Pharaoh Update...

Stefan Härtel · December 23, 2002, 10:41

Christmas is in the air, and with it the time of religious films on TV... well, German TV skipped it this year, it seems, but since I felt like watching one of those old Bible epics (which has nothing to say about my religiosity), I digged out "The Ten Commandments"... only to find out that the tape is in horrible condition, so I watched only about twenty minutes of that movie.
It was enough to make me feel like reading up on ancient Egypt a little once again, which again made me feel like playing an Egyptian scenario... after playing Kull's scenarios a couple of times, I remembered my own scenario, "Pharaoh", which I made several years ago. I took a good look at it and decided to update it a little, with new and better graphics, and perhaps a couple of gameplay changes as well.
So here's the point where you can throw in any suggestions. The scenario should be somewhere on Civfanatics.
My first idea concerns unit graphics. I attached here some things I've made, and numbered them through: 1 is the unit as it appeared in the original "Pharaoh" scenario, 2 and 3 are modifications. What do you think, should I do this for all units, or should I let it be entirely?

Prometeus · December 23, 2002, 12:59

Take a look at www.dbaol.com for more infos, Stef... You'll find it useful for sure.

BTW nice idea the army set...

I'm currently planning something close for Zhanguo.

Stefan Härtel · December 23, 2002, 13:18

Thanks for the link, but I already knew it since I was working on Fire and Roses

Prometeus · December 23, 2002, 13:36

Ehe ehe ehe... ooops...

When the game will be ready, Stef? Do you need some AoE graphics ( the old ones, i mean? ) ?

Civfan · December 23, 2002, 14:23

hey Prometeus, thanks for posting that site.
Its great

Stefan, those new units look really good. How or what program did you use to make them so small?

thanks

civfan

Stefan Härtel · December 23, 2002, 14:48

Quote:

When the game will be ready, Stef? Do you need some AoE graphics ( the old ones, i mean? ) ?

I dunno... it'll propably be ready sometime in January, provided I know what I'm gonna change. In any case, my other project on the South Seas has priority over that.
I don't need AoE graphics, but thanks for the offer

Quote:

Stefan, those new units look really good. How or what program did you use to make them so small?

Adobe Photoshop. Very simple, I just copied the unit via lasso, and then resized it a little.

El León · December 23, 2002, 17:18

I like the new units!

But, personally, I like scenarios that start slow, and there was so much going on in the first turn of Pharaoh that I had a hard time getting to know the scenario. I like it soo much when I only have a few unit choices in the beginning...

But then again, Red Front is the complete opposite and seems to be one of people's favourites.

Maybe the game can start earlier in history when the egyptians were not that large... I don't know if this is possible...

Stefan Härtel · December 23, 2002, 18:05

I thought about that too, and I'm still not quite sure... a sort of an empire-building scenario would comply more with the tech tree and all that, but the problem is the choice of civs. The civs I currently have are perfect for historical accuracy of exactly that time frame. If I started earlier, I'd have to find a way to introduce the Mitanni and Kassites later on.

I've heard comments from both sides, those who, like you (and me, BTW), prefer slow-starting scenarios, and those who like action-packed scenarios more. But I think the range of my scenarios is broad enough, so it should have something in it for everyone (for some other empire-building games, try "Sons Of Heracles" or "Fire And Roses", my next scenario, "The Lost Paradise" will also be in that style).

[Edit: Typo]

El León · December 23, 2002, 18:29

I loved SoH - BTW, what is the music you hear when you load it?
Would you need other civs if you did it earlier? Or did the Kassites and Mitanni arrive later? Otherwise, they could be kept in check until the appropriate time and then brought to life via events.

Stefan Härtel · December 23, 2002, 19:45

Glad you liked SoH

The music when it starts is from Wagner's Ring of the Nibelungs (my brother had that lying around, and I was in the need for some suitable music

); the other clips are from the soundtracks of the movies "Gladiator" and "Spartacus".

Well, if I started earlier with "Pharaoh", that'd be propably around 1800/1700 BC or so. That'd have the Kassites replaced by the Babylonians, and the Mitanni by some Proto-early imperial Assyrian civ which would be based much more to the north. It'd be a mess if I tried to introduce the Mitanni then (the Kassites wouldn't be much of a problem). I'm not saying it's impossible (perhaps if I excluded the Greeks entirely), but it would need some careful planning.

[Edit: Grammar

]

Dr. Nick · December 23, 2002, 20:40

I like the new units, but I don't think they had shovels.

St Leo · December 23, 2002, 20:42

They didn't have steel or iron shovels. Bronze or copper seem likely.

yaroslav · December 25, 2002, 20:36

Good idea, Stefan. Of course, If you need a betatester, you know that I'm ready

Stefan Härtel · December 26, 2002, 07:38

Shovels... hmm.. that's a question you never ask yourself

Same as with "how the hell did they make fire?"

Yaroslav: Great, thanks a lot! Be sure that I'll come back to your offer

Dr. Nick · December 26, 2002, 12:43

I think that they used adzes on wood as much as they did on the ground. I've never seen shovels on any Egyptian painting ever. Not as we know them today.

Kull · December 26, 2002, 13:33

Quote:

Originally posted by Stefan Härtel

Well, if I started earlier with "Pharaoh", that'd be propably around 1800/1700 BC or so. That'd have the Kassites replaced by the Babylonians, and the Mitanni by some Proto-early imperial Assyrian civ which would be based much more to the north. It'd be a mess if I tried to introduce the Mitanni then (the Kassites wouldn't be much of a problem). I'm not saying it's impossible (perhaps if I excluded the Greeks entirely), but it would need some careful planning.

If you need to create a new Mittani state right out of "thin air", check out Tecumseh's tip below. In "Red October" (http://www.tecumseh.150m.com/) he very cleverly was able to create a brand new Polish state in the middle of Central Europe at the end of WW1. This was done with ToT, but I'd be willing to bet you could perform similar magic with FW/MGE.

Quote:

The problem was to have the Polish state come into existance upon the defeat of the Central Powers in November 1918, 12 turns into the game. A Polish settler was placed in a remote ocean square, inaccessable to naval units. The Central Powers were given the Leonardo's wonder (renamed the Social Democratic Party). At the time of the armistice, they were given technologies which turned all their units into very weak 'deserter' units.

The same turn, strong Polish units were created by events adjacent to all the future Polish cities, along with a 'make aggression' event. Using ToT events language a mask was created to prevent negotiation between Poland and the Central Powers. This was changed one turn later by a 'Negotiator' event which then allowed a Polish-Central Powers treaty - after the Poles had captured all their target cities. The result is a new and powerful state is created where none existed the previous turn.