Between a rock and a hard place

KrazyHorse · January 13, 2003, 01:48

(As to North Korea)

Here's the thing: the North Koreans are crazy. They're wacko militarist isolationists with delusions of grandeur and missile/nuke technology to back it up.

The other thing is that the US cannot afford to invade them. They can't even bomb away their nuke production capability without incurring a serious risk of causing the North Koreans (who are crazy; see point 1) to nuke Seoul, Tokyo, and anybody else within 3000 miles who so much as looks at them funny.

The US also can't afford to have the NKers develop a significant nuclear stockpile and remain starved for cash/fuel/grain. Because they will not hesitate to export their capability to less rational (!) actors on the world stage (i.e. nuclear proliferation).

So the conclusion has to be that you do not play hardball with them. Because they will play hardball right back until you have to admit that you were just bluffing (sorry about the mixed metaphor). Because they aren't bluffing. And then you look like an idiot.

So what does the current US administration do? It first off, breaks off negotiations. Then it says it won't negotiate until the NKers stop being bad boys. Then it starts to give the NKers what they want without even negotiating, and says that it's willing to talk, but not call it a negotiation, and then it makes the first offer (which is basically everything NK wants). And so far NK hasn't offered anything. It's actually gone backwards in revoking the two most salient policies (adherance to the NPT and a missile test ban).

The problem with backtracking is that you look stupid (no matter how you spin it) and you lose more than if you'd negotiated from the first instance. Brilliant.

Boris Godunov · January 13, 2003, 01:52

Foreign policy experts indeed...

Ted Striker · January 13, 2003, 01:54

Are you Korean Frogger?

KrazyHorse · January 13, 2003, 01:57

Yes.

KrazyHorse · January 13, 2003, 01:58

We recently changed our flag to that of a country whom we admire so much for its unity and strongly individualist stance when it comes to America.

Skanky Burns · January 13, 2003, 02:31

Ted Striker · January 13, 2003, 02:33

Oh, you are KrazyHorse, Korean immigrant to Canada. Correct?

Ted Striker · January 13, 2003, 02:34

Well you Koreans have two choices, be the US/Japan/Australia *****, or be the Chinese *****.

Take your pick.

Cause I don't see you standing on your own without a big stick to stand against the other big stick.

KrazyHorse · January 13, 2003, 02:35

Yes. I am here to teach Korean as a second language to Canadian students who wish to have career opportunities beyond their borders.

Asher · January 13, 2003, 02:35

DRoseDARs · January 13, 2003, 02:36

Well, last night they were SNL's Opening B*tch-of-the-Week...

KrazyHorse · January 13, 2003, 02:36

Quote:

Originally posted by Skanky Burns

I'm glad you appreciated that.

DinoDoc · January 13, 2003, 02:38

Quote:

It's actually gone backwards in revoking the two most salient policies (adherance to the NPT

He says that as if they followed it to begin with.

Skanky Burns · January 13, 2003, 02:38

Indeed.

chequita guevara · January 13, 2003, 02:39

That was unusually funny for SNL.

KrazyHorse · January 13, 2003, 02:40

Quote:

Originally posted by DinoDoc

Quote:

It's actually gone backwards in revoking the two most salient policies (adherance to the NPT

He says that as if they followed it to begin with.

a)They did follow their missile test ban policy, AFAIK

b)They were proceeding at a much-reduced pace on nuclear weapons development for the period between 1994 and 2002. They'd never completely stopped but they also weren't barreling towards acquiring a large stockpile (at least this appears to be the standard view of it).

Ted Striker · January 13, 2003, 02:41

I thought they already have 3 of those things.

DinoDoc · January 13, 2003, 02:42

Quote:

Originally posted by Ted Striker
be the US/Japan/Australia *****,

Can b*tches have b*tches?

Ted Striker · January 13, 2003, 02:43

Well Dino they are called nested *****es. It forms a sort of interconnected matrix.

Skanky Burns · January 13, 2003, 02:46

Yes. See "New Zealand" for proof.

Ted Striker · January 13, 2003, 02:48

Why did you guys drop them off the back of the boat that wasn't very considerate.

KrazyHorse · January 13, 2003, 02:50

Quote:

Originally posted by Ted Striker
I thought they already have 3 of those things.

That's not a large stockpile, and is not large enough for them to pose a threat of selling them (since they need to keep some at home to keep the US out). If they get a couple of dozen, then they'll certainly begin to export.

Ted Striker · January 13, 2003, 02:53

Well I think 1 is more than enough.

That's enough to hit your people or Japan or China.

KrazyHorse · January 13, 2003, 02:55

Ted, wanting them not to have any won't make them go away. And pouting because they've been bad just makes your problem worse.

What do you think should be done?

Ted Striker · January 13, 2003, 02:56

Pull out the gat and let the cop killers fly.

DinoDoc · January 13, 2003, 02:58

Quote:

Originally posted by Frogger
What do you think should be done?

Them hand over the fuel rods and any other stockpiles they have and publically renounce the desire before thier people and the international community along with very real consequences for deciet as conditions for any deal.

KrazyHorse · January 13, 2003, 02:59

If States like NK want to develop nukes there's not much you can do about it. NK isn't Iraq. It's got two big brothers sitting up north of it, an army that would make the US think 2 or 3 times before invading and the ability and inclination to take its frustrations out on any country in the region.

The US (and the West in general) have to deal. They know it and the DPRK knows it. So why would the DPRK back down in the face of what they're sure is a bluff?

Ted Striker · January 13, 2003, 02:59

First thing I'd do is quitley get our boys out of there.

You people are obviously fed up with them.

Then I let your people do all the negotiating but make it clear that no reunification happens on NK terms. (Some of your people are apologetic to the North and that's such BS).

But if you guys get overrun don't blame us.

Ted Striker · January 13, 2003, 03:00

Secondly I go to China and Russia and tell them to go tell the North Koreans to knock that **** off.

KrazyHorse · January 13, 2003, 03:01

Quote:

Originally posted by DinoDoc
Them hand over the fuel rods and any other stockpiles they have and publically renounce the desire before thier people and the international community along with very real consequences for deciet as conditions for any deal.

And they won't agree to that. Instead, they'll keep on chugging away pumping out as many nukes as possible. Then they'll sell them to Yemen or Iraq or a Somalian frigging warlord and you'll be in real deep ****.