Directed Research

Scipio Centaurus · February 20, 2001, 23:53

I have a question about directed research. Sometimes the game does not offer a particular tech that I would like to, and should be able to research. How can I make the game offer different tech choices? TIA

Blake · February 21, 2001, 00:18

There isn't really any way to change which it offers you, other than changing which techs you have. For example if you have the pre-req for IndAuto, but it isn't offered, but doc flex is and you know several players do have it then choose Docflex as your research, then trade an AI for it.

Hit Ctrl-R to bring up research and a new set of researchable techs should be available. In fact even if you couldn't trade doc flex, but got something else you can still hit ctrl-R and a new set of researchable techs will be shown, but you lose 50% of your research points.

Scipio Centaurus · February 21, 2001, 02:46

quote:

Originally posted by Blake on 02-20-2001 11:18 PM
...Hit Ctrl-R to bring up research and a new set of researchable techs should be available. In fact even if you couldn't trade doc flex, but got something else you can still hit ctrl-R and a new set of researchable techs will be shown, but you lose 50% of your research points.

Thanks. I tried the above - might have been Shift+R instead of Ctrl+R - but it didn't let me see new techs till AFTER I had paid the 50% penalty and... you guessed it... the exact same techs were made available as the first time I picked.

...sounds like trading for techs might have to be the way to go. So much for 'directed' research, eh?

Chowlett · February 21, 2001, 08:31

IIRC, there was a discussion which came to some conclusion as to what was and wasn't available at any given time. Give us a minute..

Chowlett · February 21, 2001, 08:35

Found it - thread titled "Q about how game chooses Blind Research".

karu-san · February 21, 2001, 09:15

Scipio,

Just thought I'd add a little pointer regarding:

quote:

Originally posted by Scipio Centaurus on 02-21-2001 01:46 AM
Thanks. I tried the above - might have been Shift+R instead of Ctrl+R - but it didn't let me see new techs till AFTER I had paid the 50% penalty and... you guessed it... the exact same techs were made available as the first time I picked.

...sounds like trading for techs might have to be the way to go. So much for 'directed' research, eh?

Yes, you are warned that if you change research goals you will lose 50% tech already researched *before* you can actually select a new tech

BUT

if you tell the computer you still want to change techs (and risk the 50% loss) and then actually select the SAME tech that you had selected before (resulting in no actual change) you WILL NOT lose 50% tech. Try it and see!

Scipio Centaurus · February 21, 2001, 14:02

quote:

Originally posted by Chowlett on 02-21-2001 07:35 AM
Found it - thread titled "Q about how game chooses Blind Research".

Thanks. I skimmed through it. I'll read it in more detail after work.

Scipio Centaurus · February 21, 2001, 14:07

quote:

Originally posted by karu-san on 02-21-2001 08:15 AM
Scipio,
...if you tell the computer you still want to change techs (and risk the 50% loss) and then actually select the SAME tech that you had selected before (resulting in no actual change) you WILL NOT lose 50% tech. Try it and see!

OK. I'll test that out and see what happens. Only thing is if the game will *defintely* always show the same techs when doing this, there's not much point...

Fitz · February 21, 2001, 14:59

It should only show the same techs if you haven't recieved a new one. You missed a point in the conversation I think. Trade for ANY tech first, then hit Shift-R. Then it may be worth the loss of 50%, with new selections available. If you still don't see the one you want, select the same tech your researching, then go trade for ANOTHER new tech, and repeat.

Scipio Centaurus · February 21, 2001, 16:20

quote:

Originally posted by Fitz on 02-21-2001 01:59 PM
It should only show the same techs if you haven't recieved a new one. You missed a point in the conversation I think. Trade for ANY tech first, then hit Shift-R. Then it may be worth the loss of 50%, with new selections available. If you still don't see the one you want, select the same tech your researching, then go trade for ANOTHER new tech, and repeat.

You're right, I didn't catch that before. Now I can see where this might be useful after you've had a chance to pick up a few techs. I still think Firaxis could have done a better job with directed research.

RedFred · February 21, 2001, 18:17

Directed research? Bah! Play double blind, it is more fun.

mark13 · February 21, 2001, 18:23

BTW, Scipio - if it doesn't come up the second time, check you have all the prerequisites - the number of times I have been looking for a tech without all the prerequisites are too numerous to mention....and I have never seen it fail to come up twice....

For my own experience on this, I have found it, to my eye at least, to be entirely random. Having said that, I know some sort of formula involving a complex code was devised in civ2, and I would not be surprised in the least to see this carried over to SMAC.
[This message has been edited by mark13 (edited February 21, 2001).]

Scipio Centaurus · February 21, 2001, 20:49

quote:

Originally posted by RedFred on 02-21-2001 05:17 PM
Directed research? Bah! Play double blind, it is more fun.

I normally do play blind research in solo play. What's double-blind? Not selecting any particular area of emphasis?

big_canuk · February 21, 2001, 22:51

Selecting all four areas

Scipio Centaurus · February 22, 2001, 00:44

quote:

Originally posted by mark13 on 02-21-2001 05:23 PM
BTW, Scipio - if it doesn't come up the second time, check you have all the prerequisites - the number of times I have been looking for a tech without all the prerequisites are too numerous to mention....and I have never seen it fail to come up twice....

In this case the desired tech was level 1

cbn · February 22, 2001, 09:38

Scipio

Try to have some fun with it. Sure, even on directed research you do not get every possible choice every time but thats more "realistic" anyway. Imagine a bunch of scientists scrambling around knowing that you want biogenetics but being unable to offer it to you. IIRC the same issue arose in CIV2 when people had to research a non-beeline tech on the road to monarchy

But I'm with RedFred on this one. Once I went to double-blind I can't imagine going back in SP. The challenges when you do not know if Industrial Auto will be the next tech or ten more down the road are a heck of a lot of fun.
[This message has been edited by cbn (edited February 22, 2001).]

Scipio Centaurus · February 22, 2001, 12:25

quote:

Originally posted by cbn on 02-22-2001 08:38 AM
Scipio
Try to have some fun with it. Sure, even on directed research you do not get every
possible choice every time but thats more "realistic"

Well that didn't work out to well did it? I'll try a new message

[This message has been edited by Scipio Centaurus (edited February 22, 2001).]

Much better!!! Think I'll quit while I'm ahead of the game. :lol

[This message has been edited by Scipio Centaurus (edited February 22, 2001).]

Scipio Centaurus · February 22, 2001, 12:45

quote:

Originally posted by cbn on 02-22-2001 08:38 AM
Scipio

Try to have some fun with it. Sure, even on directed research you do not get every possible choice every time but thats more "realistic" anyway...
[This message has been edited by cbn (edited February 22, 2001).]

You don't happen to work for Firaxis do you? :lol

[cbn]...Imagine a bunch of scientists scrambling around knowing that you want biogenetics but being unable to offer it to you...

[SC] Problem is, that statement applies equally well to directed, blind and double-blind research.

- Scipio

cbn · February 23, 2001, 01:43

Me with Firifax ?? LOL -- -- maybe then I would be in a position to get a patch for those annoying bugs.-- I have barely enough computer ability to keep my games running and surf the net from up here in eastern Canada.

My comment was merely that directed research in Smac is similar to in CIV2. In both games you do not get every option every time.

As others have pointed out , in directed you will not be denied the desired tech choice time after time. If I read their posts right it seems you will be denied a tech choice once and then it appears next time round (assuming prereqs are in place). Since it is rare that there are not 2 or more tech choices that would be helpful its never been a huge problem.(unless you are trying for a transcend record or something)

You also have to understand that I am a player who loves the wrinkles that double blind brings in conjunction with random factions. (i.e. Miriam alone and no way to build a boat and find anyone and Doc: flex refuses to come up). I think it is a much better game when there is some variability and uncertainty to the game. Just my opinion. . . .

I acknowledge that directed research does not give you complete control over what will be researched but I see this as a game feature and not necessarily a flaw. Blind and double-blind respectively then further reduce the players ability to control the research flow. Each is very different.