Debate : Governors

Pandemoniak · October 19, 2002, 17:46

[/B]Fellow citizens of the United Nations Peacekeepers, [/B]

I, Pandemoniak, Foreman of the CCCP and Judge, wish to open a debate about the idea of insituting local governors. Note that all bases or regions DO NOT HAVE TO elect a governor. Several ideas came to my mind, first what would be their duties ?

THE DUTY OF A GOVERNOR
A Governer of a specific base or region can be called by any Director give an helpful hand about this region or base. This can be :
- advicing,
- the director ask the governor to start polls depending of his/her directorate because the director's too busy,
- the director or the citizens can ask for informations
- start poll for renaming bases
- or the director can share his/her powers with the governor, but only depending to the governor specific area of influence(base or region).

HOW ARE GOVERNORS ELECTED ?
Governors nominate themselves or can be nominated by others citizens. The elected governor is the candidate with the most votes.
Governors areas of influence can be either :
- one single base
- several smaller bases gathered as a region
The "district" of the governor are defined by the Alpha Talent, who gives clearly the name(s) of the base(s) under a governor influence.

These are the basics ideas. Please feedback

Post Scriptum Note : This idea could really change the type of democracy we are living in. This way, the government could be dealt by local authorities, with the agreements of people and federal authorities, in order to balance a "regional" type of democracy game.

Pandemoniak
in Biography of the Pandemoniak's reform

GeneralTacticus · October 19, 2002, 18:31

I think it's a bit early for governors as yet, and we don't really have enough people anyway.

Lemmy · October 19, 2002, 18:32

I like the idea

Pandemoniak · October 19, 2002, 18:32

We dont need to have governors for each base, and its not a good reason for not startin gto think about it.

DeathByTheSword · October 19, 2002, 18:33

I fully agree with this Idea and you have my total support this idea is great they can only have power IF the directors want to

great idea

Lemmy · October 19, 2002, 18:33

Pandemoniak did say that it was a lot of work to organize the polls and such, governors could make that easier

edit: sheesj, one turnchat ends, and everyone starts posting here

GeneralTacticus · October 19, 2002, 19:09

That's pretty normal, Lemmy.

Maniac · October 19, 2002, 20:12

If I can become governor of Concordia, it's all fine by me.

First decision would be to help the homeless after the recent horrible earthquake.

Kassiopeia · October 19, 2002, 20:55

I definitely like it and could consider trying for a Governor's post at some stage.

Hm, so this would be a step towards a republic then?

GeneralTacticus · October 19, 2002, 22:01

How so?

Hercules · October 19, 2002, 22:55

What's our current base total ?
I said before I agree with the idea but only when we have at least 20 bases.

How many bases would be under a governor's control 10,10-15,? taking into account future expansion

Darkness' Edge · October 20, 2002, 01:02

We have (I think) nine cities at the moment. This isn't really enough for regional governors, but if we wait another session or two of play (taking into account the number of colony pods under construction), we should have twelve or thirteen cities.

This would allow three regions of four bases, which would be workable enough.

20 bases is too much...by the time we get that far, the game will be nearly over.

There's one other thing here. I've mentioned it before, but it's been largely ignored - and it's something we need to consider before implementing this. Simply, do we have the people for this? We don't have enough people to have Justices that don't also double as Directors, and as of now, there are still no candidates for Alpha Talent, DoIE, and DoPO for November. If we can't fill these key positions, how can we fill several more governor positions?

Mr. President · October 20, 2002, 02:05

I like this idea very much, as it will reduce micromanagement in the late game.

Quote:

How so?

The definition of a republic in the Civilization II manual is something like "a group of city-states in loose union that owe loyalty to a central government" (not exact phrasing by a long shot). That's not how I'd describe it, but what do you expect from a game whose idea of being the leader of a nation is moving three hundred units into an adjacent zone each turn?

GeneralTacticus · October 20, 2002, 06:24

Quote:

The definition of a republic in the Civilization II manual is something like "a group of city-states in loose union that owe loyalty to a central government" (not exact phrasing by a long shot). That's not how I'd describe it, but what do you expect from a game whose idea of being the leader of a nation is moving three hundred units into an adjacent zone each turn?

But we're already a republic; that is to say, our leader is elected and not hereditary.

Mr. President · October 20, 2002, 06:29

True, and in fact that would be more important to my definition of a republic.

DeathByTheSword · October 20, 2002, 06:45

about what DE said i think we can get enough people because everyone will want to have a say in something and it is not much work just making some buildingqueues and terraforming plans....that would be all IF the directors give that power to the governers

GeneralTacticus · October 20, 2002, 06:51

But then what we would do?

DeathByTheSword · October 20, 2002, 06:59

the director would be the boss of the governers in his path so he may give them some orders like no building of military or no building of condesors it would just redirect specific orders making to other people so that the director would be able to work on the general plans to make our faction (and not one base) better and stronger...

Maniac · October 20, 2002, 08:28

For example the D of TC could obligate every governor to build at least two colony pods in every base.

DeathByTheSword · October 20, 2002, 09:31

This is what i have for directors so far and think it should be......if i forgot something please tell me..........

Quote:

Governers
have the rights of:
*acting as a director for his region if a director isnt able to give any orders on his field of power
*advising any director on things that concern his region
*polling for guidelines for his region

have the duties of:
*that the directors give
*advising the rest of the faction about this region the best he can

May NOT:
give orders in a specific field if the director in charge of that field didnt gave premission.

Governers are assign by the people to take care of a certain area there power in each field of expertise is a big as the director in charge give them to the governers.

IF this goes Thru directors right have to be changed too into:

Quote:

Director of ***
has the right of:
*===
*===
*===
*giving a part of his powers to governers

has the duty of:
*===
*===
*===

Feedback please

Pande like this idea?

Hercules · October 20, 2002, 10:00

When I get my region, can I specialize in native life form growing.

AdamTG02 · October 20, 2002, 12:39

I think that Governors are a good idea for the long term, but that we don't yet have enough citizens to make them worthwhile.

DeathByTheSword · October 20, 2002, 12:42

i think we would have enough I already saw two people that want to be a governer that arent in the government right now and at the moment we have maybe 2 or 3 regions after next session we have definitly 3 regions so we would only need 3 people I think this is possible!

dmm1285 · October 20, 2002, 16:14

I would be interested in a governer postion if the postion is created

Schinkenjoe · October 20, 2002, 16:42

yay me too ! My own city.

Kassiopeia · October 20, 2002, 16:49

Quote:

Originally posted by GeneralTacticus
How so?

Argh. I forgot that most if not all democratic countries are republics. Blame Civ2 and the government form 'Democracy'...

It would've been better to say that our government will be more republic then it has been before, since we will have split regions with limited power, like someone already pointed out.

Schinkenjoe · October 20, 2002, 17:11

More seperation of powers through federalism !

Maniac · October 20, 2002, 17:53

Yeah, just give everyone who wants it his own base, not necessarily a region. That should increase involvement of our citizens in this game.

Pandemoniak · October 21, 2002, 05:20

About republic> This is part of the idea : the UN Peacekeeper faction COULD work as a federal republic, and not only we could have micromanagement dealt by local governors, but we could also focus our faction's growth on regions. All regions/bases will have very different things to focus on, so it would be good to separate them and let them work with less executive, federal government control.

About the number of citizens> Since we dont need every base/region to elect a governor, we dont need to have many citizens. But moreover, that'll be a nice advertisment to have more citizens playing this DG.

About how many base per governor>this is the work of the new AT, or of the current AT to work on the district, then saying how many cities are under control. For the moment, since we dont have many bases, I think it would be one base per citizen. But a new founded base can be added to another governor's influence, until it grows a little, etc...

About the amendment DBTS wrote> Thats it.

Darkness' Edge · October 21, 2002, 06:59

Quote:

Originally posted by Pandemoniak
About republic> This is part of the idea : the UN Peacekeeper faction COULD work as a federal republic, and not only we could have micromanagement dealt by local governors, but we could also focus our faction's growth on regions. All regions/bases will have very different things to focus on, so it would be good to separate them and let them work with less executive, federal government control.

This could work. I'd be interested to see how it would be written out...but I see promise.

Quote:

Originally posted by Pandemoniak About the number of citizens> Since we dont need every base/region to elect a governor, we dont need to have many citizens. But moreover, that'll be a nice advertisment to have more citizens playing this DG.

This I'm completely against. Governors either have a point and a use or they don't. If they don't, then there's no need to bother electing them in the first place - they can just be roleplay. If they serve a purpose (with terraforming, worker placements, etc), then they need to be elected, and they need to be filled, every term. If governors actually have any powers, then every region needs a governor.

Quote:

Originally posted by Pandemoniak

About how many base per governor>this is the work of the new AT, or of the current AT to work on the district, then saying how many cities are under control. For the moment, since we dont have many bases, I think it would be one base per citizen. But a new founded base can be added to another governor's influence, until it grows a little, etc...

I wish you'd stop pushing city governors - I think it's a moot point, because we simply don't have the people. It appears we can scrape together enough people for regional governors, but we just don't have the people for city governors. Even the C3DG, which is so much bigger than us, hasn't even tried that - I don't think we should either.