9th Turn Chat (From Turn 72 in the year 2560BC)

Martin Gühmann · February 20, 2003, 17:02

Welcome to the 9th (if I counted correctly) turn chat of our Great Nation Lemuria:

Day: 21/02/03 (Friday)
Hour: 21:30 GMT

Place:
Lemuria Channel in the Apolyton Chat-Room.

Friday is the suggestion by MrBaggins, and actual I don't see any need for further delay here, too as I think the important stuff is already said.

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Questions to the member of government in order to collect the necessary orders:

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Questions to the President (Martin Gühmann):

Q1: How will you name our cities?
A1: Same answer as Pedrunn gave for the last turn chat:

"--> In case of a conquer of Graz keep its name. But if we creat[e] one new city call i[t] Wombatoon. If we create two (not very probably) call[..] the second J land."
As I diecided to respect and accept the decisions made in the last term, these two city names are still on the list.

Q2: Will we change the PW rate?
A2: No, as we have nothing else to build except farms and we need all the production for new units.

Q3: Will we change the slider settings?
A3: Just in case of riots in one of our cities which would probably continue in the next turn. In that case more food is given to the people to stop the riots.

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Questions to the Minister of Domestic Affairs (MrBaggins):

Q4: What will the next three items for the build queues of all of our cities?

Pedrunnia
Colonia Locuta
H Town
mapfipolis
Pressburg

I think we should use the build queue feature in order to reduce the workload. We can modify the build queues later if necessary, anyway.

A4: See resposne of MoDA below this post.

Q5: Will we change the specialist distribution in any city? If yes in which city and how?
A5: The only circumstance that we shall employ the specialists that we currently have available (farmers) would be to grow a size 1 city to size 2. Since I don't forsee us having any size 1 cities, given current plans, I see no need to touch work assignments.

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Questions to the Minister of Infrastruture (ískallin):

No questions yet, as we don't have enough to spend on any tile improvements right no or later.

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Questions to the Minister of Diplomacy, Trade and Science (Locutus):

Q6: What will be our attitude towards these civilisations, if we send them a proposal?

a) Austria
b) Scottland
c) Germany
d) Thailand
e) India

A6: ???

Q7: To which of these civilisations mentioned above we should send a prposal, if any?
A7: ??? Suggestion by the President: Trial of map exchange with India.

Q17: What will we research after Drama?
A17: ??? Note by the President: I think we can also poll this after the turnchat if necessary, as far as I know the science isn't lost if we switch our science goal, so that it is possible to go for a temporary advance first.

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Questions to the Minister of Defense (Pedrunn):

Q8: What is the destination of our armies in field? Of course not only for the next turn, but for the next turns.

Q9: What is the distination of our armies in the West? Will we use MrBaggins' plane and if yes, unmodified or modified.
A8/A9:Pretty much the plan of mrbagggins just some minor changes.
Turn 1-3: Once we have twelve in H Town units together group them an calling it 'LemuForce' leaving a Hoplite and a Archer as H Town Defenders. And move it west in case no enemy unit at north appears otherwise it will need to discussed some possible attack to it. At the east wait to join other two warriors together with the Lemuforce reaching a size 12 army.
If a unit is blocking the passage of the LemuForces East and has size 1 attack. Stand still and if the victory is clear send a attack of the Lemuforce to destroy it. Other wise keep it out of trouble coming back to Pedrunnia in case of a chase! Once the threat is eliminate join the Lemuforce East together with the Lemuforce. Sending it to the SW tile of H Town.
Turn 3+ - See A13

Q10: How we deal with the Barbrian threat in front of mapfipolis?
A10:
Turn 1 - Get 1 archer and 2 hoplites from the mapfipolis Defenders and send to attack to the barbarian catapult at east.
Turn 2 - Send those units back to mapfipolis and fortify
Turn 3 - Keep it fortified.

Q11: Will we use the wounded Warrior in the West to explore the Northern mountain site? Or should it return to one of our cities, of course save?
A11:
Turn 1 - Send the Lonely Warriors North.
Turn 2-3 - Keep the size 4 austrian army in its sight. But always having a distance of at least two tiles from other s enemy armies.
If a sight cant be managed stand still. In cas the army chase this unit send it close to H Town where we are going to create a major attak force.
Turn 4 - In case the size 4 austrian army has an unknown position and the lonely warriors cant look for it send it to the nearest city/army to be healed. Or more at north to be explore. It will depend of the outcome of the battles and our situation.

Q12: Will we use one unit as scout in order to explore the Southern unexplored territory?
A12:
- Not until we conquer Graz! After that we may consider one but only if the cities are very well protected, Graz attack was a sucess and the barbarian/other civs threats are not that threatening specially for the exploring unit and the cities. So really not possible to decide now. But i wont unconsider that.

Q13: How we deal with Austrian size 4 stack should we try to attack it first or should we take Graz first?
A13: Once we have finish all orders of A8 and A-9. And Lemuforce is in the West (or SW) tile of H Town
Continue this plan.
Send a warrior from Pedrunnia Defenders in a suicidal attack to Graz. We need to know what is inside it!
Time to conquer Graz. Our army must move South and then SW along the part of the river most at west.
The next move of the Lemuforce must be to the forest at North of Graz and must happen right after the move of the suicidal warrior from Pedrunnia Defenders to Graz. Dont send the suicidal warrior through the river like mrbaggins plan but through the path given by the game engine (NW, NW, E, E, E, E).
If for any reason the Suicidal warrior dont arrives at the sam time the Lemuforce does to Graz (They have been coodinate to have the same timing) the Lemuforce can move SW, NW instead of going to the forest right away for exploring reasons. In case the suicidal warrior arrives first keep two tiles away from Graz and only send it in case the Lemufirce moves at the same turn to the forest.
Attack Graz if the number of units is not enough to defeat us (Probably >=8). If not go after the enemy armies at the field.
Once conquered keep the units fortified and healing in Graz.
Once conquered at least 7 units must keep fortified in Graz to protect from possible Austrians attack. If the people in the chat concurs other units can have other destinations.
This plan can only be aborted if our cities a being very threatened by the field enemies.

Q14: Will you name our armies? If yes how, and which army?
A14: First of all lats name all the armies:

Lonely Warriors - wounded warrior that is far away from our city at west.
There is no need to name the armies below those are just for the understanding of the plan.
LemurForce west - 5 units west of H Town.
LemurForce east - 2 units east of H Town near Pedrunn.
LemurForce north - 2 units north of H Town near Wels.
Pedrunnia Defenders - grouped units at Pedrunnia.
Mapfipolis Defenders - grouped units at Mapfipolis.
Locuta Defenders - grouped units at Colonia Locuta.
H Defensers - grouped units at H Town.
Pressburg Defenders - grouped units at Pressburg.

I guess that means all the defenders in our cities should be grouped, they are currently not grouped.

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Questions to All Citizens:

Q15: Who wants to help me with the screenshots and game info? (Needs to be someone with CTP2 and some basic knowlegde and resources to graphic editing.)
A15: ???

Q16: Is there anything I forgot to ask for here?
A16: ???

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Please, if you are a minister confirm your presence or your absence!

Confirmed ministers (or delegates)
Martin Gühmann - President
Pedrunn - Minister of Defense
MrBaggins - Minister of Domestic Affairs
ískallin - Minister of Infrastrutucture
Locutus - Minister of Diplomacy
??? - Graphic manager (screenshot helper)

-Martin

MrBaggins · February 20, 2003, 18:08

MoDA response:

Planned city production
===

Pressburg currently building: Archer (2)

Add to end of current build queue:
Hoplite (may consider rushing)
Archer
Hoplite

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H-Town currently building: Hoplite (3)

Replace with build queue:
Archer (will consider rushing)
Hoplite (may consider rushing)
Archer
Hoplite

---

Pedrunnia currently building: Archer (2)

Add to end of current build queue:

Archer
Archer
Archer

---

Colonia Locuta currently building: Archer(1)

Add to end of current build queue:

Hoplite
Hoplite
Hoplite

---

Mapfipolis currently building: Hoplite(4)

Add to end of current build queue:

Archer
Hoplite
Archer

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City Specialists
===

The only circumstance that we shall employ the specialists that we currently have available (farmers) would be to grow a size 1 city to size 2. Since I don't forsee us having any size 1 cities, given current plans, I see no need to touch work assignments.

Should we get Drama, and hence entertainers, they will be used where necessary to keep happiness above riot level.

MrBaggins

Martin Gühmann · February 20, 2003, 18:25

So far looks good MrBaggins.

Quote:

Originally posted by MrBaggins
Should we get Drama, and hence entertainers, they will be used where necessary to keep happiness above riot level.

MrBaggins

Well that is a good question. I will add it to the question list. Fortunatly we have the poll about the alternative advance if we couldn't research Jurisprudence. So I can at least put it temporary into the research list, fortunatly as far as I know the science isn't lost if we switch.

-Martin

MrBaggins · February 20, 2003, 19:16

Here is a concept to streamline things:

As MoDA, most expenditure will be based on things that I'm looking to rush build. As such, each and every desicion has to go through the president, which means, from experience... some amount of debate.

If we want to streamline the game a bit... then the President could set aside a discretionary MoDA fund, which could be used as the MoDA chose. Thus the small stuff doesn't get argued... most "discussion" involves people enquiring about how much the cost to rush is and how much we have in the treasury. I could include this info, in the ORDER.

Additional or ongoing contribution to the fund would be, of course, at the Presidents discretion.

MrBaggins

Pedrunn · February 20, 2003, 20:35

A14
First of all lats name all the armies:
Lonely Warriors - wounded warrior that is far away from our city at west.
There is no need to name the armies below those are just for the understanding of the plan.
LemurForce west - 5 units west of H Town.
LemurForce east - 2 units east of H Town near Pedrunn.
LemurForce north - 2 units north of H Town near Wels.
Pedrunnia Defenders - grouped units at Pedrunnia.
Mapfipolis Defenders - grouped units at Mapfipolis.
Locuta Defenders - grouped units at Colonia Locuta.
H Defensers - grouped units at H Town.
Pressburg Defenders - grouped units at Pressburg.

A8-9
Pretty much the plan of mrbagggins just some minor changes.
Turn 1-3: Once we have twelve in H Town units together group them an calling it 'LemuForce' leaving a Hoplite and a Archer as H Town Defenders. And move it west in case no enemy unit at north appears otherwise it will need to discussed some possible attack to it. At the east wait to join other two warriors together with the Lemuforce reaching a size 12 army.
If a unit is blocking the passage of the LemuForces East and has size 1 attack. Stand still and if the victory is clear send a attack of the Lemuforce to destroy it. Other wise keep it out of trouble coming back to Pedrunnia in case of a chase! Once the threat is eliminate join the Lemuforce East together with the Lemuforce. Sending it to the SW tile of H Town.
Turn 3+ - See A13

A10
Turn 1 - Get 1 archer and 2 hoplites from the mapfipolis Defenders and send to attack to the barbarian catapult at east.
Turn 2 - Send those units back to mapfipolis and fortify
Turn 3 - Keep it fortified.

A11
Turn 1 - Send the Lonely Warriors North.
Turn 2-3 - Keep the size 4 austrian army in its sight. But always having a distance of at least two tiles from other s enemy armies.
If a sight cant be managed stand still. In cas the army chase this unit send it close to H Town where we are going to create a major attak force.
Turn 4 - In case the size 4 austrian army has an unknown position and the lonely warriors cant look for it send it to the nearest city/army to be healed. Or more at north to be explore. It will depend of the outcome of the battles and our situation.

A12
- Not until we conquer Graz! After that we may consider one but only if the cities are very well protected, Graz attack was a sucess and the barbarian/other civs threats are not that threatening specially for the exploring unit and the cities. So really not possible to decide now. But i wont unconsider that.

A13
Once we have finish all orders of A8 and A-9. And Lemuforce is in the West (or SW) tile of H Town
Continue this plan.
Send a warrior from Pedrunnia Defenders in a suicidal attack to Graz. We need to know what is inside it!
Time to conquer Graz. Our army must move South and then SW along the part of the river most at west.
The next move of the Lemuforce must be to the forest at North of Graz and must happen right after the move of the suicidal warrior from Pedrunnia Defenders to Graz. Dont send the suicidal warrior through the river like mrbaggins plan but through the path given by the game engine (NW, NW, E, E, E, E).
If for any reason the Suicidal warrior dont arrives at the sam time the Lemuforce does to Graz (They have been coodinate to have the same timing) the Lemuforce can move SW, NW instead of going to the forest right away for exploring reasons. In case the suicidal warrior arrives first keep two tiles away from Graz and only send it in case the Lemufirce moves at the same turn to the forest.
Attack Graz if the number of units is not enough to defeat us (Probably >=8). If not go after the enemy armies at the field.
Once conquered keep the units fortified and healing in Graz.
Once conquered at least 7 units must keep fortified in Graz to protect from possible Austrians attack. If the people in the chat concurs other units can have other destinations.
This plan can only be aborted if our cities a being very threatened by the field enemies.

MrBaggins · February 20, 2003, 21:05

I disagree with a delay of an attack on Graz (barring an absolute emergency)

1) The Austrians are ahead in tech. They can build more advanced troops which will make conquering Graz much tougher
2) Delaying an attack gives them more time to reinforce Graz, and/or build troops or fortification there
3) I believe we can, with prudent rush buying garrison the western towns effectively. We can even, if necessary transfer 1 troop from Pressburg to H-Town: The stack will commit to either Pressburg OR H-Town, they can't do both simultaneously.

The attack from the forest isn't a terrible idea, but whilst we are in inferior tech position, and have superior numbers, speed and mobility are king.

Fortune favors the brave.

Having said this, the best of luck Pedrunn.

MrBaggins

mapfi · February 20, 2003, 21:11

The saying is "Fortune favors the bold", isn't it?

Anyway good work you two! I won't be in the chat, got plans for the weekend now that I'm not pres...

HuangShang · February 20, 2003, 21:21

i wont make it

i agree w/ what MrBaggins

Pedrunn · February 20, 2003, 21:49

Lets discuss the first target issue here

Gilgamensch · February 21, 2003, 06:21

Sorry gent's, want be able to make it.

Although we are starting to get into an interresting phase.......

PLEASE: As much screenies as possible

ískallin · February 21, 2003, 08:11

I'll make it

Pedrunn · February 21, 2003, 09:40

uodate my orders

Due to last time discussion results

Martin Gühmann · February 21, 2003, 11:18

First post updated with your orders. I presume you are both present MrBaggins and Pedrunn.

-Martin

MrBaggins · February 21, 2003, 12:03

As far as I know I am... although I'll need to sync my clock, so I don't miss the start like last time

Pedrunn · February 21, 2003, 14:07

I will probably be there

Turambar · February 21, 2003, 16:04

I can't make it.

Pedrunn · February 21, 2003, 18:25

Barbs

Pedrunn · February 21, 2003, 18:48

Wanted to send a hop from Pedrunnia but we didnt

Locutus · February 21, 2003, 18:54

End of turn 72 (Austrian front)

Locutus · February 21, 2003, 18:55

End of turn (mapfi province)

Pedrunn · February 21, 2003, 19:12

For those who likes battles

Martin Gühmann · February 21, 2003, 19:29

OK, a screenshot for Pedrunn, don't be screwed up my modded Colors00.txt.

Martin Gühmann · February 21, 2003, 19:51

Savegame of turn 75 nothing done, yet. Unzip the *.zip file into your savegamedirectory where you find all your saves of this game.

HuangShang · February 21, 2003, 20:33

is it over, i wish u will tell everyone when its over....

btw, i thought we were going to attack graz...

Pedrunn · February 21, 2003, 20:40

Turn 78

Locutus · February 21, 2003, 21:23

I really need some sleep now and I have to work all day tomorrow. The chat transcript will follow tomorrow evening.

BTW, I originally thought we shouldn't attack Graz (Martin will post screenie of defenders, if we don't crosspost), but after some thinking: we have 2 more units, we should still win. Someone should run a simulation or two in a test game...

Martin Gühmann · February 21, 2003, 21:23

The outcome of our suicide mission:

Pedrunn · February 21, 2003, 21:30

Thank god we sent a suidide mission. And to think that most people voted not to send it.

Locutus · February 21, 2003, 21:34

A thought on Graz to end the night (since I won't be here until tomorrow evening at the earliest): across their 4 Archer + 4 Hoplites we can put 4 Archer and 4 Hoplites. Across their 2 Samurai we can put 2 Archer + 2 Hoplites. If we attack from the forest (thus negating the fortification bonus they have), they only have an advantage in their City Wall. That's not enough to compensate for the disadvantaged situation of 2S vs 2H2A, so we should still win a (narrow) victory.

Edit: Pedrunn, we voted not to send it NOW (which was like 10 turns ago), that's not the same.

Martin Gühmann · February 22, 2003, 13:00

Quote:

Originally posted by Gilgamensch
PLEASE: As much screenies as possible

I knew there is still something missing, but it was too late yesterday, anyway. So let's start:

The world map