OFFICIAL: Should we go to War with the Austrians?

Maquiladora · January 18, 2003, 20:23

From what i can tell from the turn chat and the maps available our negotiations for the Austrian's map has failed, and any future attempts would be just as unsuccessful.

Note: Your voting to choose if you want to go to War in the next 2 turns only.

The question is though should we go to War by attacking the new Austrian city founded on the Nothern river beside the wheat good? Or do we play it peaceful with our powerful neighbours and expand by our own settlers for now?

Locutus · January 18, 2003, 20:41

The diplomatic situation may still be salvageable. It depends on their regard. But I need to see a savegame before I can say anything about that... Either way, trying a *proper* map request can be done anyway, regardless of what we decide here.

(Want to see the savegame before I decide on war/no war...)

Maquiladora · January 18, 2003, 20:48

Do you think this poll is abit vague? I mean it doesnt state when you want to go to war just that you do or dont. I mean we could build 9 more cities on our own and then go to war, thats still a vote for war.

I personally want to build one more city on our own then prepare and wage war, i guess thats a vote for war.

Locutus · January 18, 2003, 20:52

Maybe you should expand that in your first turn a little: this poll should mean that we will go to war NOW (or at least within the next 2 turns).

HuangShang · January 18, 2003, 22:21

i'd say we run out of their borders and wait for the new city to be size 2, i voted no, not yet, even though im in the party For War

centrifuge · January 18, 2003, 22:52

Not yet

mapfi · January 19, 2003, 07:40

destroy that city!

Dale · January 19, 2003, 08:59

Not in the next 2 turns, but maybe in 3.

Zaphod Beeblebrox · January 19, 2003, 10:16

why destroy that city? there will be no benefit from that. if we attack at all, than citys worth capturing with forces able to do so.

Turambar · January 19, 2003, 11:16

No war until we are strong enough!

Oerdin · January 19, 2003, 11:34

All tied up.

Oerdin · January 19, 2003, 11:35

Who abstained? Surely everyone has an opinion about a subject as important as war and peace.

Pedrunn · January 20, 2003, 00:45

Quote:

Originally posted by Zaphod Beeblebrox
why destroy that city? there will be no benefit from that. if we attack at all, than citys worth capturing with forces able to do so.

The goodmod gives gold and PW when conquering the city form its owner according to the formula:

Pillaged Gold/PW= City owner reserve / number of cities

So depending on the Austrian Gold and PW we can boost our reserves and weaken them.

MrBaggins · January 20, 2003, 08:27

Quote:

Originally posted by Oerdin
Who abstained? Surely everyone has an opinion about a subject as important as war and peace.

I did. I don't think there is a completely convincing case either way for war within 2 turns.

I.E. It would be tremendously beneficial for us to win.

Its extremely risky for us to attack *now*

Zaphod Beeblebrox · January 20, 2003, 09:15

ic what you mean pedrunn, but we should only conquer cities we can hold or we want to destroy utterly because their placed bad. neither of those seems to be the situation here at the moment.

Maquiladora · January 20, 2003, 09:17

Ugh, i wish i hadnt voted for war now when i created this thread, its not what we want... yet. Bloody Democracy

mapfi · January 20, 2003, 09:36

I think we held this vote prematurely - first there's still the map deal that could work ans second:

Are we going to use the moving cursor over enemy city trick to see if there are any units in the austrian city? If not I think it's too risky, but I say we use it. The game's tough as it is.

I also wish I hadn't voted yet...

Maquiladora · January 20, 2003, 09:41

Yeah i know, its hanging abit in the air with the Austrians, the vote should be war or second settler really.

Quote:

Are we going to use the moving cursor over enemy city trick to see if there are any units in the austrian city?

Thats a good question, are we also going to build farms under cities? Right click everywhere to look for stealth units? Use retreat slaver bug?... maybe we need a poll decing this too.

Zaphod Beeblebrox · January 20, 2003, 09:44

rightclick for stealth units? thats a one i didn't know

mapfi · January 20, 2003, 09:48

Quote:

the vote should be war or second settler really.

not really, Dale said that the Austrians would probably give in if we destroy their city and we can go on with the settler - but I think we need to hurt them now or we will be crushed.

Maquiladora · January 20, 2003, 10:06

The Austrians will give in if we take their new city? Im not so sure about it

They must have 5 or even 6 cities now and theyre way above us in the military and science graphs.

Locutus · January 20, 2003, 11:24

I'm not sure about Dale's theory. The AI is probably quite powerful already. Dale may be right, but he may not be.

If we could get away with destroying the Austrian city, I would favour it, but I'm not sure we can. So I'm tempted to vote No, but I want to await the map exchange if possible. How long will this poll be open, Maq?

Maquiladora · January 20, 2003, 18:33

Um i think its open forever...

Not that this poll was ever really clear enough for the voters, although it was official. 7-6 and one abstain, I think it should be a little more. We can retaliate but is any majority enough to start a war?

If we get their map we should make a new poll with the map and info attached or something.

Devil of Truth · January 21, 2003, 04:55

Give peace a chance.

ískallin · January 21, 2003, 12:03

the AI wont give peace a chance so why should we bother?

Oerdin · January 21, 2003, 12:57

Quote:

Originally posted by Zaphod Beeblebrox
rightclick for stealth units? thats a one i didn't know

It's in our tactics faq.

child of Thor · January 21, 2003, 14:15

well i played a Cradle 1.34b game yesterday:

difficulty: very hard
barbs: roaming(?)

I had one city on what turned out to be an eastern penisula. I met the greeks to the west of me and their diplo stance was very much like the Austrians - alot more powerfull than us(as i turned out they had five cities to my one.). So i appeased abit(gave gold for a few turns to try to improve their regard for us), did a small amount of grovelling as they were way ahead of me on the graphs. Then i decided this situation looked kinda like the Austrian one so i experimented. Production was cranked up and 2 warriors and a slinger i had found in a goody hut attacked the nearest city and took it. I carried on this pattern untill i now have 13 cities, of which i only settled 3 of them. The Greeks have two cities left and i'm in a stronger position, although still way behind the leaders in tech.
So in this case taking the risk was worth it. I don't know how much of an edge that slinger gave me but i think if i had another warrior instead the outcome would have been the same as the city just had one defender.

Locutus · January 21, 2003, 14:26

I don't think you can compare Cradle/Emperor/Roaming to SAP/Deity/Raging...

Wise Ass · January 23, 2003, 16:49

Quote:

Originally posted by Locutus
I don't think you can compare Cradle/Emperor/Roaming to SAP/Deity/Raging...

No War!

yet