No Science Succession ... Sticky Mice in Trouble! - Page 4

-Jrabbit · January 24, 2003, 10:03

1340 and the (bi)Czar Bunny takes the helm. Surveying the nation, he notes with amazement the fact that his No Science Society has 6 white techs and several rodent colonies spread throughout the world. 60-0-40 balance seems fine.

Black clicking reveals Greek cities at 1-15, 7-15, 11-11, and 16-20. Only missing one. Similarly, an Indian city, likely Delhi, resides at 31-73, with Lahore still a mystery.

While tickling here and there, the base strategy for the coming turns evolves.
-- find and destroy all Greek cities
-- await Magellan's build in Bombay, then take the citiy
-- find and destroy the remaining Indian cities
-- use triremes to develop trade routes with Spain and Japan while building toward war footing.
-- explore frozen north, settle Barb spawning grounds NW of Moscow.

1340
--Greeks advance on Sparta.
--Bombay elephant takes out 2 of our ellies.

Oh well, that's one less defender...
--Barbs moving on 3 fronts, most notably Moscow and Astrakhan.

1360
--Repel Greek archer and warrior at Sparta, leaving only a phalanx.

--Moscow ellie takes out Barb legion.

--Indian elephant drawn and quartered outside bombay.

--Japanese CF, give Spanish Writing

but tribute request result is WAR. Others won't chatter.

1380
--Population = 3MM
--Vans, supply/demand, and boats semi-organized.

1400
--Vans set sail to several exotic destinations
--Invasive Ellies shuffle away from Bombay forests to encourage shield production toward Magellan.
--India CF, no Pottery for Spanish = CF, Japan nothing.
--Greeks still won't talk; maybe they're upset about something...

1420
--Barbs killed at Astrakhan
--Delhi confirmed @ 31, 73,
--Capture Thermopylae and all its 9GP.
--Greeks talk, we accept Cease Fire. No tribute.

1440
--Greeks build new Capitol in Knossos (had none).

--Pharsalos revealed.
--Caravan delivers Gold to Salamanca, 36 GP.
--Delhi cat takes down our vet ellie.

1460
--Rabbit Czar caught napping! Grozny, Riga, Baltimore, and Kharkov all in disorder.

Elvis impersonators everywhere; temple started in Grozny.
--New Greek capitol makes Pharsalos a bit too expensive to bribe -- yet.
--Riga silk to Osaka, 36 GP
--Island hut in south yields Adv Tribe of Dnepropetrovsk. (Certainly advanced in Spelling!!)

1480
--Indians develop Writing.

--Disorder in Sparta.

--Kiev dye delivered to Valladolid for 46 GP.
--India, CF, Spain, Japan WAR, Greeks quiet.
--Northern exploration team sets forth.

1500
--Spain learns Engineering.

--Our brilliant scientists discover Bridge Building!
--Only one tech offered

= Chivalry.

(And we'll have it in only 48 turns!!

)
--Significant Barb legions appear, flanked behind our Bombay force. Oh well, they were bored anyway...
--Pharsalos falls under Russian influence for 348 GP, minus 12 plunder, minus 40 barracks sale.
--random click reveals new Japanese city at 78, 44.

1510
--Valence determined to be a Repeat Hides destination!!

--Angry troops destroy Barb legions outside Bombay.
--More angry ellies capture Delhi, plundering 25 GP. Another 40 GP raised by selling barracks for firewood.
--New city of Maikop founded on northern forested island featuring two whales and a silk.

--Indians cease fire.

1520
--Gems to Cordoba for 11 GP

--Silk to Seville, 72 GP
--Stumble onto Argos (2) with now-doomed Diplomat.
--Barbs approach Astrakhan (again).
--Polar hut nets NOMADS!!

--Lahore finally clicked at 32-52 rivergrass tile.

-Jrabbit retires, leaving a slightly larger civ behind, with a notably sweet treasury. Moscow is slowly collecting camels for our next WoW (Great Wall, King Richard?).

While the mighty DaveV needs no help from the woeful likes of me, I would like to lobby for some rushed Hides vans chained to Valence. Yeah, I know I left the shipchain in disarray.

The Greeks are dead meat, India just a matter of time -- if only they'd build Magellan's!!

As for the Spanish and Japs, we just need to build the invasion force for when the time is ripe.

BTW, I've never seen ONLY ONE TECH offered at this stage of the game!! Is that a byproduct of no science??

...and DaveV -- Don't forget to start with a tribute request BEFORE ending the current turn...

Scouse Gits · January 27, 2003, 06:38

Good turns Oh Mighty Lagomorph

Quote:

Originally posted by Scouse Gits
Order of Play

SG(2)
SG[1]
La Fayette
STYOM
-Jrabbit
DaveV

Straybow

SG[1]

Scouse Gits · January 27, 2003, 06:41

Just a note - in my "hit enter a zillion times" effort to definitievely determine the turn cycle for Deity I set research to zero - the effect of shackling the AI research worked fine until about 1500 - and then they took off - future players be warned....

SG[1]

-Jrabbit · January 27, 2003, 09:41

Quote:

Originally posted by Scouse Gits
Just a note - in my "hit enter a zillion times" effort to definitievely determine the turn cycle for Deity I set research to zero - the effect of shackling the AI research worked fine until about 1500 - and then they took off - future players be warned....

SG[1]

I have No Idea what this means, [1].

BTW, a minor typo correction...
In 1520, our Gems payoff was 111 GP, not 11 as stated in my account.

Scouse Gits · January 27, 2003, 10:25

Sorry - to try and clarify

In the early years with our tax slider at 0% the AI seems to mimic this and researches very slowly. However, in an experiment to determine the exact turn distribution (to get the oedo years absolutely correct) I recently played a game in which I did nothing but heit Enter for 6,020 years - and at about 1500 the AI's research took off like a rocket - so we can no longer assume that their research is stumted.

Does that make things clearer...

SG[1]

-Jrabbit · January 27, 2003, 11:30

Yes. Thanks.

Looks like it's time for our Dips to start mining all the work the AI is about to do for us...

DaveV · January 27, 2003, 14:16

Quote:

Originally posted by -Jrabbit
Looks like it's time for our Dips to start mining all the work the AI is about to do for us...

... or our troops

.

I played (sloppily) ten turns, the tenth is not completed. Sorry for any gross errors; I kind of rushed through this one. I did indulge myself by lowering the hammer on the cities I'd worked to menace, but some unit moves remain. Note to my successor: the Spanish have discovered Chivalry, so beware of barb crusaders!

The story:
Upon assuming the Czarship, DaveV is uncertain as to our civilization's goals. We are a sleazy trade empire with rampant corruption, few roads, and no science allowed, currently researching a tech which will make the barbs a real threat for a while. So Dave does what he does best: switch to a war footing. Moscow is changed to produce 10 shields and many fewer arrows. Move units out of Kharkov and Grozny so we can put Elvis to work. Einstein is also put to work producing shields. No tribute - not surprising, given our reputation.
1530 Two elephants die attacking legions in Corinth. Whoops, it's on the river. Japanese start Great Wall. Greek legion dies attacking our catapult outside Corinth.
1540 Indians declare war rather than pay tribute. We kill their roaming elephant. Wine(D) Sevastopol->Valladolid 40, Wine Yaktsk->Valladolid 8, Cloth Novgorod->Madrid 66. Kursk, Kuibyshev established.
1550 Temple rushed in Kharkov. Our elephants kill roaming Indian settler, barb legion. Hut (48,8) Elephants (Maikop). Great Wall rushed in Moscow. Indians have nearly completed Magellen.
1560 Moscow completes Great Wall, Japanese abandon same. Calcutta bribed away from the barbs for 260. Our elephants kill a Greek catapult outside Corinth. Hides Baltimore->Valladolid 12. Bombay completes Magellen.
1570 Two elephants, one legion die attacking Bombay. Japanese discover Construction. Barbs land three legions plus an unseen unit near Sparta. Lahore captured, 18 gold. Vallodolid captured, 61 gold and Engineering.
1580 Rush elephant in Astrakhan to deal with oncoming Japanese catapult.
1590 Magnitogorsk founded. Spanish develop Chivalry. We lose a caravel attacking Spanish settler; a second caravel kills him and is promoted.
1600 Japanese elephant kills our elephant in Astrakhan. Japanese and Spanish sign a secret alliance.
1610 Rushbuy elephant in Astrakhan. Our elephant and horsemen in Astrakhan kill two approaching Japanese elephants. Spanish kill a stack of seven of our elephants outside Vallodolid (ouch).
1620 Bombay captured, 89 gold, Indians destroyed. Kagoshima captured, 21 gold.

Scouse Gits · January 27, 2003, 15:56

My sympathy for the seven Ellies - that must have really hurt. Other than that doesn't look that sloppy to me. Good turns Dave

Following up Dave's comment - the Oh so lucrative tribute game doesn't work at all well if the AI doesn't trust us as far as it can spit us!

A Spotless Reputation is worth GOLD, boys, GOLD!

It may be the way our ancient curmudgeonly minds work, but both (2) and I generally play with a house 'rule' that requires a Spotless rep at all times.

Of course, we are only human and the temptation can at times be overwhelming... "Perhaps if we throw in 450g to sweeten the deal..." is VERY hard to resist rep hit or no rep hit....

SG[1]

Six Thousand Year Old Man · January 27, 2003, 16:19

@SG[1] Spotless, schmotless.

Quote:

Originally posted by La Fayette
1020: Greeks give 25g (t). We 'declare war' and destroy a number of Indian units.

Nyah, nyah... I just finished up La Fayette's good works.

If we can't have science, we might as well have war... and don't you think that using diplomats to steal techs will besmirch our rep., pristine or not?

Quote:

Originally posted by Six Thousand Year Old Man

I think it was La Fayette who did that first

Scouse Gits · January 28, 2003, 07:07

Quote:

Originally posted by Six Thousand Year Old Man
@SG[1] Spotless, schmotless.

Quote:

Originally posted by La Fayette
1020: Greeks give 25g (t). We 'declare war' and destroy a number of Indian units.

Nyah, nyah... I just finished up La Fayette's good works.

If we can't have science, we might as well have war... and don't you think that using diplomats to steal techs will besmirch our rep., pristine or not?

Nope - tech stealing is legitimate when at war - a state that occurs fairly frequently when you are demanding tribute at every opportunity.

SG[1]

Straybow · January 28, 2003, 23:06

I'm not even sure that stealing tech affects reputation under cease fire. It certainly will degrade relations with the civ in question, but reputation is the effect on all civs, and "they" don't care about "me" stealing tech from "you."

Straybow · January 30, 2003, 01:22

How does one go about repairing rep? Wait until everybody else sneak attacks?

Scouse Gits · January 30, 2003, 04:02

IIRC - even in Cease Fire there is a rep hit - but someone correct me if I've got it wrong.

Beleive it or not - the only way to improve your Rep is to build the Eiffel Tower - go figure the odds....

SG[1]

La Fayette · January 30, 2003, 04:34

Quote:

Originally posted by Scouse Gits
- the only way to improve your Rep is to build the Eiffel Tower -
SG[1]

La Fayette · January 30, 2003, 04:36

I mean this guy knows what he's talking about

Straybow · January 31, 2003, 00:41

Eiffel frickin' tower, indeed… No matter, I kept forgetting to ask fro tribute anyway.

rjmatsleepers · January 31, 2003, 02:05

Quote:

Originally posted by Scouse Gits

Beleive it or not - the only way to improve your Rep is to build the Eiffel Tower - go figure the odds....

SG[1]

I think time also helps it recover. At least in a recent game I moved from questionable to honourable over the course of a couple of milenia without building the Eiffel Tower.

RJM at Sleepers

Bloody Monk · January 31, 2003, 14:59

Quote:

Originally posted by rjmatsleepers

I think time also helps it recover. At least in a recent game I moved from questionable to honourable over the course of a couple of milenia without building the Eiffel Tower.

RJM at Sleepers

I've noticed this on occassion as well. Early bad form followed by long, long period of playing nice, trading, gifting, growing. Maybe that was the cause?? No recitivism=real reform=reputation boost???

Does anyone actually know??

Personally, I love the Tower...as a way to prebuild spaceship parts before Space Flight.

Monk

-Jrabbit · February 3, 2003, 09:45

@ Straybow...

Scouse Gits · February 5, 2003, 20:05

Bump

bump

Order of Play

SG(2)
SG[1]
La Fayette
STYOM
-Jrabbit
DaveV
Straybow

Straybow ... any progress ?

------------------------

SG(2)

Straybow · February 6, 2003, 01:54

Having problems with work/sleep cycle at present… progress is slow

-Jrabbit · February 6, 2003, 11:24

At least he acknowledges it's his turn...
It's been so long I'll need to reread this thread.

Scouse Gits · February 10, 2003, 17:31

Straybow ... is there life in Quasiqueue?

------------------------

SG(2)

Straybow · February 11, 2003, 00:14

Many apologies… my playing time keeps getting interrupted. I actually managed to fall asleep on the couch working on Russian infrastructure last week. Was late for work, since I didn't exactly have my alarm clock set.

La Fayette · February 11, 2003, 06:23

Quote:

Originally posted by Straybow

fall asleep on the couch working on Russian infrastructure .

Anyone who travelled in Russia would understand that

Straybow · February 11, 2003, 22:41

"What, you have a couch to sleep on? I should be so lucky!"

Straybow · February 13, 2003, 01:18

1620 A little tweaking to start off; sell some walls
1630 2 Eleys die capturing Corinth, 16g. Hyppolyta wants CF, we get 25 tribute.
–––– Kill 2 Spanish Eleys approaching Valladolid. Fish in a bucket.
1640 Kill Spanish Knight near Valladolid, Archer near Valence. They kill my Archer.
1650 Kill Archer, Settlers. Steal Chivalry.

Kill Archer & Pike in Toledo.
–––– Greeks break CF, kill Eley. What a surprise. Sell a Barracks.
1660 Greek Phalanx, Chariot, and Settlers bit the dust. 3 Spanish Cats & a Settler
–––– near Valence, Legion and Archer near Toledo dispatched to the netherworld.
–––– The Spanish kill 2 Eleys and try to sink a Caravel; some Greeks are impaled
–––– on our Eleys' tusks; our Eleys pursuing a barb leader discover a Jap Cat
1670

Argos 8g and Mycenea 7g as the few remaining peasants scatter;
–––– Gk Cat crushed beneath our chariot wheels. 61g plundered in Valence,
–––– Aquaduct sold. A few settlers plinked. Iron Mt prepares for a barb assault.
–––– Silk mined near Yakutsk.
1680 Spanish ask for CF, give 12 in tribute

Gks kill a couple Eleys. We
–––– kill barb Knights.
1690 Japs ask for CF, 25 tribute

Move units in and around to aggravate
–––– the CFs. Kill more barb Knights.
1700 Barb leader, 150g. 2 defenders die, Delphi yields 11g and bites the dust.
–––– Spanish insist we leave, then break CF. Kill one Eley, die assaulting Eleys on
–––– Fortressed Forest tile.
1710 We kill some Spanish Knights. Got tired of tweaking production.
1720 Knossos captured, 33g plundered, Greek civilization destroyed.

Plans laid to complete the Grand Canal!

My work is done here.

Straybow · February 13, 2003, 01:24

Had to get those Settlers into place, or at least close. Notice the side canal to connect Yakutsk and Boston to the main route. I'm sure you all appreciate my canal-orific leadership.

Scouse Gits · February 13, 2003, 07:22

Not that I would have the timerity to question your glorious leadership, Stray, but what's with this wholesale destruction of improvements - are they in captured cities???

SG[1]

-Jrabbit · February 13, 2003, 11:39

It's alive!
Glad to see you're awake Stray. Nice job (afaik

)