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View Poll Results: Should artillery units have lethal bombardment?
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All units should have lethal bombardment, like CIV2
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18 |
39.13% |
Only units such as battleships and bombers
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7 |
15.22% |
Only the Hwacha, so it can start a Golden Age
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8 |
17.39% |
No, keep it as it is.
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2 |
4.35% |
Other option
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11 |
23.91% |
Bombardment sucks, I never use it.
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0% |
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January 18, 2003, 01:57
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#1
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Prince
Local Time: 08:40
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: IL
Posts: 576
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Lethal bombardments?
What do you think of making bombardments lethal, like CIV2?
So far in my personal mod I have made the Hwacha lethal, so it could start a golden age.
Last edited by HolyWarrior; January 18, 2003 at 02:02.
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January 18, 2003, 07:24
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#2
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King
Local Time: 16:40
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Sweden
Posts: 1,333
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There was no bombardment in Civ2 right?
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January 18, 2003, 08:44
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#3
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King
Local Time: 09:40
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Right down the road
Posts: 2,321
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Very few units should get lethal bombard. Hwacha would be a good choice so they can get the GA (but, having tried this, in the hands of a human player it is unbalanced as the AI still won't move these from his cities). Ship to ship could be lethal. Fighter to ship should be lethal. Ship to ground and air to ground, in general, should not.
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January 18, 2003, 12:33
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#4
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Warlord
Local Time: 09:40
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Grand Rapids, MI
Posts: 296
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I agree with Warpstorm for the most part. Bombing and bombarding ground units should not be lethal. Bombing and possibly bombarding naval units should be lethal. Cruise missiles should be lethal to naval units (it usually takes several missiles to sink a ship anyway).
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January 18, 2003, 17:07
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#5
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Prince
Local Time: 08:40
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: IL
Posts: 576
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Quote:
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Originally posted by statusperfect
There was no bombardment in Civ2 right?
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True, there was no bombardment as in CIV3, but in CIV2 cannon and catapult could kill enemy units. This is what I meant.
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January 19, 2003, 22:23
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#6
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Chieftain
Local Time: 06:40
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: California
Posts: 42
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Since the AI doesn't use bombardment effectively - namely only to destroy improvements and seldom on attackers - lethal bombardment would significantly imbalance the SP game. Unless the AI could be coaxed to hit my plies of Artillery and Infantry in the late game while my cavalry and tanks are healing on their turf with Battlefield Med, the argument FOR lethal bombardment just doesn't work.
In a MP game tho, I might even be encouraged to build a catapult - something I never do otherwise : )
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January 20, 2003, 07:02
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#7
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Prince
Local Time: 15:40
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 768
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I agree and disagree with you, Warpstorm. Most disagree. If we look at the history, canons, artilleries and planes have wiped out enimies in great number. The most recent must have been the US bombardment of Afganistan. Thousands of people died after been plane-bombed. Big Bertha in WW1 was a feared weapon and several ships were sunk by planes during WW2.
In my current personal mod, canons and above have lethal land bombardment including all planes. Battleships and AEGIS cruisers as well.
Yes, it's correct that the AI doens't used bombardment very well against other units. In fact I've never seen an AI with a lot of artillery. When I have researched replacable parts and go to war, it's normally with at least 5-10 artys against each city I want to conquer. I've never seen the AI do that...
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January 31, 2003, 20:34
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#8
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Prince
Local Time: 08:40
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: IL
Posts: 576
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bump to the top
C'mon all, I'm looking for some good responses here.
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January 31, 2003, 21:52
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#9
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Deity
Local Time: 08:40
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: of naught
Posts: 21,300
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Quote:
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Originally posted by MoonWolf
The most recent must have been the US bombardment of Afganistan. Thousands of people died after been plane-bombed.
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Excellent example... of where the most advanced and deadly air force on the planet could not destroy ground units. They still had to send in the grunts to mop up.
I agree that fighters should be lethal against ships though.
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January 31, 2003, 22:58
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#10
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Warlord
Local Time: 08:40
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: in the general vicinity of Chicago
Posts: 146
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Heck, siege engines (catapaults, cannons, et. al.) are all ultimately descended from anti-personnel weapons. From a realism standpoint (I'm leaving my yap shut on balance), it's hard to argue that bombardment should never be lethal. Never? Bah.
How about this? Bombardment can kill a unit, but only if the unit is already on its last hit point. Before then, bombardment rules apply as they are now. For ground units, the chances to remove that last hit point are lower, particularly with the usual defensive enhancements in place (radar towers, civil defense, walls, hills, etc.). For ship units, the chances are the same.
Oh yeah, and any air unit that can't fly Air Superiority missions can be destroyed in one hit by bombardment.
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February 1, 2003, 09:27
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#11
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Emperor
Local Time: 16:40
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: MY WORDS ARE BACKED WITH BIO-CHEMICAL WEAPONS
Posts: 8,117
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hi ,
we should need something like dual type of bombardment , a stealth bomber can bomb without hitting the building next door but it can carry also large area bombs that blast the whole neigborhood , this should be reflected , .....
 , regular bombing is lethal for the stealth and presision is not , ......
there are many cases inwhere this dual use could be used , .....
have a nice day
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February 3, 2003, 12:55
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#12
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Prince
Local Time: 08:40
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: May 2002
Location: of Central Texas
Posts: 561
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Just as soon as patch 1.21f (I think it was) came out that allowed Lethal Bombardment, I enabled it on all bombard-type units.
I just couldn't see a spearman getting hit by a huge stone thrown from a catapult and not dying.
As far as balance, well, I might make a few canons, but don't really get started making bombard units until Artillery comes along. By this point in the game, I am either decidedly ahead of the AI (in which case the lethality only speeds-up the inevetable), or I'm so far behind that I need it to try and catch up.
On a personal note: I once got 3 GL's from bombarding Battleships that stopped too close to my shores. Unfortunately, I was behind in techs and couldn't build any wonders or more Armys so I used them to rush Libraries or something so mundane as to almost make it painful.
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February 3, 2003, 21:12
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#13
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Emperor
Local Time: 16:40
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Belgrade, Serbia
Posts: 3,218
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Tactical bombers only (Fighters, Jet FIghters and Stl. FIghters).
To make them different.
They are in fact tactical bombers.
(capable of destoying smaller foramtions)
P.S.
Of course in this case they should still have bomb Str and ROF lower then bombers which are strategical bombers.
(but at least Fighters and Jets should get their ROF upped to value of 2 compared to standard rules)
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February 4, 2003, 07:35
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#14
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Emperor
Local Time: 16:40
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: MY WORDS ARE BACKED WITH BIO-CHEMICAL WEAPONS
Posts: 8,117
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Quote:
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Originally posted by steven8r
Just as soon as patch 1.21f (I think it was) came out that allowed Lethal Bombardment, I enabled it on all bombard-type units.
I just couldn't see a spearman getting hit by a huge stone thrown from a catapult and not dying.
As far as balance, well, I might make a few canons, but don't really get started making bombard units until Artillery comes along. By this point in the game, I am either decidedly ahead of the AI (in which case the lethality only speeds-up the inevetable), or I'm so far behind that I need it to try and catch up.
On a personal note: I once got 3 GL's from bombarding Battleships that stopped too close to my shores. Unfortunately, I was behind in techs and couldn't build any wonders or more Armys so I used them to rush Libraries or something so mundane as to almost make it painful.
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hi ,
 , next time try to save those GL's a bit before you use them like that , .....
have a nice day
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