December 20, 2002, 21:15
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#61
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Quote:
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Originally posted by Drake Tungsten
I think Hop on Pop would've contrasted better with The Brothers Karamazov, but it still works. Cest la vie.
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I don't believe that I've ever read Hop on Pop. Just goes to show how truly limited my literary horizons are...
However, I've just remembered that I read one of those books titled something like H is for Homicide or F is for Flatulence, I can't remember the specific book. So, that book (whatever it was called) takes 5th place on my list by default.
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December 20, 2002, 21:38
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#62
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Prince
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Quote:
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Originally posted by El Leon
I will look up Camille Paglia now, but curious about the comparison.
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I am sure she would have approved of your chastisement of the thread for omitting the classics.
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"In Italy for 30 years under the Borgias, they had warfare, terror, murder and bloodshed. But they produced Michelangelo, Leonardo da Vinci and the Renaissance. In Switzerland, they had brotherly love. They had 500 years of democracy and peace. And what did that produce? The cuckoo clock."
—Orson Welles as Harry Lime
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December 20, 2002, 22:21
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#63
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King
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Well, it's very difficult to choose which are the best items, because there are so many excellent ones to choose from. It's also dificult to be inclusive, because there so many great contributions to world literature from languages other than the big three, Spanish, English and Mandarin.
My ten for the moment:
Jonathan Swift: A Modest Proposal
Satire at its best- how to solve the problems of overpopulation in 18th Century Ireland? Easy- encourage them to eat their children....
Jorge Luis Borges: Ficciones/ Labyrinths
One of the great contributors to fantasy fiction, and a bridge between Britain and Argentina, with his love of Anglo-Saxon poetry. 'Funes the Memorious' is one short story I will never forget. His short tales cry out to be filmed- by Guillermo del Toro, preferably.
Sophocles: Antigone
I never get over the tension in this play- the dilemma, the conflict between familial, sacred obligations and duty to the state. In fact, why not all of his Theban trilogy considered as a unified work?
James Joyce: Ulysses
A book as big as the world, and as small a single day in a single city in one country on the westernmost edge of Europe. One of the most compassionate portrayals of fatherhood and Jewish identity ever created by a gentile, and a great celebration of life, and simple pleasures- like eating fried kidneys, and having afternoon sex.
E. Annie Proulx: The Shipping News
Tremendously funny, and melancholy, with beautiful character studies and inventive use of language, both English and Newfie speak. The film cannot lick its bootstraps.
Samuel Beckett: Malone Dies
Humour, pathos and isolation and death. And again, inventive wordplay and a love of the sound and richness of language for its own sake.
Cavafy: Collected Poetry
Spanning the centuries of diasporic Greek culture and history for inspiration, with wry looks at tragedy and heroism, love and lust, his poetry is of, and for, all time.
Geoffrey Chaucer: The Wife of Bath's Tale
One of the not so many writers who can create a character, and endow it with life so it reaches beyond the printed page. Bawdy and full of verve, she transcends stereotyping.
Thomas Nashe: The Unfortunate Traveller and other works
A writer who captures an intimation of mortality in his song in Summer's Last Will and Testament, 'Adieu, farewell earth's bliss'. He epitomizes the burgeoning Elizabethan literary scene.
Robert Henryson: The Testament of Cresseid
One of the greatest writers in English (Lallans Scots) between Chaucer and the Elizabethans. I love his use of imagery, and the way he shows compassion for Cresseid. His poems have a visual style that would be familiar to anyone who has seen John Boorman's Excalibur- I suspect there may be an unacknowledged debt...
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December 20, 2002, 22:22
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#64
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King
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Illiad by Homer
History of the Peloponnesian War by Thucydides.
Anabasis by Xenophon
Gallic Wars by Caesar
The Aneid by Virgil
Hamlet by Shakespeare
Gulliver's Travels by Jonathan Swift
David Copperfied by Charles Dickens
Declaration of Independence by Thomas Jefferson
War and in Peace by Tolstoy
The Lord of the Rings by J.R.R. Tolkien
For Whom the Bell Tolls by Ernest Hemingway
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December 20, 2002, 22:32
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#65
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King
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Quote:
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Originally posted by MosesPresley
Does anyone else here think Kafka was misunderstood? It seems most people find him depressing. I always thought his works were humorous.
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Well yeah they were but in a 'laugh to hide the tears' kind of way. He was a nut, which has been well documented, and a lot of his work is kind of autobiographical about his experiences growing up. Humourous yes, but with a very stark and depressing edge to them.
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A witty quote proves nothing. - Voltaire
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December 20, 2002, 23:13
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#66
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King
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Quote:
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Originally posted by Ned
History of the Peloponnesian War by Thucydides.
Gallic Wars by Caesar
Declaration of Independence by Thomas Jefferson
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Literature? Fiction, in part, but literature in the strictest sense...
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December 20, 2002, 23:13
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#67
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Emperor
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Sort of like Brazil, then.
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December 21, 2002, 00:35
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#68
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Prince
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deleted.
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Golfing since 67
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December 21, 2002, 02:19
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#69
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Deity
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Odyssey
Shakespear's Julius Caesar
Marriage of Figaro
Frankenstein
Uncle Tom's Cabin
All Quiet on the Western Front
Johnny Got His Gun
1984
To Kill a Mockingbird
Catch-22
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December 21, 2002, 02:34
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#70
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Settler
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I'm glad Marquez and Borges came up.
From GGM I'll take One Hundred Years of Solitude even though it's the obvious choice. Honestly I haven't cared for his other stuff. Many generals slowly dying of tuberculosis in stuffy, allegorical rooms. I get it, I get it.
From JLB I'll take the Ficciones collection and the Labyrinth collection provided I can leave behind his poetry, which is dreadful.
I haven't cited drama... sign me up for Stoppard's Rosencranz & Guildenstern are Dead. And if an operatic libretto is literature, sign me up for the (albeit partially, um, "borrowed") libretto of Verdi's Aida.
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December 21, 2002, 03:43
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#71
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Emperor
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Yes, Borges' Ficciones are a good choice in here (and his poetry is really almost unreadable)
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"Let me break this down for you, fresh from algebra II. A 95% chance to win 5 times means a (95*5) chance to win = 475% chance to win." Wiglaf, Court jester or hayseed, you judge.
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December 21, 2002, 03:48
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#72
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Emperor
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Oscar Wilde - Salomé
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"mono has crazy flow and can rhyme words that shouldn't, like Eminem"
Drake Tungsten
"get contacts, get a haircut, get better clothes, and lose some weight"
Albert Speer
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December 21, 2002, 07:06
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#73
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Emperor
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Quote:
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Originally posted by Zkribbler
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All Quiet on the Western Front
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Damn, how could I forget about that one?! There it is just between Hermann Hesse's books and Luke Rhineharts 'The Dice man'. Both on my list. I must have been temporarly blinded by something when i glanced through my shelfs before.
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In GAIS we trust!
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December 21, 2002, 07:09
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#74
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King
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Quote:
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Originally posted by El Leon
Literature? Fiction, in part, but literature in the strictest sense...
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Compositions may be written with a functional intent, but their language may be so inspiring as to change a culture, I would argue that all of these works are landmarks both functionally and as literature.
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December 21, 2002, 14:55
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#75
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King
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Quote:
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Originally posted by Kepler
I'm glad Marquez and Borges came up.
From GGM I'll take One Hundred Years of Solitude even though it's the obvious choice. Honestly I haven't cared for his other stuff. Many generals slowly dying of tuberculosis in stuffy, allegorical rooms. I get it, I get it.
From JLB I'll take the Ficciones collection and the Labyrinth collection provided I can leave behind his poetry, which is dreadful.
I haven't cited drama... sign me up for Stoppard's Rosencranz & Guildenstern are Dead. And if an operatic libretto is literature, sign me up for the (albeit partially, um, "borrowed") libretto of Verdi's Aida.
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Maybe it's just me, but the only book of GGM i would re-read is El Otoño del Patriarca, but I agree, it is difficult. Slowly dying generals... Never even begin reading El General en su Laberinto unless you are willing to drop it or are in for one of those "reader discipline" exercises.
In terms of Drama, I agree that the Theban Trilogy of Sophocles has not been surpassed, to my knowledge.
Though my favourite drama wirter is Brecht and once I even did a couple of bit parts in "Galileo".
And contemporary US english, I'd go for David Mamet, even if he is "trendy," for the sheer fact that he is not Newyorkian.
How about Fo? "Can't pay, won't pay!" is a treat.
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December 21, 2002, 14:56
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#76
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King
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Quote:
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Originally posted by Ned
Compositions may be written with a functional intent, but their language may be so inspiring as to change a culture, I would argue that all of these works are landmarks both functionally and as literature.
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True... But the Gettysburg address seems more weighty than the Declararion of Independence in terms of culture.
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December 21, 2002, 16:03
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#77
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King
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Good to see someone mentioned Cervantes "Don Quichote de la Mancha" . Hilarious and tragic at the same time. 
You have to read it to understand why it belongs in the great top10 of literary fiction.
P.S
Every American seems to put George Orwells "1984" somewhere on their list. Is it required (obligatory) on the school bookreading lists there?
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Skeptics should forego any thought of convincing the unconvinced that we hold the torch of truth illuminating the darkness. A more modest, realistic, and achievable goal is to encourage the idea that one may be mistaken. Doubt is humbling and constructive; it leads to rational thought in weighing alternatives and fully reexamining options, and it opens unlimited vistas.
Elie A. Shneour Skeptical Inquirer
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December 21, 2002, 16:18
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#78
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Deity
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Quote:
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Originally posted by CapTVK
Every American seems to put George Orwells "1984" somewhere on their list. Is it required (obligatory) on the school bookreading lists there?
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It was on a list for me from which I had to select some of the books to read.
I think 1984 is especially appealing to Americans because it explains how governments can use word games (e.g. the Ministry of Peace; "War is Peace") to play mind games with the citizenry...something our beloved government has been doing since at least World War II (e.g. the Department of Defense, "the light at the end of the tunnel," "the Patriot Act").
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December 21, 2002, 17:47
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#79
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Prince
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Quote:
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Originally posted by Ned
Illiad by Homer
History of the Peloponnesian War by Thucydides.
Anabasis by Xenophon
Gallic Wars by Caesar
The Aneid by Virgil
Hamlet by Shakespeare
Gulliver's Travels by Jonathan Swift
David Copperfied by Charles Dickens
Declaration of Independence by Thomas Jefferson
War and in Peace by Tolstoy
The Lord of the Rings by J.R.R. Tolkien
For Whom the Bell Tolls by Ernest Hemingway
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We do not agree about politics but I truly like your list of your favourite books!
I also agree with you that literature doesn't have to be fiction; both the Ancients and the Chinese considered History one of the most respectable genres.
My all-time favourite book is 'The Iliad'.
Merry Christmas!
S.Kroeze
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Jews have the Torah, Zionists have a State
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December 21, 2002, 18:38
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#80
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Chieftain
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In response to something someone above said, Salinger most definitely still is writing. He became a recluse after Franny and Zooey got such terrible critical reviews, though the book is making something of a comeback these days. By all indications, though, he is still writing and we may see a good deal of work by him posthumously.
As for my list...
1.) The Source by James Michener. My all time favorite book.
2.) Catch-22 by Joseph Heller.
3.) All Quiet on the Western Front by Erich Maria Remarque
4.) The Power and the Glory by Graham Greene. I'm surprised no one has mentioned him, yet. He wrote many powerful books.
5.) A Tale of Two Cities by Charles Dickens. I fail to see how anyone can call Dickens wholly depressing after reading this or A Christmas Carol.
6.) 1984 by George Orwell
7.) MacBeth by William Shakespeare, though all of the plays of his that I've read are exemplary. This one still tops the list for me.
8.) Lord of the Rings Trilogy by J.R.R. Tolkien. Naturally.
9.) Night/Dawn/Day by Elie Wiesel. If you get a chance to read all three, do. They are very good.
10.) Lord of the Flies by William Golding.
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December 21, 2002, 18:53
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#81
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Emperor
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Some of you people have a strange concept of what constitutes "fiction."
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Tutto nel mondo è burla
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December 21, 2002, 20:46
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#82
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King
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Quote:
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Originally posted by S. Kroeze
We do not agree about politics but I truly like your list of your favourite books!
I also agree with you that literature doesn't have to be fiction; both the Ancients and the Chinese considered History one of the most respectable genres.
My all-time favourite book is 'The Iliad'.
Well, S. Kroeze, maybe this is a start toward understanding each other.
Merry Christmas to you as well.
Ned
Merry Christmas!
S.Kroeze
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Well, S. Kroeze, maybe this is a start toward understanding each other.
Merry Christmas to you as well.
Ned
Merry Christmas!
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December 21, 2002, 21:13
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#83
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King
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Atlas Shrugged, and The Gulag Archipelligo
they should be added.
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December 22, 2002, 01:33
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#84
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King
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Hamlet- Shakespeare
Lord of the Rings- J.R.R. Tolkein
2001: a Space Odessey- Arthur C. Clarke
1984- George Orwell
War & Peace- Tolstoy
Julius Caesar- Shakespeare
The Odessey- Homer
The Illiad- Homer
Romeo & Juliet- Shakespeare
Contact- Carl Sagan
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December 23, 2002, 03:25
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#85
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Settler
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1) Thomas "Every Book's A Masterpiece" Bernhard - Gargoyles
2) Joseph Heller - Catch 22
3) Jon Dos Passos - U.S.A.
4) William Burroughs - The Western Lands
5) Philip K. D i c k - A Scanner Darkly
6) Elias Canetti - Auto Da Fe
7) Mikhail Bulgakov - The Master and Margerita
8) Ken Kesey - One Flew Over The Cuckoo's Nest
9) J.G. Ballard - Concrete Island
10) J.K Huymans - A Rebours (AKA Against The Grain AKA Against Nature)
Edit: Put spaces in Phil's last name
Last edited by stevechafin; December 23, 2002 at 03:33.
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December 23, 2002, 05:17
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#86
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King
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My Personal favorites are:
Shakespeare: Othello, MacBeth
Jack London: Call of the Wild, White Fang
Tom Clancy: Cardinal In The Kremlin, Red Storm Rising.
Homer- The Illiad
Charles Dickens: Great Expectations
Orwell- Animal Farm
Are we considering Political documents/ speeches also?
If so.....
The Cross Of Gold by William Jennings Bryan
The Declaration of Independence- Thomas Jefferson et al.
How the Other Half Lives (authors name escapes me at present)
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December 23, 2002, 06:05
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#87
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Settler
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Quote:
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Originally posted by El Leon
I'd go for David Mamet, even if he is "trendy," for the sheer fact that he is not Newyorkian.
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Maybe he isn't, but American Buffalo is about as New Yawk as you can get.
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It is much easier to be critical than to be correct. Benjamin Disraeli
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December 23, 2002, 09:04
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#88
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Prince
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Quote:
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Originally posted by Boris Godunov
Some of you people have a strange concept of what constitutes "fiction."
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Monkspider himself caused this confusion.
The titel of this thread is: Top ten works of literature ever?
In his post he asks:
"What are the top ten works of fiction ever written?"
I suppose you will agree with this snob that fiction and literature are two different concepts.
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December 23, 2002, 13:06
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#89
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King
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Quote:
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Originally posted by Kepler
Maybe he isn't, but American Buffalo is about as New Yawk as you can get.
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Nope. It's as Chicago as you can get.
Quote:
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I suppose you will agree with this snob that fiction and literature are two different concepts.
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 Fiction is rather ambiguous. It is currently in use for classifying anything that is not "academic" by booksellers. But is also is used to refer to novels, as opposed to other genres.
Literature, like I posted before, is not the same. It is the "letters" of a language, so I would have to say that literature would have to be written works that are representative of the language, because of their use of it, influence, etc.
Thereby I would say that Orwell is literature (look up 'Orwellian' and see his influence in other writers), whereas my favourite sci-fi novelists are more debatable (Phillip K. D i c K and Douglas Adams), though I would argue that the former is moreso.
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December 23, 2002, 13:31
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#90
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Warlord
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divine comedy by dante
heart of darkness by conrad
paradise lost by john milton
the orestia by aeschylus
1984 by Orwell
lord of the rings by tolkien
"Hamlet" by SHakespeare
Jane Eyre by Emily Bronte
The Scarlet Letter by Hawthorne
honorable mention: Cry, The Beloved Country by alan paton
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