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View Poll Results: Should we now open embassies?
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Group 1 - Yes, start with the cheapest and go on as long as we can afford it, but not America and France.
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5 |
9.43% |
Group 1 - Yes, start with the cheapest and go on as long as we can afford it, including America and France.
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13.21% |
Group 1 - Yes, in any order, the foreign minister has the power to decide this.
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20 |
37.74% |
Group 2 - No, don't spend money on embassies now.
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21 |
39.62% |
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July 18, 2002, 18:05
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#1
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Civ4: Colonization Content Editor
Local Time: 05:35
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Dec 2001
Posts: 11,117
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OFFICIAL: Should we now open embassies?
This poll is official, because I was authorized by the Foreign minister to open it, in result of the turnchat July 18th.
We have contact to 11 AI civs. 2 of them, France and America, are our immediate neighbors. Greece and Germany are a bit farther. Rome, The Aztecs, Iroquois, England, Russia, Babylon and Persia are very far. See the minimap below.
We have 363 gold and are making +9 per turn.
The question is, shall we begin to open embassies with AI civs now?
Prices are:
Rome | 61 gold
| Greece | 43 gold
| America | 32 gold
| Aztecs | 63 gold
| Iroquois | 64 gold
| France | 35 gold
| Germany | 44 gold
| England | 47 gold
| Russia | 49 gold
| Babylon | 61 gold
| Persia | 43 gold
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Options are:
Group 1 - Yes, start with the cheapest (nearest) and go on as long as we can afford it, but not America and France (our likely victims).
Group 1 - Yes, start with the cheapest (nearest) and go on as long as we can afford it, including America and France (our likely victims).
Group 1 - Yes, in any order, the foreign minister has the power to decide this.
Group 2 - No, don't spend money on embassies now.
I could have made this a multi-choice poll, but that would probably be only a clickfest and it would be hard to decide, which option won. Considering, that we anyway need embassies with everyone at some point, I think this approach should be the best.
If Group 1 (Yes) gets more votes than Group 2 (No), we will start to build embassies now, and the order is determined by the "Yes" option with the most votes.
If Group 2 (No) gets more votes than Group 1 (Yes), no embassies will be built for now.
This poll is open for 3 days.
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July 18, 2002, 18:30
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#2
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Deity
Local Time: 00:35
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Feb 2001
Posts: 21,822
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I can't vote (STUPID FREAKING GOD****ED MESSED UP...), so make it +1 for Group 2.
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[Obama] is either a troll or has no ****ing clue how government works - GePap
Later amendments to the Constitution don't supersede earlier amendments - GePap
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July 18, 2002, 19:19
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#3
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King
Local Time: 23:35
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Of GOW's half of BOB
Posts: 1,847
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I believe there is little to be gained from opening embassies at this point. Though if they get more expensive over time it could be worthwhile to get them early. Still I would hold off alittle bit. However I believe we should open an emabssy with america right before we attack so we see the strength of the defense in washington.
Aggie
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July 18, 2002, 22:47
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#4
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Prince
Local Time: 22:35
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: UT, Austin - The live music capital of the world
Posts: 884
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Im not a big fan of embassies period, only really establish them for strategic perposes (like if the best path to an enemy is through a neighbor, I'll get a right of passage agreement and such), and I don't usually do this until much later when I have cavalry (my initial conquest are with Legions  and then I usually dont need MPP or ROP agreements). So that'll be a no on any embassies, at this point.
Kman
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July 18, 2002, 22:59
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#5
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Prince
Local Time: 23:35
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Commonwealth of Commonsense
Posts: 608
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I like Aggie's idea about getting a glimpse inside Washington right before we declare war 
Otherwise, embassies seem like a luxury we can't really afford. Down the road, we might want to set up an embassy and close relations with Germany, and possible England or Persia, for possible alliances against the Aztecs. (I'm starting to get nightmares about swarms of jaguar warriors!)
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Wielder of Weapons of Mass Distraction
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July 18, 2002, 23:03
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#6
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Prince
Local Time: 23:35
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Mar 1999
Location: NJ
Posts: 426
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No point in opening up embassies just yet. When we have some strategic need for it, then we can, but every gold coin is very valuable, especially since there is little room for error given our poor position.
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July 18, 2002, 23:06
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#7
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Prince
Local Time: 23:35
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Commonwealth of Commonsense
Posts: 608
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Time for a noob question: does opening embassies make it easier to detect when AI civs go to war against each other? How do you tell? Cause it's looking like we're going to have to be very opportunistic to survive.
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Wielder of Weapons of Mass Distraction
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July 18, 2002, 23:07
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#8
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Prince
Local Time: 23:35
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: May 2001
Location: of Bananas
Posts: 998
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I believe embassies keep relations from slipping. Will will eventually need embassies, the problem is we can't tell who with. What is certain: They will be going up in prices, a LOT.
Out of everyone to get an embassy with, I think we should get one with the Aztecs. They are going to be huge, and we can't stop that. We can save cash now, however.
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July 19, 2002, 00:43
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#9
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Emperor
Local Time: 23:35
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: May 2001
Location: flying too low to the ground
Posts: 4,625
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Yes. currently we have no idea whos at war with who, but we saw persian archers mucking around in german territory.
embassies would tell us whos at war with who, but i perosally never use them unless were in a wonder race (check turns left).
and we're not builfing the pyramids (Germany, England, Peria) or the Oracle (Babylon), so i see no reason to establish them. i vote no.
__________________
"I've lived too long with pain. I won't know who I am without it. We have to leave this place, I am almost happy here."
- Ender, from Ender's Game by Orson Scott Card
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July 19, 2002, 02:21
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#10
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Local Time: 06:35
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: jihadding against Danish Feta
Posts: 6,182
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Problem is : it's highly possible the Americans already have embassies, and use them to make alliances against us. Without embassies, it's impossible to us to make counter-alliances.
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"I have never cut off my penis when I was upset over a girl." -- Dis
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July 19, 2002, 03:11
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#11
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Civ4: Colonization Content Editor
Local Time: 05:35
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Dec 2001
Posts: 11,117
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Quote:
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Originally posted by Robber Baron
Time for a noob question: does opening embassies make it easier to detect when AI civs go to war against each other? How do you tell? Cause it's looking like we're going to have to be very opportunistic to survive.
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The answer is yes. When you have an embassy, you can determine the state of peace and war of a civ in the Foreign minister screen (F4), by activating the particular civ. A blue connection line to another civ means peace, a red one war and none means no contact yet. Also, you see existing alliances and get notified about new ones by a popup window. Embassies are a good source of information and make a civs mood toward you better.
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July 19, 2002, 04:50
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#12
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King
Local Time: 06:35
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Bergen, Norway
Posts: 1,005
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Group 1 - Yes, in any order, the foreign minister has the power to decide this.
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"Politics is to say you are going to do one thing while you're actually planning to do someting else - and then you do neither."
-- Saddam Hussein
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July 19, 2002, 05:07
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#13
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Emperor
Local Time: 05:35
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: EMPEROR of Cats
Posts: 3,229
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If what Ralph says is true, then make SOME embassies with key (powerful) Civs. To see the relation between two civs, we only need an embassy in one of them...! Choosing the most powerful ones will positively affect their relationship towards us.
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July 19, 2002, 05:22
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#14
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Warlord
Local Time: 04:35
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Iceland
Posts: 158
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Opening embassies witht the most powerful civs, such as the Astecs. It would also be very beneficial to be able to see what the Americans have stationed inside Washington. So maybe building an embassy in America right before we invade would be a good idea.
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July 19, 2002, 06:18
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#15
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Warlord
Local Time: 06:35
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Heidelberg, Germany
Posts: 114
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i think we should open embassies with the persians and either the greeks or the germans, so we'll have two embassies
i think with two embassies we will still have enough gold
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"Cogito Ergo Sum" - Rene Descartes, French Mathematician
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July 19, 2002, 08:45
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#16
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Emperor
Local Time: 22:35
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: May 2001
Location: of the Martian Empire
Posts: 4,969
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i doubt america has embassies. In my experience the ai doesnt build them until the early middle ages.
__________________
Ham grass chocolate.
"This should be the question they ask you before you get to vote. If you answer 'no', then they brand you with a giant red 'I' on your forehead and you are forever barred from taking part in the electoral process again."--KrazyHorse
"I'm so very glad KH is Canadian."--Donegeal
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July 19, 2002, 17:56
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#17
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Warlord
Local Time: 04:35
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: UK
Posts: 243
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We only need to build embassies if we are going to use them, so how will we use then right now, are they any use?
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July 19, 2002, 18:05
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#18
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Emperor
Local Time: 22:35
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: May 2001
Location: of the Martian Empire
Posts: 4,969
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They last forever, so we might as well get at least a few. They'll probably be more expensive in the future.
__________________
Ham grass chocolate.
"This should be the question they ask you before you get to vote. If you answer 'no', then they brand you with a giant red 'I' on your forehead and you are forever barred from taking part in the electoral process again."--KrazyHorse
"I'm so very glad KH is Canadian."--Donegeal
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July 19, 2002, 18:26
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#19
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Prince
Local Time: 23:35
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Commonwealth of Commonsense
Posts: 608
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Another argument for opening embassies now would be that we don't have any pressing need for our current hoard of gold: no techs we need to prosecute the coming war; no resources to buy; no massive upgrade projects on the near horizon....
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Wielder of Weapons of Mass Distraction
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July 19, 2002, 19:31
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#20
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Emperor
Local Time: 23:35
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: May 2001
Location: flying too low to the ground
Posts: 4,625
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Quote:
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Originally posted by civman2000
They last forever, so we might as well get at least a few. They'll probably be more expensive in the future.
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probably not. they get cheaper over time (IIRC), and the AI will build them on their own if you wait long enough.
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"I've lived too long with pain. I won't know who I am without it. We have to leave this place, I am almost happy here."
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July 19, 2002, 19:47
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#21
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Prince
Local Time: 23:35
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: May 2001
Location: of Bananas
Posts: 998
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uber/// "they get cheaper over time"??!?!
They get MORE expensive with every growth in population, and possibly culture, that the rival civilization has, and it never goes back down.
Right now every one of them cost less than 100$ Later on, all of them will be over $200
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July 19, 2002, 19:56
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#22
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Emperor
Local Time: 23:35
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: May 2001
Location: flying too low to the ground
Posts: 4,625
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i never get them. the AI always gets them for me.
i figured as our empires connected (roads/harbors) they'd get cheaper.
guess im wrong :P
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"I've lived too long with pain. I won't know who I am without it. We have to leave this place, I am almost happy here."
- Ender, from Ender's Game by Orson Scott Card
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July 20, 2002, 12:56
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#23
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Civ4: Colonization Content Editor
Local Time: 05:35
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Dec 2001
Posts: 11,117
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bump
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July 20, 2002, 14:00
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#24
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Deity
Local Time: 00:35
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Feb 2001
Posts: 21,822
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I thought that you could see relations between nations regardless of whether or not you had an embassy.
__________________
[Obama] is either a troll or has no ****ing clue how government works - GePap
Later amendments to the Constitution don't supersede earlier amendments - GePap
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July 20, 2002, 15:03
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#25
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Civ4: Colonization Content Editor
Local Time: 05:35
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Dec 2001
Posts: 11,117
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No. Only their relations to you, but not between AIs.
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July 20, 2002, 16:22
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#26
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Deity
Local Time: 00:35
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Feb 2001
Posts: 21,822
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Oh. I always build embassies as soon as possible, so I didn't realize that.
__________________
[Obama] is either a troll or has no ****ing clue how government works - GePap
Later amendments to the Constitution don't supersede earlier amendments - GePap
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July 20, 2002, 22:27
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#27
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Prince
Local Time: 22:35
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: UT, Austin - The live music capital of the world
Posts: 884
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Quote:
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Originally posted by civman2000
They last forever, so we might as well get at least a few. They'll probably be more expensive in the future.
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They may be more expensive in the future, but I bet will be a hell of alot richer in the future too, so if that is the only justification for getting them, then I think we shant. As for getting them to see the defences of the capitol city, in my experience I am always so well prepared for war that regardless of what my enemies have defending their walls, those suckers are going down... too many times in the past i bit off more than i could chew, never will I make that same mistake again. In other words, I assure everyone, if we have enough units at the beginning of the invasion, then we won't need to spend our money on embassies. Once we get republic, it can go towards rushing units and structures - another perk of the Republic.
Kman
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July 21, 2002, 00:02
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#28
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Warlord
Local Time: 04:35
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: formerly known as Prince
Posts: 252
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Hmmm...yes build them with a few AI, not America though. As tempting as it would be to build one in Washington before the war to see what they have, is it really neccessary? We'll be declaring war anyways no matter what so I don't see the point of opening an embassy with America.
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July 21, 2002, 03:22
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#29
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King
Local Time: 22:35
Local Date: October 31, 2010
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Wichita,KS,USA
Posts: 1,044
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Quote:
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Originally posted by Spiffor
Problem is : it's highly possible the Americans already have embassies, and use them to make alliances against us. Without embassies, it's impossible to us to make counter-alliances.
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I agree 100%. We need to be prepared to have alliances or counter-alliances when we attack.
Also, learning if other civs are at war would be beneficial to our cause, depending on what civs are fighting. It could make our task easier or harder.
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July 21, 2002, 09:27
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#30
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Emperor
Local Time: 01:35
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Botanic Garden, Rio
Posts: 5,124
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Group 1: yes, in any order, etc. At least two embassies, we are going to war! And a dangerous and risky one, In the War Academy forums we can see how desperate our position are.
See http://apolyton.net/forums/showthrea...threadid=56234
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