex is not only about procreation. It's about sharing an intimate pleasure with someone else. If it were only about procreation, why would it be so pleasurable to do?

Jon Miller · July 10, 2002, 23:23

since I don't pay for it, it is mostly harming me

Jon Miller

Jon Miller · July 10, 2002, 23:24

but that does not say that I think that it is OK

Jon Miller

Six Thousand Year Old Man · July 10, 2002, 23:29

Quote:

Originally posted by Winston
You might also ask, why do currently 14 people think it's okay to smoke marihuana, while only 13 think it's okay to smoke tobacco.

Not to rehash this, so to speak, but I don't have to feel bad about supporting the big dope companies and the powerful pro-dope lobby, when buying MJ. Cigarettes, well...

devilmunchkin · July 11, 2002, 02:11

1.Curse and swear - ha ha ha ! fvck yeah!
2.Tell a lie to family and friends - granted that people here are online.....and though i see alot of meeting going on here, how much do you really know about people here. you'd be suprised.
3. Call in sick eventhough I'm/they're not - no no no. poly ppl don't call in sick..especially those who work with computers.....when they work is WHEN they come to poly!
4. Drink alcohol Smoke tobacco Smoke marihuana Take drugs, i.e. speed, cocaine, heroin etc. - given?
5. Drive while under the influence of alcohol, marihuana or drugs - well..how else will they get to poly meetings?!
6. Run a red light - well, if they're under the influence!
7.Watch/read pornography - well, I don't....but as for the 90% male population here....we're no so sure.

8. Have same sex relations - for all the talk about "manliness"...you gotta wonder.
9. Go through a divorce - how is this immoral?
10.Cheat on my/their spouse or significant other- some poly people have.
11. Borrow money, knowing I/they can't repay the lender on time§-some have done that too...prolly not too many though.
12. Cheat on my/their tax return - good question.
13. Cheat on welfare/social benefits - arn't most rich computer guys?
14. Steal items at the supermarket - not for these fish.
15. Have an abortion- 90% male population. if it happens, i'd pay money to see it.

16. Have artificial fertilization performed - heheheheheeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!!!

need i garble more?
17. Have an organ transplant performed - well..if they needed it yes. but how is this immoral?
18. Physically correct or punish my/their kids - there is a difference between punishing your kids and excessively punishing them. the phrase, as it's stated, isn't immoral.
19. Not inform authorities of child abuse/neglect or spousal abuse - not here. poly guys would report it...or do something themselves.
20. Kill another person3. in self defense - who wouldn't??? not immoral.
21. Kill another person, not in self defense - hmmmmmmmmmmm

Mr. President · July 11, 2002, 02:19

I never thought I'd hear the words "Apolyton" and "moral values" in the same sentence.

Straybow · July 11, 2002, 02:36

Way too vague

Faboba · July 11, 2002, 02:44

I'm glad to see there are still plenty of likeminded people who believe in killing for fun and profit.

Faboba · July 11, 2002, 02:57

1.Curse and swear - Don't ask me. I don't ****ing curse!

2.Tell a lie to family and friends - They're lying to you; it's only FAIR

3. Call in sick eventhough I'm/they're not - Yes. It's better than being truthful and telling their employer how much they hate their job isn't it?

4. Drink alcohol Smoke tobacco Smoke marihuana Take drugs, i.e. speed, cocaine, heroin etc. - Whatever ails you. Learn to draw the limit I say but that limit is for the person themselves to determine, not me.

5. Drive while under the influence of alcohol, marihuana or drugs - If I stopped them how would I get the stoned bastards to get out my ****ing house??!

6. Run a red light - If no one is crossing? Sure, why not?

7.Watch/read pornography - Oh course not! I... never have.... no.... not..... ever....... *cough*

8. Have same sex relations - So long as they don't try and have them with me they can do whatever they want.

9. Go through a divorce - Yes. And special dispensation should be given to partners who asassinate their spouses during the process. At least you know they have passion....

10.Cheat on my/their spouse or significant other - No. This one's not justifiable. If you want to sleep with other people break up, get a divorce. None of this cloak and dagger ****.

11. Borrow money, knowing I/they can't repay the lender on time§ - Capitalism is based on just such a principal. All hail!

12. Cheat on my/their tax return - No

13. Cheat on welfare/social benefits - No

14. Steal items at the supermarket - Stealing is wrong. Sorry.

15. Have an abortion - Damn right. In fact it should be free. Wait... free clinics cost money, right? More people should be FORCED to have abortions.

16. Have artificial fertilization performed - Why not? I suppose this is a bad idea because of growing populations but if a lesbian couple wanted to have a kid this would be the way to go so... thumbs up on this.

17. Have an organ transplant performed - Yes.... how would this be immoral anyway?

18. Physically correct or punish my/their kids - If it's justified. Sometimes you have to resort to itin order to teach the buggers a lesson. I know that was the case when I was younger.

19. Not inform authorities of child abuse/neglect or spousal abuse - Got to inform. Call it duty I guess....

20. Kill another person3. in self defense - Hell yes! In fact if anyone endangers your life in the slightest you should be entitled to kill them.

21. Kill another person, not in self defense - For fun and profit? Sure, why not. It's legal if you don't get caught. If you do get caught you deserve it for being so ****ing stupid.

Al B. Sure! · July 11, 2002, 09:50

Look how you rich mother****ers think there's nothign wrong with using drugs, having sex with fags, having abortions... don't you find anything wrong with the fact that you are rich and do these things?

BeBro · July 11, 2002, 09:53

What role does it play that one is rich or not?

Al B. Sure! · July 11, 2002, 10:04

1.Curse and swear - Who the hell cares. Just words. Moral

2.Tell a lie to family and friends - Though you shouldn't lie and lies come back to you in the end, saying a lie can usually cause less trouble than the truth. Moral

3. Call in sick eventhough I'm/they're not - Not a big deal. It's using the system to your advantage. If you're very healthy, why do you got to lose your sick days? Moral

4. Drink alcohol Smoke tobacco Smoke marihuana Take drugs, i.e. speed, cocaine, heroin etc. - SINS! Drugs, alcohol, and tobacco do nothing for you! SIN

5. Drive while under the influence of alcohol, marihuana or drugs - Even Worse! Too many INNOCENT people die in drug related accidents Sin

6. Run a red light - Could cause an accident but it's usually not a big deal at all Moral

7.Watch/read pornography - If porno reduces rape and/or pre-marital sex than I guess it's alright, but it should still be looked down upon Sin

8. Have same sex relations - Debatable No Comment

9. Go through a divorce - It's a sad situation that most marriages end in divorce. Divorce needs to be seen as an unacceptable act if we are to reduce these divorce rates. I know I'll try to not get a divorce Sin

10.Cheat on my/their spouse or significant other- Horrible Sin

11. Borrow money, knowing I/they can't repay the lender on time§- Well as long as you repay them eventually... Moral

12. Cheat on my/their tax return - If you can get away with it... good job. You're cheating the system instead of getting cheat by it Moral

13. Cheat on welfare/social benefits - Same as above Moral

14. Steal items at the supermarket - If you're stealing from the supermarket, you must damn well need the food... Moral

15. Have an abortion- Too many people who have abortions are rich ass *****es Sin

16. Have artificial fertilization performed - Let them have kids Moral

17. Have an organ transplant performed - If they needed it... Now those sickly kids who have had twenty-seven organ transplants... now that's wrong Moral

18. Physically correct or punish my/their kids - It's alright within bounds Moral

20. Kill another person3. in self defense - What could possibly be wrong with survival? Moral

21. Kill another person, not in self defense - KILL THE SINNERS; killing for a better society is moral Moral

thanks

Shi Huangdi · July 11, 2002, 21:27

"Though you shouldn't lie and lies come back to you in the end, saying a lie can usually cause less trouble than the truth."

So the thing that causes you the less trouble is moral? Machiavelli would be proud!

"SINS! Drugs, alcohol, and tobacco do nothing for you! SIN"

Posting on Apolyton does nothing for you, is that a sin? What about chewing gum? Or playing computer games?

"Could cause an accident but it's usually not a big deal at all Moral"

So doing something that stands a good chance of causing an accident and killing someone is fine, just to save you time?

"Well as long as you repay them eventually... Moral"

But then you are cheating the lender, who expects the money back at a certain time.

"If you can get away with it... good job. You're cheating the system instead of getting cheat by it"

Shifting the burden to more honest people...... Yeah, good job.

"Cheat on welfare/social benefits - Same as above"

And just as above you are creating an unnessecary burden on honest hardworking taxpayers by driving welfare costs up.

"If you're stealing from the supermarket, you must damn well need the food.."

What happened to thou shalt not steal? You're looking more and more like a hypocrite, what with you putting down quotes from the Koran and stuff.

"Too many people who have abortions are rich ass *****es"

I am pro-life, but what does wealth have to do with abortion? Poor people have them too.

"KILL THE SINNERS; killing for a better society is moral"

So you presume to judge who is moral and who is not and kill those who are not? I guess you forgot "judge not lest ye be judged". And didn't Jesus say he came down on Earth to help us sinners? But if you really think sinners should be killed, you can always start with yourself since we are all sinners.

AS, your morality ideas are a joke. With all the preaching you do around here you are Apolyton's biggest hypocrite.

SnowFire · July 11, 2002, 23:58

I find it really hard to believe fewer people think it's okay to have same-sex relations than an abortion.

Almost one myself. I mean, I didn't say drugs were okay, even though I support the rights of others to use them. 'cause they're not okay and worse than stupid.
Same-sex relations is a bit thornier issue. I ended up voting it was okay under the reasoning that since homosexuality seems to be in-born, it can't be all that bad in God's sight.

Curse and swear: Um, no. Far overused by people today, and really shouldn't be done at all.

Tell a lie to family and friends: No, exceptions far too rare (You listen and listen good- you're going to tell your parents that bananas are your favorite food, or I'm going to BLOW YOUR BRAINS OUT! HAHAHAHA...)

Call in sick eventhough I'm/they're not: Worse than the above- lying to people who pay you.

Drink alcohol: Um, no.

Smoke tobacco: No! And thank god for the NJ Legislature passing the 75 cent increase in cigarette taxes! I can now laugh at people buying cigarettes more and say "Sucks to be you!" as I give them to them! Well, if I didn't mind being fired, that's certainly what I'd do, at least.

Smoke marihuana: Idiots. Not as bad as cigarettes, but still bad. Like alcohol, for the people who hate themselves and want to become somebody else for awhile.

Take drugs, i.e. speed, cocaine, heroin etc.: Ugh. Guess.

Drive while under the influence of alcohol, marihuana or drugs: NO.

Run a red light: Ah, the smell of smashed pedestrian... NO.

Watch/read pornography: No!
Have same sex relations: See above. A careful yes.
Go through a divorce: If ya aren't happy, best to split up sometimes.
Cheat on my/their spouse or significant other: Get the divorce above. Then it's not cheating. So no.

Cheating on stuff, stealing: No! Cheating is bad! Stealing is bad! 'cause!

Have an abortion: Not sure if I would do it, but plenty of cases it's certainly understandable and okay (like congenital diseases that doom the baby to a short painful life anyway).
Have artificial fertilization performed: Yup.
Have an organ transplant performed: I'm amazed that this ties cursing for least objections. It should top the list. (and it only ties after my vote!)

Physically correct or punish my/their kids: Very rarely, and lightly, but yes.
Not inform authorities of child abuse/neglect or spousal abuse: Nope.
Kill another person in self defense: Yes.
Kill another person, not in self defense: Yes, because you're defending something else, be it another person, or an idea (liberty!), or something even less or more tangible (gee, that's vauge).

Shi Huangdi · July 12, 2002, 00:06

"Um, no."

I'd agree with you that it's not a good idea, but how is it that drugs/alcohol/tobbaco are actually immoral to use?

"I ended up voting it was okay under the reasoning that since homosexuality seems to be in-born, it can't be all that bad in God's sight."

Isn't then the desire to watch porn/have premarital relations inborn?