Thread Tools
Old December 13, 2002, 19:03   #1
Savant
Warlord
 
Local Time: 07:33
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Jul 1999
Location: The Mountain Empire
Posts: 185
AI never attacks other AIs?
Oh brother. Here I am playing this game again after so many months. I downloaded some spiffo maps and did nothing to the AI files or anything else.

Anyway, I am playing a remote civ and then when I happened to encounter the others and watch their behavior for some 1000 years or so, I notice they never go to war with each other!

Never. The only wars are those involving me. Sure, some gang-up in alliance against me or I start a war with one or the other, but they never attack each other. Not one of the 15 other vivs has waged war with any other than mine!

It's 1800 AD now and I wonder if this is the usual? How do you get the AI to actually not be so pally with other AIs?
__________________
'Blood will run'
Savant is offline  
Old December 13, 2002, 19:09   #2
Jaybe
Mac
Emperor
 
Jaybe's Avatar
 
Local Time: 05:33
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Henderson, NV USA
Posts: 4,168
Some games are like that, real peaceful like. Some games an AI will become a "killer".

You can influence things if you wish by going to war with someone. It tends to increase military production and change balances of power.
__________________
JB
I play BtS (3.19) -- Noble or Prince, Rome, marathon speed, huge hemispheres (2 of them), aggressive AI, no tech brokering. I enjoy the Hephmod Beyond mod. For all non-civ computer uses, including internet, I use a Mac.
Jaybe is offline  
Old December 13, 2002, 19:18   #3
Jawa Jocky
Prince
 
Jawa Jocky's Avatar
 
Local Time: 04:33
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Seattle
Posts: 555
It just happens sometimes. Sign MMPs and then start some wars. You can also cut off trade routes and do some diplomacy missions.
Jawa Jocky is offline  
Old December 13, 2002, 19:42   #4
Savant
Warlord
 
Local Time: 07:33
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Jul 1999
Location: The Mountain Empire
Posts: 185
Will these get the
AI to attack other AIs or just me? I guess despite all the flaws in Call to Power, at least the AI would wage wars with nonplayer civs.

Is your experience the same? Do you actually have the AI civs fight each other?

And thanks for the replies.
__________________
'Blood will run'
Savant is offline  
Old December 13, 2002, 20:37   #5
tinyp3nis
Prince
 
tinyp3nis's Avatar
 
Local Time: 15:33
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: May 2002
Location: compensate this!!
Posts: 310
In my games the AI beats up each other all the time. Sometimes it's very peaceful and nobody attacks, not even me....
tinyp3nis is offline  
Old December 13, 2002, 21:16   #6
WarpStorm
King
 
WarpStorm's Avatar
 
Local Time: 07:33
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Right down the road
Posts: 2,321
My games are mixed. Some games there are very few wars, others everyone is backstabbing each other and in a constant state of warfare. It has to do with which civs (some are more aggressive than others), geography, resources (or more properly lack thereof), lebensraum (players with it are less likely to war), and just plain luck. Of course, you can set things up if you like war.
__________________
Seemingly Benign
Download Watercolor Terrain - New Conquests Watercolor Terrain
WarpStorm is offline  
Old December 13, 2002, 21:48   #7
Brizey
Civilization III PBEM
Prince
 
Brizey's Avatar
 
Local Time: 07:33
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: The Republic of Texas
Posts: 305
"The (insert civ here) have been destroyed by the Rampaging (insert another civ here)!"
__________________
Got my new computer!!!!
Brizey is offline  
Old December 13, 2002, 23:08   #8
vmxa1
PtWDG Gathering StormC4DG Gathering Storm
Deity
 
vmxa1's Avatar
 
Local Time: 08:33
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Oviedo, Fl
Posts: 14,103
One would wonder how many games were played to use the word never. I see many AI battles and have since the game came out. I have had many games where the AI sent troops through my lands to attack another AI. Just FYI, the AI doesn not know AI from human. Anyway as Brizey posted that msg can be seen in every game or nearly so, with normal numbers of civs in the game. Civs are sometimes killed that I never made contact with in a huge game.
vmxa1 is offline  
Old December 13, 2002, 23:17   #9
Cyclotron
Never Ending StoriesThe Courts of Candle'Bre
King
 
Cyclotron's Avatar
 
Local Time: 07:33
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Cyclo-who?
Posts: 2,995
My games are always, always plagued by massive AI wars, especially of the kind where the dominant AI decides to annex the most primitive AI.
__________________
Lime roots and treachery!
"Eventually you're left with a bunch of unmemorable posters like Cyclotron, pretending that they actually know anything about who they're debating pointless crap with." - Drake Tungsten
Cyclotron is offline  
Old December 14, 2002, 00:52   #10
chairmanmeow
Civilization III Democracy Game
Chieftain
 
chairmanmeow's Avatar
 
Local Time: 08:33
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Redneckland, People's Republic of Maryland
Posts: 57
I've had only one time that I can think of that an AI attacked another AI. I (Persia) was in an MPP with both France and Russia, and Russia attacked France, forcing me to declare war on Russia. Of course, Russia got the sh*t beat out of them, but my ally France didn't last that long either
chairmanmeow is offline  
Old December 14, 2002, 02:14   #11
Kingof the Apes
Civilization III Democracy Game
Prince
 
Kingof the Apes's Avatar
 
Local Time: 04:33
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Call me KOTA
Posts: 365
I have had games where everyone is happy and peaceful into the industerial ages before I started a massive world war out of boredom, and then I have had games where declaring peace was just a way to build up your forces for a couple of turns befor backstabbing when the time is right. Two games stick out in particular, one where I was in a massive world war from about 1800 to 2047,(spaceship) and one where I had an island start and four civs were wiped out before I made contact with anyone.
__________________
I'm going to rub some stakes on my face and pour beer on my chest while I listen Guns'nRoses welcome to the jungle and watch porno. Lesbian porno.
Supercitzen Pekka
Kingof the Apes is offline  
Old December 14, 2002, 02:57   #12
Pyrodrew
Prince
 
Pyrodrew's Avatar
 
Local Time: 04:33
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Dec 2000
Posts: 679
Quote:
How do you get the AI to actually not be so pally with other AIs?
MPPs are 1 way, but that very often mean you'll be in a war(s) too.

The more peaceful way - Embargos. The AI constantly trades with one another, which I suspect helps their relations with each other. Even IF trading does not improve relations between the Civs, a Civ not being able to trade wines for techs hurts them. Embargoes prevent any trades of resources & seems to create tension. Even tho you set up the embargo, the AI Civ being embargoed may attack some other Civ who embargoed them. I've even have those I ask to embargo a Civ declare war against the embargoed Civ a few turns later! In my last game, superpower Egypt declared war on superpower Aztecs... even tho both were on opposite sides of the map. Both spent a lot of time creating/sending units, but no major territory changed hands. More importantly, both left me alone - despite me having no Saltpeter (only Pikemen).

Get several Civs to embargo a superpower to decrease your odds of being involved in the future war. Keep in mind the AI is horrible at conducting long distance wars.

Get several Civs to embargo an AI that you plan to attack next turn.

Just be sure not to include weak AI Civs in the embargo who are neighbors to a stronger AI Civ you have the embargo on. Otherwise, you could simply be helping them grow.
Pyrodrew is offline  
Old December 14, 2002, 11:41   #13
bobbo008
Prince
 
bobbo008's Avatar
 
Local Time: 06:33
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: The Wisconsonian Empire
Posts: 635
On my latest game, I'm playing as Japan, huge map, 16 civs and I'm #1, having already conquered three of the smaller civs.

I declared war on the Aztecs. The Babylonians soon declared war on me. I got the Persians involved with a MPP. I was able then to get a peace treaty with the aztecs basically because a MPP signed with them. Stupidly, I have MPP's with two countries at war. So the next turn I was forced to declare war on Persia, my ally. I ended up non-stop wars with Russia, England, Persia, two with Babylon and two with Aztecs. It lasted several hundred years (1400ish-1760) and the year is now 1850 and half the civs are still fighting between themselves.

Prior to this, there had never been a war in the game.
bobbo008 is offline  
Old December 14, 2002, 13:41   #14
Berduin
Civilization III Multiplayer
Settler
 
Berduin's Avatar
 
Local Time: 12:33
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Illinois
Posts: 16
I find that, at least for me, playing on lower difficulty levels reduces the chance of the AIs attacking each other (and you). That's why I usually stay above Prince (or Regent... why did they change it?). Still, there are some games when no one attacks anyone, so I have to be the catalyst, sign some MPPs, and get a world war going. That seems to be the AI war "trigger". After that point, even if I'm at peace with everyone else, the AI will declare war on other AI to settle old scores or something.
Berduin is offline  
Old December 14, 2002, 23:45   #15
wilbill
Warlord
 
wilbill's Avatar
 
Local Time: 08:33
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Not Mayberry, NC
Posts: 140
I've been in a diplomatic mode lately. Won my last two games via the UN. In the first, a large map, many civs, there was very little warfare prior to the Industrial Era and some isolated local wars after that. In the second, I tried to get a world war going int he middle ages with MPP's and couldn't.

I've also played games in which I was fighting one or more civs almost from the first turn to the last.

I consider this unpredictable behavior by the AI's a good thing. It keeps my play from becoming one dimensional.
__________________
"Illegitimi non carborundum"
wilbill is offline  
Old December 15, 2002, 00:31   #16
Flip McWho
Warlord
 
Local Time: 00:33
Local Date: November 2, 2010
Join Date: May 2002
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 266
I'm playing a game where Babylon, India, America, China and a few others (all AI) all ganged up on the poor Japanese (AI) while i sat back and watched. Also the Japanese lost all their territory and are now memories of some forgotten time.
In fact in this game quite a few AI have had wars with other AI, but then so have I.
Flip McWho is offline  
Old December 15, 2002, 03:29   #17
Willem
Emperor
 
Willem's Avatar
 
Local Time: 05:33
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Canada
Posts: 5,755
Re: Will these get the
Quote:
Originally posted by Savant


Is your experience the same? Do you actually have the AI civs fight each other?
All the time. A short while ago, the entire Aztec nation was destroyed by the Japanese in one of games. In my current one, the Vikings were destroyed and I never even got to meeet them. You just ended up with a peaceful sort of game, it happens. Though not very often.
Willem is offline  
Old December 15, 2002, 10:17   #18
VJ
King
 
VJ's Avatar
 
Local Time: 12:33
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Helsinki
Posts: 2,247
I've noticed that in Regent livel (Patch 1.29f, Original Civ3),
all AI players ally, then take out few weak other AI's (all other AI's allied),
share all their techs, etc. etc. This kinda like ruins the game, everybody is against you.
VJ is offline  
Old December 15, 2002, 10:22   #19
WarpStorm
King
 
WarpStorm's Avatar
 
Local Time: 07:33
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Right down the road
Posts: 2,321
I don't know about that Tuomerehu, I find that what happens in most of my games is that I am in the alliance (often in the drivers seat) that wipes out the other players.
__________________
Seemingly Benign
Download Watercolor Terrain - New Conquests Watercolor Terrain
WarpStorm is offline  
Old December 15, 2002, 16:20   #20
vmxa1
PtWDG Gathering StormC4DG Gathering Storm
Deity
 
vmxa1's Avatar
 
Local Time: 08:33
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Oviedo, Fl
Posts: 14,103
I have not played a regent game in some time, but the AI is not capable of beating anyone at that level with or with out MPP/ROP's all around, if you have read the htreads on playing.
vmxa1 is offline  
Old December 15, 2002, 17:48   #21
mrmitchell
Civilization III Democracy GamePtWDG RoleplayCall to Power Democracy GameInterSite Democracy Game: Apolyton TeamNationStatesPtWDG2 Tabemono
King
 
mrmitchell's Avatar
 
Local Time: 06:33
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 2,394
eh.

Some of my games, the AI is the most peaceful little civilizations out there...

...until I come along.

Other games, they declare war virtually every other turn.

Declaring war does seem to increase their chances to declare war again later.
__________________
meet the new boss, same as the old boss
mrmitchell is offline  
Old December 16, 2002, 04:16   #22
theNiceOne
Warlord
 
theNiceOne's Avatar
 
Local Time: 13:33
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 121
As most posters have shown, the AI often wage wars. My last finished game is typical for me:
Emperor, standard size, max civs, everything else random:
I start on a continent with two other civs which start fighting each other before spearmen. This gives me the opportunity to catch up and attack with spearmen and finally wipe them out. When I later get contact with the biggest continent (4 civs) they are already at war (and have been for most of the game as I see from the playback). On that continent there are shifting wars most of the time, until I invade with tanks and later wipe them out.

Anyway, I think some of the misconceptions comes from the fact that we aren't told about AI wars unless having embassy in at least one of the capitals. It is easy to overlook a distant war that you arne't told about.
theNiceOne is offline  
Old December 16, 2002, 04:39   #23
VJ
King
 
VJ's Avatar
 
Local Time: 12:33
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Helsinki
Posts: 2,247
Quote:
I have not played a regent game in some time, but the AI is not capable of beating anyone at that level with or with out MPP/ROP's all around, if you have read the htreads on playing.
I will win the game playing on regent - with or without being allied to the most of AI -
I just stopped playing few months ago when I realized that the AI had no serious competition
with itself whatsoever. So haven't really tested levels above...
VJ is offline  
Old December 16, 2002, 14:50   #24
Savant
Warlord
 
Local Time: 07:33
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Jul 1999
Location: The Mountain Empire
Posts: 185
This is helpful information, thanks.

So to get more AI activity against other AIs the game should be played at a higher difficulty? I must admit, I usually play "warlord" status because I hate to just pad the AI with so many advantages. If playing at higher difficulty levels meant the AI was smarter, I would, but just to pad their starting stats and give them a free ride seems phoney.

Thanks for the embassy tip too. I have to figure that out. How do you get embassies?
__________________
'Blood will run'
Savant is offline  
Old December 16, 2002, 15:17   #25
Stuie
King
 
Stuie's Avatar
 
Local Time: 08:33
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Philly
Posts: 2,961
What size map are you playing on? The more space the AI has to expand, the less likely it is to come into conflict. Try putting 16 Civs on a 120x120 map. I think you'll see the wars heat up a little faster.

To establish embassies, you have to discover Writing, then double click on the little star next to your capital and you'll be given the opportunity to establish embassies.
__________________
"Stuie has the right idea" - Japher
"I trust Stuie and all involved." - SlowwHand
"Stuie is right...." - Guynemer
Stuie is offline  
Old December 16, 2002, 15:47   #26
GreyRandall
Settler
 
Local Time: 12:33
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Apr 2002
Posts: 4
I'll admit at first I thought that was the case as well, until one day I was playing one of my custom scenarios. I finally made it across the ocean to find the Chinese... with cities that had Chinese, Indian, and Japanese names. Didn't get any messages about them either, but then again, I had no contact with any of those civs either.

I'd say it works.. you might want to check the scenario you're playing if you're playing a user edited scenario. Some people tone down the aggressiveness of some civs, this drops the likelyhood of the AI controlled civs waging war against eachother... additionally, if it's a custom scenario and say perhaps the units frequently built vs never built get changed for a particular civ, that too will affect aggressiveness, war waging. Kind of hard to wage war when all you have are settlers, workers and scouts out there.
GreyRandall is offline  
Old December 16, 2002, 17:30   #27
Arrian
PtWDG Gathering StormInterSite Democracy Game: Apolyton TeamApolyton UniversityC4DG Gathering StormPtWDG2 Cake or Death?
Deity
 
Arrian's Avatar
 
Local Time: 08:33
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Kneel before Grog!
Posts: 17,978
The AI will pick on any civ it thinks it can bully, whether it's another AI civ or you.

I think there may be an agressiveness trigger involved to: if you start ripping up your continent, there seems to be a corresponding increase in warfare all over the world.

It also has a lot to do with room for expansion and exactly which civs are in the game (if you have a game with the Germans, Zulu, Mongols, Aztecs, Vikings, Romans and Japanese, there will be more warfare than a game with the French, Egyptians, Indians, Koreans, etc). If an AI civ, particularly an aggressive AI civ, gets hemmed in early on, they are quite likely to pick a fight with whomever is in their way.

I played a PTW game as the Celts not long ago in which I conquered my continent (taking down the Russians, Germans and English). During that time, the Persians, Zulu and Babylonians were involved in a bloody free-for-all that generated six great leaders (4 zulu, 1 persian, 1 bab). I know this because the replay now shows such things: very cool

In my current game as the Chinese, the AIs have not fought one another except for alliances I put together to destroy India and the Arabs (Japan has also been "dealt with" but w/o AI support). Surprisingly enough, the Mongols have peacefully become the #2 civ in the game both by power AND culture (having the Oracle, GW and HG in Karakorum helps with that). All 4 remaining AIs in the game are seperated from one another either by me (Ottomans, Mongols, Korea) or ocean (Carthage), so I don't expect much AI vs. AI fighting.

-Arrian
__________________
grog want tank...Grog Want Tank... GROG WANT TANK!

The trick isn't to break some eggs to make an omelette, it's convincing the eggs to break themselves in order to aspire to omelettehood.
Arrian is offline  
Old December 16, 2002, 17:57   #28
joncnunn
Civilization III Democracy GameC3C IDG: Apolyton TeamCivilization III PBEMApolyton UniversityC3CDG Team BabylonApolyton Storywriters' GuildCiv4 SP Democracy GameC4DG SarantiumC4BtSDG Templars
Emperor
 
joncnunn's Avatar
 
Local Time: 07:33
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Maryland Heights, MO
Posts: 6,188
I play on the Emperor level, the AIs declare war on each other all the time after one of them finishes REXing.

The AI seems to have the same basic behavior as mine, (if possible to expand peacefully, do so, but if hemed in expand miliatarly.) It's just that I'm better at this than the AI because I'm both more agressively peacefully expanding and more agressive militarly expanding than the AI.
__________________
1st C3DG Term 7 Science Advisor 1st C3DG Term 8 Domestic Minister
Templar Science Minister
AI: I sure wish Jon would hurry up and complete his turn, he's been at it for over 1,200,000 milliseconds now. :mad:
joncnunn is offline  
Old December 16, 2002, 18:17   #29
peterfharris
GalCiv Apolyton Empire
Prince
 
peterfharris's Avatar
 
Local Time: 12:33
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: May 1999
Location: Sydney, Australia
Posts: 350
Quote:
Originally posted by Savant
This is helpful information, thanks.

So to get more AI activity against other AIs the game should be played at a higher difficulty? I must admit, I usually play "warlord" status because I hate to just pad the AI with so many advantages. If playing at higher difficulty levels meant the AI was smarter, I would, but just to pad their starting stats and give them a free ride seems phoney.

Thanks for the embassy tip too. I have to figure that out. How do you get embassies?
The AI Civs also fight amongst themselves at Warlord and Chieftain. I suspect it takes them longer to start fighting because it takes them longer to occupy all the land. They also tend to hacve few units at those levels possibly effecting propensity to wage war? In my Warlord games the Ancient Era tends to be quite peaceful then the wars start in the laste middle ages. More often then not it is the AI civilisations fighting amongst themselves.

In my last Warlord game the other 4 civs spent virtually the entire game fighting amongst themselves. Interestingly it was 3 little civs (bad start locations on small islands) allied against a large civ (very good start on small continent). The 3 little civs were having a hard time of it even together so it seemed the AI had sufficient intelligence to make sensible strategic alliances so those little civs could survive against the big one. I launched my spaceship without ever being involved in war although I did give money and some tech to help the 3 little civs. (EDIT) BTW They were really sinking the boot into one another, a very vicious war. Not all AI wars are so aggressive. Sometimes AI versus human wars are not very aggressive, at lower difficulty levels I have had wars with little or no combat whatsoever, always unwanted wars started by an AI civ. I suspect there is more fighting at higher difficulty levels, most of my regent and monarch wars had plenty of fighting, my one deity war was absolutely full on.

Last edited by peterfharris; December 17, 2002 at 00:02.
peterfharris is offline  
Old December 17, 2002, 04:29   #30
theNiceOne
Warlord
 
theNiceOne's Avatar
 
Local Time: 13:33
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 121
Quote:
Originally posted by Savant
This is helpful information, thanks.

So to get more AI activity against other AIs the game should be played at a higher difficulty? I must admit, I usually play "warlord" status because I hate to just pad the AI with so many advantages. If playing at higher difficulty levels meant the AI was smarter, I would, but just to pad their starting stats and give them a free ride seems phoney.

Thanks for the embassy tip too. I have to figure that out. How do you get embassies?
You must play above regent before the AI get advantages, and even on Monarch, their advantages are quite scarce. A good player will easily be able to grow/research/produce faster than the AI on monarch.

As other has written, I don't think the AI is more aggressive on higher levels, but it gets more and better units faster, and will therefore also start fighting sooner.

You establish an embassy by clicking on the star symbol at your capital's name. Also note that embassies improves the AI's relation towards you, and are necessary for ROPs which improves the relation even more.
theNiceOne is offline  
 

Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 08:33.


Design by Vjacheslav Trushkin, color scheme by ColorizeIt!.
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.2
Copyright ©2000 - 2010, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Apolyton Civilization Site | Copyright © The Apolyton Team