City-Planner Poll on Cordoba

cavebear · February 14, 2003, 19:11

Cordoba is rather unhappy, and we want to cheer them up. What should we build/do for them?

Some of it is due to ships away from port. Some of it may be due to "normal" reasons. Should it be a Bank for more gold, a Collosseum for entertainment, Superhighways for more trade, or something else?

SCG · February 14, 2003, 19:52

we need to increase the number of happy people for our cruiser (circled in black below) to be able to leave port. The only way to get 4 people happy right now is to remove the workers from the mines (which drops production below 15). building a colosseum will do nothing to increase the number of happy people. see image below where the temple and Mike's are showing (row 3). The 3 unhappy people are a result of ships abroad (yes, there are only 2 showing under support, but we do have 2 destroyers and a cruiser at sea. That accounts for the 3 unhappy shield circled in yellow (row 4). Those are being counteracted by the 3 happy people also circled in yellow (row 4). We need enough luxuries to get the row 2 citizen (circled in white) to be happy. For that we need at least 16 luxuries (or 15 with the black unhappy seen in row 1). As you can see from cavebear's picture, the elvis only gives us 13 luxuries vs 12 with the elvis placed on a trade space (plains). A bank would increase luxuries to use the plains with the cruiser at sea. Superhighways give enough extra trade for the marketplace to increase luxuries to 15 and still use the mines (something i know cavebear wants to do

)

If we deliver the oil freight - we might be able to get the luxuries high enough to use the mines, or we might not - we would be risking going into disorder if the double unhappy citizen gets redistributed to another city with a bank. The only sure way to be able to use the 2nd mines and have the cruiser at sea and not be risking disorder before we grow is to build the superhighways and deliver the oil freight.

cavebear · February 14, 2003, 21:40

I am in awe of SCG's understanding of the happiness graphic! I knew that the 4th row represented the summary of happiness/unhappiness factors and was the cause of the Worker graphic we see on the main city-screen. I knew the 1st row was the actual happiness factors before adjustments from Temples, Wonders, etc.

I had *not* realized that the 3rd row represented the happiness values after Wonders were factored in. And I still don't "perfectly" understand row 2, though I am getting some idea of it.

A masterly description of the happiness screen, SCG! I, and I am sure, many others, learned some very useful things today!

SCG · February 14, 2003, 22:23

normally, row 3 doesn't include wonders - Mike's is an exception as it only represents a cathedral, which does normally show in row 3. If we build CfC or capture Bach's - you'll see it listed in row 4.

As for row 2, each 2 luxuries promote 1 citizen one level of happiness (unhappy->content->happy). Normally it takes 2 luxuries for the first content, 4 lux for the first happy, 6 for 2nd content, 8 for 2nd happy etc. For some reason with double-unhappy, it only takes 1 luxury to get the first citizen content, and then procedes normally after that. Applying to Cordoba with the double-unhappy, that means only 15 luxuries needed for 4 happy (and enough happy to get the cruiser out of port without causing disorder). What i haven't really figured out is how the game decides to distribute the double-unhappy citizens once we get that many cities, which is why i suggest getting to the 16 luxuries

mrboo123 · February 15, 2003, 09:24

I know, how about Cure for Cancer! Since we have the tech. least not waste extra WoW now.

Six Thousand Year Old Man · February 15, 2003, 10:34

I favour CfC. We have lots of food Freights, as far as I can tell. CfC'll give us the option to either grow our cities with celebrations, or turn down luxuries a bit in favour of tax or science

Based on the benefits CfC would give us, 12 Freights is cheap.

SCG · February 15, 2003, 11:03

Quote:

Originally posted by Six Thousand Year Old Man
I favour CfC. We have lots of food Freights, as far as I can tell. CfC'll give us the option to either grow our cities with celebrations, or turn down luxuries a bit in favour of tax or science

Based on the benefits CfC would give us, 12 Freights is cheap.

using CfC as a catylist for WLTxDs is much more feasible. As it, even with CfC, cordoba would prevent lowering the lux rate without rehoming of navy or building superhighways - we just can't get enough happy people there to counteract the peace activists there wanting to disband our navy (I doubt even our former prez Hydey could console all of the lonely sailor's wives when they have those chips on their shoulders

)

Six Thousand Year Old Man · February 15, 2003, 11:38

This might sound crazy, but why not disband 2 of the destroyers and use the shields to help make a cruiser (or in a couple of turns, an AEGIS cruiser) or better still, a battleship?

I'm sure a BB would be more useful than a couple of mangy destroyers (until the AI gets Rocketry)... and despite having a larger crew than 2 DDs, a battleship will only make half as many people unhappy as 2 DDs would.

SCG · February 15, 2003, 12:12

I personally would like to see more cruisers and AGEIS cruisers as escorts - a vet transport actually has better defense than a green destroyer, and we've lost several destroyers in battle. Given that BBs are slower than transports and are AI missile magnets, BBs are probably better for patrols rather than escorts, since we might not get one built before the AI can build cruise missiles. for that matter, our destroyers are probably better suited for patrols as well now, due to their greater movement but small defense.

For logistics, the 2 cordoba destroyers are 3 and 4 turns from cordoba, both closest to Cartenna domestically. As cavebear has mentioned a few times - planning several turns in advance is easier said than done. The other problem is getting the new ships commisioned in a timely manner... But if we can do it, I'd be in favor of it

Six Thousand Year Old Man · February 15, 2003, 12:31

SCG - IDHTSFIFOM, but are any of the AI's close to Rocketry? If not, all we have to worry about is Submarines, if we build Battleships.

If we're escorting Transports, Cruisers/AEGIS are ideal, just because the movement rate matches.

If those Destroyers are closer to other cities, let's rehome them!

I prefer Fighters for patrolling over Destroyers - less unhappiness, no risk of losing them on the AI's turn, and similar offensive stats.

Six Thousand Year Old Man · February 15, 2003, 12:49

How about a Courthouse, then? Quick and dirty... 1 more happy person.

SCG · February 15, 2003, 13:03

I don't think any AI are close to it, but if we are close to it, then the AI could steal it - a city like Cartenna would be a prime city to steal it from.

As for rehoming the destroyers - i offered that as a suggestion last turn as well, of course cartenna needs a lot of help before it can start supporting destroyers.

Fighters are good - i was just offering it as a possibility for units we do have rather than units we don't have, given the lack of rush or incremental buying this game, especially in non-cabinet meeting years.

And yes, a courthouse would work too, forgot about that one

No extra side benefits like extra science though

Ben Kenobi · February 15, 2003, 13:17

Well I do favour the CfC wonder, this will help maintain our navy.

Another option would be to rehome one of the offending cruisers to redistribute the discontent.

Scrapping a destroyer is also feasible since we will have AEGIS cruisers, but this is only a temporary solution.

STYOM - if we are building courthouses, we might as well build CfC, it's the same benefit under Democracy.

Peace activists. Why can't they leave the troublemaking in our churches?

cavebear · February 16, 2003, 15:34

The Cordoba Cruiser could get to Malaga and rehome in 1 turn. Just a thought.

I favor building CfC. One additional happy citizen in each city would have great benefits. Aside from the additional city-workers

it would relieve the accumulating unhappiness in some places and generally make our civ more productive. And using up some of those idling Freights should cause some of the cities to offer up newer and more demanded goods.

cavebear · February 16, 2003, 15:36

And I was torn between Bank and Superhighways, but have finally voted for Superhighways. Let the trade roll in.

Six Thousand Year Old Man · February 16, 2003, 17:32

Quote:

Originally posted by obiwan18

STYOM - if we are building courthouses, we might as well build CfC, it's the same benefit under Democracy.

Well... 1 courthouse anyway. I wasn't advocating them in all cities, just Cordoba. 1 courthouse is a lot cheaper than CfC.

I'd like CfC as well, but if we can't have it, we might as well fix Cordoba on its own.

SCG · February 16, 2003, 17:41

Quote:

Originally posted by Six Thousand Year Old Man
I'd like CfC as well, but if we can't have it, we might as well fix Cordoba on its own.

We haven't had a designated place for it yet, but as i pointed out in my Preliminary 1880 Freight Delivery report we can build it now and still have 7 food freights left, with more being built each turn in CAPITOL till we get one of its current freights delivered. Also, we are not limited by city location either if we keep our ferry system intact. My preference would by Hydeyville if we wait a turn, otherwise Cordoba wouldn't be a bad choice either - net effect on celebrations would be similar - most cities won't celebrate till next turn.

Edit: fix the # of food freights

SCG · February 16, 2003, 17:49

slight adjustment as a realize CfC is 12 freight not 8. Since we have a minimal ferry structure right now, we can deliver 12 to a city like Rabbitton or Port Easton next turn, but only 8 to Hydeyville (we have idle food freight already in Obladi and Avila)

cavebear · February 17, 2003, 12:51

We seem to have plenty of Freight around Seville (at least 18). THat's 32 active and 7 in production. Why not just build CfC in Seville (nice protected location) and use 12 of them?

The civ-wide benefits would be immediate and should allow us to replenish Freight quickly. We've got 8 more Freight on the immediate or next schedule...

cavebear · February 17, 2003, 12:53

Only 7 voters in 2 1/2 days?