Whats the difference between EMPEROR and DEITY

Gwylim · October 10, 2002, 15:34

i was playing on King and now i am finnishing a game on Emperor and my next game will be of course Deity, but reading the manual i dont see a big difference between. The difference between King and Emeror was huge in my eyes (much more difficult to build GW) and changed my game quiet a lot but now around 1600 its the old story again (three tech advance, last war will begin soon) and i am wondering now about how is the difference to Deity. As far as i know the nr of unhappy people dont change, so what will change really??? What do i have to be prepared of???

Gwylim

FNBrown · October 10, 2002, 15:38

Have a look at the difficulty settings within the editor - it should give you a good idea what advantages the AI gets at each level.

Dis · October 10, 2002, 16:04

about 7000 posts

vmxa1 · October 10, 2002, 16:54

That is funny dissident.
I do not recall the numbers, so the advice to look at the editor is sound. I think they get 12 warriors, 2 settlers and some other junk to start off. They have product/research boost as well. In any event you will feel and see the difference very soon.

Ethelred · October 10, 2002, 17:47

Its a much bigger jump than Monarch to Emperor is.

Code:

Monarch 90% cost for the AI
Emperor 80% cost for the AI
Deity   60% cost for the AI

Plus lots more free units both at the beginning and for the whole game. You no longer get any bonus against Barbarians so you might want to set them pretty low at least for your first game on Deity.

asleepathewheel · October 10, 2002, 17:51

Quote:

Originally posted by Gwylim
What do i have to be prepared of???

be prepared to have your tail handed to you

be careful, very careful at the beginnign. those free ai units can be rough to go up against. be careful not to step on any toes too early. at least not toes too much larger than yours. Try to ride out the storm, taking what you can, until industrial or modern age.

vmxa1 · October 10, 2002, 20:22

I have not tried this tactic with 129f (too isolated), but I have prior to it attacked the next civ as soon as I see them. It is risky, but they will often have the warriors all spread out.

ThaddeusAlexander · October 10, 2002, 20:30

First Diety game I ever played was a little while ago now. I had my @$$ handed to me. It was about 1800 and I had a wonderful 4 cities on the map whilst the AI each had a nice set up of 20 or so. So what did I do? I stopped research, gave gold and maps each turn to the AI civs and built the UN. They all voted for me and I ran off with a nice win that time

I went to war only once the entire game and lost most of my civilization but the civ that declared war on me was knocked out by the Romans in the 1300s ... I was the lap dog for the entire game. Oh well, a win is a win is a win. Next I'm going to aim for a Diety cultural victory ... pray for me my friends, pray for me

Cheers
~Thadalex

Dalai Lama · October 11, 2002, 04:43

Cultural win on Deity??? Good luck! Almost impossible i think. Maybe, very maybe with the babs. I have tried it 2 times. You just can`t keep up the AI building GW`s, even with Great Leaders. And that`s what you`ll need for a cultural win: not only improvements bu also GW`s.

Other victory types are pretty doable. I have won 4 times on Deity with space race and 1 time on diplomacy. Never tried warmongering on Deity... well maybe a litlle bit... but not to conquer the entire world.

Solomyr · October 11, 2002, 05:43

Thadalex,

perhaps i shouldn't be one to talk (i have yet to try a game on deity, but that point draws nigh) but personally, i hate the diplomatic victory. it's too easy/anticlimatic. i mean, assuming you actually build it, then, like you said, bribe civs to win...not much fun IMO.

anyways, my prayers are with you on the culture victory Thadalex. the babs seem like the obvious chose, but consider the Persians. sci/ind you can pump out those libaries, and improve the infastructure quick. furthmore, the immortal is a damn fine UU. 4/2/1, he cuts through spearmen. which means more territory, and therefore, more potential to build culture. and since he is early, and iron is one tech away, you get them early...key to the cultural win. of course, they are expensive. good luck

vmxa1 · October 11, 2002, 12:29

Culture win wil be tough, I would think you will have to raze a few cities to reduce the top AI's culture or capture a wonder or two. It is very depressing when the advisor keeps telling you someone finish this or that wonder. Good luck.

Gwylim · October 11, 2002, 12:34

first thanks for all advice. i really thought the difference to be not so big, but i like it because on emperor i think it is still not too much difficult to win.
I personnaly like to play on big maps with all civs, always trying to get an equlibrium of warmongering and building. I dont like to win by culture, diplomacy or SpaceShip, but i also dont like to make war from the beginning to the end.
In my current game i liked very much to get the other civs making war on my enemies. yesterday America declared war on me because i didnt wanted to give Atomic Theory to them. One turn after the remaing 6 Civs declared war on America

the previous war lasted 10 turns, now i am curious how fast this war will be.
I think some GW are overproportional powerfull and i suspect that not being able to build some GWs will be the biggest handicap. What do you think about?
I especially think about SunTsun, J.S.Bach, AdamSmith and Hoover
About the productive bonus i am not really worried because the AI normally dont knows how to use this bonus.
What until now i never had to use was the mobilization, but as it comes late in the game i am not sure if even on deity i will use this.
Also other question: How is the happyness affected when i draft defenders in a city?

greetings, gwylim

ThaddeusAlexander · October 11, 2002, 12:58

Don't worry solomyr , I know the Diplo victory is cheap... I'm just saying it saved my arse that first game in diety, thats all. I tend to turn it off now anyway. The first game of Civ3 I ever played I was about to win by the babs ... just needed to finish one more SS component and the next thing i hear, that the English won a diplomatic victory and i lost! I just had to get the AI back for that one

hehe

And I've started my diety cultural victory path last night, playing the babs ... it was hard giving up industrial 'cuz its my fav trait but I thought I could afford it this game because anything thats good but not directly involved with my win is just a bit of a waste.

I managed to get the best locations near my civ without the usual road network i build and all my cities now have a temple in them and they're fortified. I've given away the gold i looted from barbs in the area to appease my neighbours and the persians are my best friends (thank god!). The Chinese are annoyed at me but they're on the other side of the persians (!

!) and the english are cautious so far, but thats no problem yet. I have 6 cities and I just finished the run for literature so now all thats left to do is start building up an army and hope to get some GLs because in all the other diety games i've played, THEY ARE KEY! (which is why i wish GLs can be generated through peacekeeping means, but thats in another thread somewhere....)

so yeah, vmxa1, i hate that too .. so i want to be prepared. I hate war but sometimes you need the gamble to get a GL....

Oh well... I'm off to work but I'll get back to the game soon enough.. my civ's second age, the Age of War, is upon me!

Cheers
~Thadalex

Catt · October 11, 2002, 14:27

Quote:

Originally posted by Solomyr
. . . i hate the diplomatic victory. it's too easy/anticlimatic. i mean, assuming you actually build it, then, like you said, bribe civs to win...not much fun IMO . . .

I'm not a huge fan of diplo wins, and I'm not trying to slam you personally at all, but it does inspire a bit of a rant from me when I see people post that it is a lame victory because all you need to do is bribe AIs to secure the vote.

Perhaps the victory condition itself is not lame, but the cheap, explotative tactics to secure the victory are lame? I have found my diplo victories satisfying (not always as much so as other victory types), but I don't allow myself to (1) give bribes, (2) secure MPPs, declare war and wait to be attacked, (3) buy smaller civs into alliances, or any of the other variations on how to "snatch a diplomatic victory from the jaws of defeat."

The diplomatic victory presents quite a bit more challenge (and satisfaction) if you play your games from 4000 BC knowing that you (1) must maintain a great reputation and good relations, (2) must succeed in building the UN (and can therefore deny a vote), or (3) must get lucky when an AI civ builds it but never calls a vote. Deny yourself the obvious exploit -- the future UN building may hold more interest for you.

Catt

ThaddeusAlexander · October 11, 2002, 17:15

Quote:

Originally posted by Catt
The diplomatic victory presents quite a bit more challenge (and satisfaction) if you play your games from 4000 BC knowing that you (1) must maintain a great reputation and good relations, (2) must succeed in building the UN (and can therefore deny a vote), or (3) must get lucky when an AI civ builds it but never calls a vote. Deny yourself the obvious exploit -- the future UN building may hold more interest for you.

Catt

I have to agree with Catt in that it takes skill, but sometimes the AI will just pinch you out of a win with it. Its a good stand-by if you're a peacekeeper and someone is getting a bit closer to the spaceship than you are and you need to snatch their capitol which probably isn't that easy at this point in the game, and especially if they're close to the final countdown.

The problem is when the AI does it to us

It makes you feel like a real 'good guy' winning through diplomacy, in my opinion. I've played only one game where i alowed Diplomacy and ONLY diplomacy as the victory type and it was a lot more time consuming and thoughtful than other games... you need war to get rid of opponents and keep your friends nice and close, and you need the research to get up there and all around, you need a bit of everything but a lot more diplomacy (duh!).

Cheers
~Thadalex

Catt · October 11, 2002, 17:55

Quote:

Originally posted by ThaddeusAlexander

I have to agree with Catt in that it takes skill, but sometimes the AI will just pinch you out of a win with it. Its a good stand-by if you're a peacekeeper and someone is getting a bit closer to the spaceship than you are and you need to snatch their capitol which probably isn't that easy at this point in the game, and especially if they're close to the final countdown.

The problem is when the AI does it to us

It makes you feel like a real 'good guy' winning through diplomacy, in my opinion.

Don't get me wrong, I don't play the peacekeeper to preserve a UN win possibility -- I still will almost always go to war with several civs at different times. My concerns regarding an AI UN victory (by denying myself the UN exploits) tranlate into "honorable" warfare and frequent trading. I declare war without breaking trade deals, and without units in enemy territory; I tend to not raze cities; etc. War itself does not result in a reputation hit -- though it may lower AI attitudes towards you -- frequent and fair trading not only reinforces your good reputation, but also tends to encourage positive attitudes. If my reputation is dealt a blow (deliberately or inadvertantly), then I must be sure to build the UN myself.

I win UN victories with votes from civs I've warred against and from whom I have taken cities, workers, etc. -- it is just a matter of warring honorably and paying attention to attitudes and the drift of world opinion. It's not always easy, but then that's what makes it fun.

Catt