Random Events...they really suck

D4everman · June 21, 2000, 07:30

The Random Events are real pain in the ass. I usually disable them. (Ever since as Morgan in one of my first games I had amassed an obscene amount of cash...then I was attacked but i could afford to mind control and buy troops until the Random events shrunk my bank account to something stupid like 200 credits.)

My last game made me even more pissed at them. I made the attempt to build bio labs in every base, but I had other tihngs to build too...and planet Blight kept wiping the famrs out. Funny how the AI players never have that liability even when they have hardly ANY facilities! (I checked.)

So whats the general consensus on Random Events? I hate to be a crybaby, but they don't make the game any more fun for me...just frustrating.

D4

June 21, 2000, 09:08

i do hate them, i only find 2 of them to be useful

idustrial boom, espc in a SP produceing city

heat wave in a larger city

other then that they suck, even extra nuts can do some damage because your city grows to big then it can support

WhiteElephants · June 21, 2000, 15:16

I was under the impression that certain facilities countered certain random events. Such as a research hospital countering a virus outbreak (or maybe it was a bio-lab) and a energy bank containing an energy surge. To me it has been an incentive to build facilities I may have ignored for a while. Of course, I have yet to find the facility that counters the meteor shower or the asteroid impact.

JAMiAM · June 21, 2000, 17:04

The Umbrella Factory will protect against Meteor Impacts. Coming soon, in a patch near you.

But seriously...I can't believe that you guys would WHINE so much about one of the few ways the game remains unpredictable (at least in SP), this long after it's been out.

Besides, I think that the events predominantly hit the leader, and in the case of negative events, the AI needs all the help it can get.

waynehead · June 21, 2000, 18:00

I love those Network node breakthroughs, though.

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My sorry excuse for a website

June 21, 2000, 18:07

what break throughs? ive never seen them

Adam_Smith · June 21, 2000, 23:15

I prefer random events for two reasons. First, it adds more realism to the game. In the real world planning doesn't solve all your problems, because there are RANDOM EVENTS. The second reason is that it makes the game more fair for the builders, because you have to build more infrastructure. In general it makes the game a little more peacefull.

Now you ask me if I hate it when I get a hail storm or something; of course I do, but my opponents are also getting them so not too big of a big deal.

Velociryx · June 22, 2000, 01:21

I totally agree 'bout random events, Adam!

With the events turned on, it *forces* you to pay more attention to infrastructure or suffer the consequences, making the game more builderesque in its nature. And as to those consequences.....nothing stops a diehard momentum player in his tracks faster than having an outbreak of the Promethius Virus knock his size ten base to size three, or blight knocking out all the forests in a given base-radius......OUCH!

-=Vel=-

Basil · June 22, 2000, 02:53

I wouldn't dream of playing without "random" events. As A_S says, they add interest to the game. They definitely effect AI-controlled factions - I've seen it several times - but you don't notice this much because

[This message has been edited by Basil (edited June 22, 2000).]

LoD · June 22, 2000, 11:02

I agree with the majority here. Random events add flavor to the game.

LoD

Garth Vader · June 22, 2000, 13:02

I also think random events hurt builders more. The big hurt is the energy crash. Momentum players don't have as much cash so they have less to lose. I often turn off random events just because of the energy crash. I will save up energy if I am researching a new reactor or something like that. Then you get a crash and lose 2500 ec and can't upgrade anything. What's a momentum player going to lose, 100?

Joer's point about the army vs bases is valid too. A momentum player usually has more, less developed bases. If one craps out due to a random event it's no big deal.

D4everman · June 22, 2000, 16:30

I'm almost sorry I brought the whole thing up. Sigh....for the record let me clarify why i don't like the random events...but before i do that let me tell you that the majority of you are right...the RE's do add flavor to the game.

If the RE's only effect the SP than they are, well, bullshit. If i had recieved a message about another character having a random event, good or bad, it would have helped. Seriously. If even in my darkest moment fighting yang if a reandome event had given him 100+ energey for a turn I 'd be pissed but oh well. but heres what happened....my crops died almost every ten years because of my lack of bio labs...a lack that didn' exist since i had built them religiously in every base since the I was able. So perhaps I'm whining...I just expect to be treated fairly by the AI. I know that the AI cheats in soe ways in order to compete with a human mind, but in the game in question it was ridiculous.

I concede that perhaps my playing is lacing and i should live with it and try to improve. Still I get pissecwhen it seems the random events are centered on only making my game harder. I guess its a double edged sword.

D4

Kinjiru · June 22, 2000, 17:08

Heya D4-

As for specific example, I REALLY think it is research hospitals, rather than bio labs that will prevent the RE you are talking about.

-Kinjy

Basil · June 22, 2000, 23:47

No, Planet Blight is supposedly (according to Prima's manual) the random event that happens because of lack of bio labs, and if it's happening in bases with bio labs that's a bug. (I haven't seen such a bug in my own games.) Prometheus Virus is the event effected by research hospitals.

D4everman, in my experience it will only tell you about random events effecting other factions if you have units or bases or sensor arrays close enough to observe the base being effected by the random event. But it does happen, even if you can't see it, I've seen it happen when I set the computer up to play against itself using the scenario editor and I also once invaded an AI base which had obviously been recently hit by Planet Blight.

I'm sorry if it keeps on hitting you with lots of bad random events; I'd find that discouraging too. Out of curiousity, what faction & what SE settings are you at? It's my theory that running negative planet ratings and causing eco-damage encourages bad random events, but there's nothing in the documentation to support that.

I think the differences between JoeR and myself boil down to him thinking that random events are primarily just that, random, whereas I think of them as not being particularly more random than the results of combat.

RedFred · June 23, 2000, 00:04

Another random events fan checking in. I like the greater level of unpredictability of the random features; both the challenges of dealing with a bad event and the unexpected luck of a good random event.

I take the randomness to extremes. I mostly play random factions games, with random maps and blind (random) research. Keeps the game fresh for me.

joer · June 23, 2000, 00:43

::WHINE!:: I don't like when random events want to hurt me so bad. They're always so mean to me!

More seriously...I am one of the few wuzzes on this forum who isn't too fond of random events. Alpha Centauri is for me a game about having a superior strategy and planning, and predicting what the other factions are capable of, and drawing that into the plan. However, the randomness of a comet dropping on my biggest city has nothing to do with a bad strategic choice I made. It's just bad luck. I know bad luck is part of my real world and is realistic, but that doesn't mean I want to deal with it in a (rather unrealistic) game where I want to have fun. So in am not the biggest fan of increasing the luck factor in the game or punishing a group that was well played.

I also disagree that random events hurt momentum players more than it hurts builders. A builders biggest asset are his bases. If one gets struck by a crop failure and thus loses 10 rounds of productivity along with 10 sizes of population, then one's building effort isn't exactly rewarded.

A momentum player's biggest asset is his army. If one of his bases' pop gets halved, that doesn't stop his army of impact rovers rolling over me. And I have yet to see the random event that reduces the morale of all militairy units to green or drops the weapon level of all rovers back to machine guns.

But since everybody is so fond of it, I haven't got much other choice than to join MP games where random events are on. However, in SP, I prefer to wuzz out. And not feel the slightest guilt about it. So there! Enough whining for today!

-joer.

Alinestra Covelia · June 23, 2000, 19:33

They're not actually completely random, though. If you suffer a random event and then load up again to the turn before, it usually happens just the same as before.

I actually prefer it this way round, because it stopped me from being the eternal reloader that I was, and even made me tackle a Transcend/Huge Map/Iron Man game head on! (I'm still recovering...)

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Machines: outthinkable YES outfightable NO.
Men: outfightable YES outthinkable NO.
Allie Cove: outfallable INEVITABLY

Homepage http://www.enixine.dabsol.co.uk (Shared)

Aredhran · June 23, 2000, 19:59

I have seen the AI being hit by random events on multiple occasions in my SP games (mostly hail storms destroying solar collectors or whatever-it's-called that wipes out all forests)

June 23, 2000, 20:20

i often see the REs hitting the cpu, espcialy the virus that kills cities

i leave them on but i still hate them, almost all REs are negative, even things that boost production have side effects like eco-damage and starvation

Drago Sinio · June 24, 2000, 08:51

To me the Random Events are just one more way of increasing the games difficulty level if you want to. I agree about the energy crashes though, I hate those!

Fitz · November 9, 2000, 21:14

^bump

big_canuk · November 9, 2000, 21:41

Thanks Fitz!

What prompt service too! (I'm thanking Fitz for bumping this, cause I asked for it in another thread)

So.. any more discussion or new information on this subject.

What facilities affect what events?

Does ecodamage affect some events?

Lastly (probably not) what is the formula for the probability of a "random" event? It must be based on the number of facilities versus the number of bases, modified by the number of turns since the required tech was discovered.

Basil:

Are you ready to cough up your secret yet?

mark13 · November 10, 2000, 11:11

PlanetBlight can be countered by BioLabs, I think - Prometheus Virus needs Research Hospitals *or* the Human Genome Project....
Energy banks help against crashes (I think)
Children's creches can add pop to a base with a major pop surge...
Net nodes can experience major breakthroughs, giving you x number of extra research points,
That's about it - asteroid strikes just happen, as do volcano eruptions, although that is less of a pain...

Googlie · November 10, 2000, 11:15

Prima's Guide says:

Random Events

No random events occur before Turn (75 - (diff x 10)). i.e. 75 minus the diff level of the game times 10 where Citizen is 0 diff and Transcend is 5. Thus at Citizen level, random events kick in no earlier than Turn 75 while at Transcend they can show up as early as Turn 25.

Each turn, the game randomly picks a base. If there are fewer than 100 bases in total on Planet, it picks a number from 0 - 99, and if no base corresponds to that number (e.g. if it picked Base 80, where there are only 20 bases in total) then there is no random event.

If the selected base is les than size 4, or if it is the only base of its faction, or if it is already under the effects of a random event (e.g. famine), then no event takes place.

After all the conditions are fulfilled, one of the following events is randomly picked ( ... but not quite sure where AC's observation re reloads fits in here ... Googlie ) At the basic level, all events are equally likely except as itemized below, but in practice if you "roll" a really good event when you are already ahead, or a bad event when behind, it will tend to ignore the event and do nothing.

If an event is picked that would have no impact (e.g. "Asteroid strikes Nessus Prime" when no-one has a mining base) there is no event that turn.

Event list

(sample)

Asteroid strikes base: never before turn 75, and only if faction is in first place

Biology lab: if no Lab at base, then blight destroys all farms and forests. If lab, then 10 year nutrient bonus

Energy Crash/boom: if less than 1000 credits, 75% reduction. If at least 500 credits, and in fourth place or lower, reserves are doubled

Hail Storms: never before Turn 75

Volcano: No effect before Turn 75. Never happens unless faction is in first or second place.

Asteroid strikes Nessus Prime: if chosen as event, 20% chance of it happening

Solar Storm/Flare: if chosen, 20% chance of it happening

These are found on pp 15 and 16 of the guide. Page 17 then details the probability of various pod popping results.

G.

mark13 · November 10, 2000, 15:42

Wow, good stuff. Do you know if this guide is available online?

WhiteElephants · November 10, 2000, 18:42

Big Canuk -- If your reading this, you've made some good points. I'm afraid some events are just inevitable, though I think they happen more often if you are in first place on the power graph. I think you are right about the popping pod thing. Though, like I said before, for the comparitive game I think we should minimize the randomness, good and bad. And one of the few things we can control are the pods and the semi-quasi-random events. But, as you said, I'll play either way.

big_canuk · November 10, 2000, 18:42

Thanks, Googlie!

As I told you, I will pick up the guide next time to the computer store. Or... maybe I should try Amazom.com.

No mention of ecodamage eh? Maybe we can do a scientific study in the "Fall Challenge". Compare the number and severety of "random" events for those that run ecodamage, versus those that don't.

Excuse me for babbling, but once I get an idea in my head, you have to drill it out with and impact laser.

Misotu · November 10, 2000, 22:14

I'm afraid I'm with joer on this (see his post earlier in the thread). Random events are just a bummer, good or bad. So you get a nutrient bonus. Great. Your city expands way beyond what you can realistically support when it disappears again. The network surge ... what is that? I never got a tech from it, even though it's described in terms of a "breakthrough". My suspicion is that it doesn't give you anything if you discover a tech that turn anyway. Hailstorms hurt builders more than momentum players. -1 mineral for 10 years - well great. Momentum players have many tiny bases, they could care less. Builders are *scr*wed* with -1 mineral. Random events screw a serious strategy, and the benefit they confer is - as far as I'm concerned - unnecessary.

I've had games with bio labs in almost every base and I *still* lose all my forest in that one base without the bio lab. Actually, bio labs are a pathetic improvement, you'd never build them under normal circumstances with a faction capable of pop boom except where you have the Supercollider and/or ToE and you're stuck for something more sensible to build. Like a fusion supply foil. With random events on, you have to build bio labs everywhere. What a waste of time.

But the serious one has to be the energy thingy that causes you to lose most of your reserves. Pretty much rules out the possibility of an economic victory, and damned inconvenient at the best of times.

Random events ... they really suck.

Edited to add: I could care less against the AI. But in MP? Spare me.
[This message has been edited by Misotu (edited November 10, 2000).]

mark13 · November 11, 2000, 09:39

Again, it depends what sort of a game you want. If you want an out and out strategy game, you turn them off. But if you want that element of uncertainty, that niggling feeling that something could go wrong any minute, turn them on - there is nothing like an asteroid strike wiping out your SSC and leaving your tech stranded at 20 turns....it can be a great leveller.

Energy crashes are a real pain in the a$$, but at the same time, I would have said it mirrors what may happen in real-life. The only qualm I have against this is that, as far as I know, you can do nothing to prevent it - which makes a random event potentially devastating. As for it ruling out an economic victory, come on it doesn't happen that often. As Robert Burns once wrote: "The best laid plans of mice and men gang aft agley." And so it proves. I am someone who likes a little bit of randomness, that little feeling of uncertainty - it all adds to the excitement. In a motor race it is the same thing - in the lead by 40 seconds with three laps to go and what happens? Your engine goes. C'est la vie....

Kirnwaffen · November 11, 2000, 23:07

I have to side with the majority on this, even though I've gotten nailed with random events. I've had a game in which I had energy market crashes every time I got any substantial number of energy credits, and another game in which my research was constantly being erased ("lack of network nodes"). Still, I think that random events are one of the best levelers in the game (especially SP, where the AI is so incompetent). They also keep you honest in terms of the facilities that go the I-know-I-should-build-it-but-this-would-be-so-much-more-useful-at-the-moment route. Though I've been subject/witness to some major exceptions, most of the random events I experience are either good or afflict a base that I don't care about anyway. I always play with random events on.