Why are Americans so different from the rest of us Westerners - Page 14

DuncanK · January 16, 2003, 15:36

Quote:

Originally posted by GP

READ TOQUEVILLE'S BOOK

There are some good ideas discussed in the book, like the one that Americans will trust their government too much and stop participating in it or stop keeping up with the issues. However, reading the book will not be sufficient to be the last word in critique of American Democracy. It is presented as so in high school though, I believe.

DuncanK · January 16, 2003, 15:40

Quote:

Originally posted by Ozz

Not offended at all, I was doing a bit of poking too.

Do Americans have unique reckonzied vocal mannerisms as a whole? Some regional areas do ie Texas, The South but as a whole is there something only Americans
say?

The vocal mannerisms have become melded in California and the West. Gradually more and more people in the country are talking like Californians. Some people, like in Texans, try hard to retain their culture and retain their vocal mannerisms.

Arrian · January 16, 2003, 15:49

Quote:

The vocal mannerisms have become melded in California and the West. Gradually more and more people in the country are talking like Californians.

Come again? Humor a backward New Englander, explain.

-Arrian

DuncanK · January 16, 2003, 15:59

Quote:

Originally posted by Arrian

Come again? Humor a backward New Englander, explain.

-Arrian

I hate to put my foot in my mouth and get off topic and only talk about Americans. Anyway, I'm not a Linguist (is that even how to spell it). The initial Anglo immigration to California came from all over the East. The new Californians started talking in a new dialect (melded from the other dialects). It wasn't a Southern dialect or a Northern dialect. Now with the media and all the migration all over the country Americans are starting to talk in the same dialect, Californian.

Arrian · January 16, 2003, 16:04

If you say so. *shrug* I've never heard any such thing. When I go to the MidWest, I hear that flat, MW accent. When I go South, I hear that drawl. Up here, we have Nu Yawkas and Baastanians, with Conneddicut inbetween. Maybe your Californian thing will catch on out here eventually.

Heh, we've definitely had some odd threadjacks in this thread (Canadian defense spending, the characteristics of certain nuclear submarines, Canadian/US lumber disputes, and now this).

-Arrian

Ozz · January 16, 2003, 16:13

Quote:

Originally posted by Arrian
Heh, we've definitely had some odd threadjacks in this thread (Canadian defense spending, the characteristics of certain nuclear submarines, Canadian/US lumber disputes, and now this).

-Arrian

No Jackin' The topic is "Why are Americans so different from the rest of us Westerners" One of the differiences
is others all have distinct phases and words that mark
their identify, A Brit may think a Canadian American until
he says about or eh.

Hollywood has given us all your words.

TCO · January 16, 2003, 17:33

Quote:

Originally posted by DuncanK

There are some good ideas discussed in the book, like the one that Americans will trust their government too much and stop participating in it or stop keeping up with the issues. However, reading the book will not be sufficient to be the last word in critique of American Democracy. It is presented as so in high school though, I believe.

Agreed. I think it is impossible to write a book that unravels the entire snailshell of why and how Americans are different from Europeans. (And it is obviously confounded alot if you get wrapped up in which you like better, the American attributes or the European ones.) I just think that "Fighting Al" swings at some tough pitches and connects with a pretty good batting average. And I don't mind at all that some of his characterizations are negative (I hope Roland gives me enough credit to know that I wouldn't get hurt by that) so long as his observations ring true and seem to hit a perceptive chord.

I think reading books is not sufficient. (I would add some Mark Twain and some Menkin in there to get a little more of the feel for the US.) But travelling and working and spending some time over here. Getting all of your info from newspapers and TV and video games and movies doesn't do the thing justice. Do like Cali or Stew (Boddington) and come over for a stay. Or Legman or Colon.

TCO · January 16, 2003, 17:37

Quote:

Originally posted by Arrian

Heh, we've definitely had some odd threadjacks in this thread (Canadian defense spending, the characteristics of certain nuclear submarines, Canadian/US lumber disputes, and now this).

-Arrian

Are you complaining? Don't make me get my boy D2K to give you a *****slapping.

TCO · January 16, 2003, 17:38

Quote:

Originally posted by Ozz

No Jackin' The topic is "Why are Americans so different from the rest of us Westerners" One of the differiences
is others all have distinct phases and words that mark
their identify, A Brit may think a Canadian American until
he says about or eh.

Hollywood has given us all your words.

There are alot of the Canadians who don't have a very strong Canadian influence either. I.e. don't say "a boot".

MichaeltheGreat · January 16, 2003, 18:01

Quote:

Originally posted by paiktis22
way better than romantic colonial scum who got kicked in the ass for their murderous regimes DL ozz

edit: actually no, they are the same ****

Paiktis: The threadstalking, insults and threadjacking stop now.

Want three days to chill, or would you rather have a whole week? It's up to you. This time.

KrazyHorse · January 16, 2003, 18:31

Quote:

Originally posted by DuncanK

My post got lost behind pages and pages of stuff about Canada.

Canadians,

this thread isn't really about you. Very little is. If you want to have a thread about Canada go and start one. I suspect that you will be the only ones posting there. It's like why America is more significant than you, because everyone immigrated to our country and not yours.

Snooze.

a) You can blame a dual citizen, IIRC (Asher) for changing topic

b) This is a 20 page thread. 20 page threads go off topic

c) Even American-bashing gets tiring after a while

DuncanK · January 16, 2003, 19:04

Quote:

Originally posted by GP

Agreed. I think it is impossible to write a book that unravels the entire snailshell of why and how Americans are different from Europeans. (And it is obviously confounded alot if you get wrapped up in which you like better, the American attributes or the European ones.) I just think that "Fighting Al" swings at some tough pitches and connects with a pretty good batting average. And I don't mind at all that some of his characterizations are negative (I hope Roland gives me enough credit to know that I wouldn't get hurt by that) so long as his observations ring true and seem to hit a perceptive chord.

I think reading books is not sufficient. (I would add some Mark Twain and some Menkin in there to get a little more of the feel for the US.) But travelling and working and spending some time over here. Getting all of your info from newspapers and TV and video games and movies doesn't do the thing justice. Do like Cali or Stew (Boddington) and come over for a stay. Or Legman or Colon.

So true

TCO · January 16, 2003, 19:23

Quote:

Originally posted by Frogger

c) Even American-bashing gets tiring after a while

Whew. It's like being the class idiot. Eventually they run out of energy yelling at you.

USA!

DuncanK · January 16, 2003, 19:27

Quote:

Originally posted by GP

Whew. It's like being the class idiot. Eventually they run out of energy yelling at you.

USA!

Main_Brain · January 16, 2003, 19:29

I have no clue where my posts are in this uhm large Thread but nevertheless I thank those who made valid Points and damn those who didn't

Ned · January 16, 2003, 19:54

Panag, Now that was funny.

mactbone · January 16, 2003, 20:45

I'm pretty sure the Midwest is the bastion of American English. Apparently that's why most national newscasters are from the Midwest or speak in that bland accent. The only thing that's happening to our language right now is the pronunciation of 'for' turning into 'fer' as in fur coat. It's sickening.

King of Rasslin · January 16, 2003, 22:42

No, its the evolution of language. Your is much harder to say than ur. Banana is much harder to say than nanner. Hood is much simpler than neighborhood. You will come off as more progressive if you speak simply. Only slow, dumb, old fashioned people bother to use proper language and punctuation.

spartak · January 17, 2003, 05:16

Quote:

Originally posted by Spiffor

Is that better ?

yes - thank you.

Sikander · January 17, 2003, 08:12

Quote:

Originally posted by Spiffor

You have taught me something. Is this kind of practice generalized among the country ? Is it considered as generosity or norm ?

It is federal law that you cannot turn away anyone whose health might suffer as an immediate consequence, which basically covers all emergency room type visits. This is not to say that there are not some barriers. Emergency rooms in areas with large poor populations typically have long waits for treatment, while some hospitals illegally "dump" patients on other hospitals. An example of the latter is that some hospitals in nearby Denver will ask a patient if he would rather wait for several hours to be treated, or accept free cab fare to our hospital which typically has much less of a wait. The upside for these hospitals is that they tend to save a lot of money by not treating the indigent patient, even with the 75$ cab fare.

In the end we pay a lot of money with this system treating the poor in an inefficient manner. It is much better for the patient to have regular care from a physician who knows them and who can use preventative measures rather than only emergency measures. But though this is inefficient, it is still much cheaper than any sort of guaranteed health coverage. I'm not claiming that we do a better job of taking care of our poor than most Europeans, only that we don't leave people bleeding to death in the streets.

Richelieu · January 17, 2003, 08:30

Quote:

Originally posted by King of Rasslin
No, its the evolution of language. You will come off as more progressive if you speak simply.

It's like, man, like,you're totally wrong dude! Like, no way! Like, Dude!

No waaameeen ?

zulu9812 · January 17, 2003, 10:34

Quote:

Originally posted by Ned
But you are largely right. Americans are extremely proud of their country, proud of its achievements, proud of its Constitution, proud of its role in WWII, proud of its role in defeating communisim and proud of its role in championing democracy and human rights in today's world.

1. Achievements - at least 2 incidences of genocide...
2. It's role in WWII - just out of interest, do you beleive America 'won' WWII?
3. It's role in defeating communism - I seem to remember this role being about replacing pro-soviet democratically-elected governments with anti-soviet autocracies/dictatorships. Two example which spring to mind are Iran and Afghanistan - both of which eventually bit you in the ass. It's largely thanks to Britain and America's meddling that the Middle East is in the mess that it is.

Quote:

Originally posted by Ned
Most of the anti-American world seem intent, in our view, of demonstrating that America is evil in one form or another - that our achievements are built on slavery, for example

It is built on slavery! Then again, so's England. I say England, and not Britain, because Scotland was the first place in the world to outlaw slavery. And that was largely because we didn't have any slaves in the first place.

Quote:

Originally posted by Ned
But we in the US know differently because we are idealists who elect leaders who are idealists as well.

Aah yes, the American electoral system - where the candidate with the most votes loses.

Quote:

Originally posted by Ned
We will support a foreign policy that aims at stability, democracy and human rights.

This is the stupidest thing I've ever seen you post. It is unjust for any nation to enforce it's way of life on another people. Yeah sure, us westerners might enjoy our decadent lifestyles with computer games, satellite TV with 500 channels and our porn magazines. But some groups of human beings have decided not to live like that and we should respect that. Not everyone wants democracy. There is a reason why the UN will not involve itself militarily in internal disputes - althought there have been some rare and justified exceptions (namely Kosovo)

DinoDoc · January 17, 2003, 11:17

Quote:

Originally posted by zulu9812
2. It's role in WWII - just out of interest, do you beleive America 'won' WWII?

Yes, I do. Unless of course you have some reliable evidence that we lost WWII.

Quote:

Aah yes, the American electoral system - where the candidate with the most votes loses.

There are better and more credible rebutles of Ned's point than that one you know.

Quote:

There is a reason why the UN will not involve itself militarily in internal disputes - althought there have been some rare and justified exceptions (namely Kosovo)

How is that justified?

Ned · January 17, 2003, 11:58

zulu9812, Your post exemplifies the gross differences between America and the rest of the West.

Why is the world more today free, democratic and respectful of human rights than anytime in its history?

Spiffor · January 17, 2003, 12:03

Thanks for the explanation Sikander.
I thought the US gave healthcare cards to the very poorest, but the others (including the lower class) ahd to fend for themselves to pay for their medication. I understand now it is not true for emergencies.
Still, refusing to pay for basic medication and health (except emergencies) of the lower class, or the lower-middle class is a significant difference with all other developed countries.

Spiffor · January 17, 2003, 12:04

Quote:

Originally posted by Ned
Why is the world more today free, democratic and respectful of human rights than anytime in its history?

Because of the UN

DinoDoc · January 17, 2003, 12:07

Quote:

Originally posted by Spiffor
Because of the UN

You slay me.

Spiffor · January 17, 2003, 12:09

Mission accomplished

My Wife Hates CIV · January 17, 2003, 12:48

'Why are Americans so different from the rest of us Westerners '

???

just because we are better in so many ways!

zulu9812 · January 17, 2003, 13:11

Quote:

Originally posted by DinoDoc
Yes, I do. Unless of course you have some reliable evidence that we lost WWII.

Actually, I was asking whether or not he believed America to be able to claim responsibilty for ultimate victory. I believe that belongs to the Soviet Union.

As for how 'how was UN military intervention in Kosovo justified?', if you think a leader murdering his own people in the name of ethnic cleansing isn't justification enough, I guess that shows the difference between Americans and Europeans. And just in case you were thinking of using my argument to sa 'why then shouldn't we attack Sadam Hussein?', he paid the price 12 years ago and continues to pay it.