February 24, 2003, 12:50
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#1
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Settler
Local Time: 20:17
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 26
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Fast Unit Retreat Question?
What are the deciding factors for a fast unit retreating? I know it has to be against a slower unit but I still lose plenty of horsemen to archers when they look like they could have retreated.
I thought the one exception was when you get both units down to 1HP each but that doesn't seem to be that case.
So... What are the other reasons a faster unit will not retreat on defense OR pull back an failed attack?
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February 24, 2003, 12:59
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#2
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Deity
Local Time: 22:17
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Republic of Flanders
Posts: 10,747
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the better "trained" they are, the more chance they've got.
conscrpit 22%
regular 35%
veteran 50%
elite 66%
* numbers aren't correct, just an indicator. You can find the correct ones in the editor  *
btw: it's not slower unit, only against units with a one point movement.
So cavalry will not retreat from horsemen/tanks etc...
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February 24, 2003, 13:07
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#3
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Emperor
Local Time: 13:17
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Location: Canada
Posts: 5,755
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Just luck of the draw, and the combat level of the unit. There's a certain percentage that you'll find in the editor under the Combat Experience tab. A Conscript has a 34% chance of retreating, whereas an Elite has a 66% chance.
Oh yes, I'm not entirely positive, but it looks like if there's a unit directly behind the fast unit, then it can't retreat.
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February 25, 2003, 01:27
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#4
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King
Local Time: 20:17
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Adelaide, South Australia, Australia
Posts: 1,451
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Hmmm, now I just wish that Firaxis would allow units to be able to retreat if their movement rate is 1 or more greater than the unit than they are attacking  .
Oh well, guess we can always live in hope!!
Yours,
The_Aussie_Lurker.
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February 25, 2003, 01:40
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#5
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Deity
Local Time: 14:17
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Join Date: Jan 2003
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Hmmm
I've always found that my units retreat when they still have a unit of movement left, and usually die when they don't.
Guess this is coincidence
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Secretary General of the U.N. & IV Emperor of the Glory of War PTWDG | VIII Consul of Apolyton PTW ISDG | GoWman in Stormia CIVDG | Lurker Troll Extraordinaire C3C ISDG Final | V Gran Huevote Team Latin Lover | Webmaster Master Zen Online | CivELO (3°)
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February 25, 2003, 01:58
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#6
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King
Local Time: 20:17
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Adelaide, South Australia, Australia
Posts: 1,451
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No Coincidence. If I understand correctly, you HAVE to have 1mp left in order to retreat.
The_Aussie_Lurker.
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February 25, 2003, 06:37
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#7
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Emperor
Local Time: 15:17
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Flyover Country
Posts: 4,659
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Quote:
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Originally posted by Master Zen
Hmmm
I've always found that my units retreat when they still have a unit of movement left, and usually die when they don't.
Guess this is coincidence
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Your units only retreat or die?
Who are you playing? France?
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"We have tried spending money. We are spending more than we have ever spent before and it does not work...After eight years of this Administration, we have just as much unemployment as when we started... And an enormous debt to boot!" — Henry Morgenthau, Franklin Delano Roosevelt's Treasury secretary, 1941.
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February 25, 2003, 06:41
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#8
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King
Local Time: 23:17
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: the contradiction is filled with holes...
Posts: 1,398
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Haha... no chanses of winning. A good one
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I'm not a complete idiot: some parts are still missing.
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February 25, 2003, 11:25
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#9
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King
Local Time: 13:17
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Join Date: May 2002
Location: California - SF Bay Area
Posts: 2,120
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No movement points remaining needed in order to retreat -- a 3-move cavalry can move 2 tiles into enemy territory, attack, and still retreat. If the defender has only 1 HP left, the unit won't retreat. If the defender is also a fast-mover (more than 1 mp) the attacker won't retreat -- just needs to be fast-mover, does not need to be "as fast" as the attacker -- i.e., a cavalry won't retreat from a tank. If the above "base conditions" are met, a die roll (and the chances listed above depending on training level of the unit) will determine whether it retreats or not.
Catt
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February 25, 2003, 12:21
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#10
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Deity
Local Time: 22:17
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Sep 2001
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One more point, when defending, fast units DO NOT retreat when fortified!!! Or are down to their last HP as pointed out by Catt
__________________
#There’s a city in my mind
Come along and take that ride
And it’s all right, baby, it’s all right #
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February 25, 2003, 12:43
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#11
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Deity
Local Time: 14:17
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: of naughty
Posts: 10,579
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Quote:
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Originally posted by The Mad Monk
Your units only retreat or die?
Who are you playing? France?
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 actually in my latest game YES! Do you think that has something to do with it??
I was just exaggerating, they do win more often than not, its just that my retreat % seems to be much higher than what the editor says.
__________________
A true ally stabs you in the front.
Secretary General of the U.N. & IV Emperor of the Glory of War PTWDG | VIII Consul of Apolyton PTW ISDG | GoWman in Stormia CIVDG | Lurker Troll Extraordinaire C3C ISDG Final | V Gran Huevote Team Latin Lover | Webmaster Master Zen Online | CivELO (3°)
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February 25, 2003, 13:15
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#12
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Official Civilization IV Strategy Guide Co-Author
Local Time: 15:17
Local Date: November 1, 2010
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Posts: 1,516
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Quote:
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Originally posted by alva
One more point, when defending, fast units DO NOT retreat when fortified!!! Or are down to their last HP as pointed out by Catt
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Are you certain about fortification preventing retreat? I seem to recall my mountain-entrenched Impis scooting away when things went bad.... I, too, have noticed that units DO seem to retreat more often when they have movement left that turn; quite a bit more often, in fact. We've also heard that enough to suggest there might be something there...
I'm know enough math to do it, but I don't have the time, nor do I have the patience for the testing that would need to be done. Someone want to step up for the good of Knowledge and run 50 or so tests on each variable?
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February 25, 2003, 13:36
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#13
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King
Local Time: 13:17
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: May 2002
Location: California - SF Bay Area
Posts: 2,120
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Quote:
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Originally posted by Fried-Psitalon
I, too, have noticed that units DO seem to retreat more often when they have movement left that turn; quite a bit more often, in fact. We've also heard that enough to suggest there might be something there...
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Someone did a test under vanilla civ v1.29 (IIRC) over at CFC that showed pretty clearly that whether or not a a movement point was available, a fast unit would retreat in accordance with the expected percentages. IIRC, they modified an MI to have a huge defense, and then sent cavalry on the attack from both two tiles and one tile away -- the retreat frequency was statistically the same.
Catt
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February 25, 2003, 18:59
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#14
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Emperor
Local Time: 15:17
Local Date: November 1, 2010
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: The Occupied South
Posts: 4,729
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Quote:
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Originally posted by Catt
Someone did a test under vanilla civ v1.29 (IIRC) over at CFC that showed pretty clearly that whether or not a a movement point was available, a fast unit would retreat in accordance with the expected percentages. IIRC, they modified an MI to have a huge defense, and then sent cavalry on the attack from both two tiles and one tile away -- the retreat frequency was statistically the same.
Catt
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Catt, I don't recall it happenning as often in 1.29 as it does in PTW1.14. It does seem to happen more now.
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