Always losing money? Help.

Demosthenes1234 · March 6, 2003, 04:17

Hey I only just started playing the game and even though I don't understand it Im sorta addicted. Anyhow, one thing that is annoying is that my income is always fluctuating. One turn it could be +100 the next turn it could be -5? Furthermore whenever I go to war this loss of money becomes more dramatic. What am I doing wrong? Anyone...plz help?
-Demos

vmxa1 · March 6, 2003, 04:24

It is hard to say. Many factors could be in play. The taxes, the maint, the types of DEA's you have and the regions they are in and on and on.
Post a save and maybe some one can take a look.

Harry Seldon · March 6, 2003, 18:34

Maker sure you're overproducing something, like food or minerals. This will help make some extra cash. Also make sure your economy option is set to balanced. Try to set up trade with other empires but remember you're going to lose money at first so be careful about starting too many at once. Also, make sure the planetary side of development is being cared for. If you go into battle and crank the planetary dev and economic development side down to cover ship building, you're not going to be making the DEA improvements and bonus buildings that will help your expanding empire flourish.

CharlesBHoff · March 8, 2003, 04:35

May-be you should think of raiseing the Empire and system taxes and lower the planetary taxes.

I donot buy that myst that too many people have that low
tax are automatic better than hight tax. It depend on are you in a full scale war then highter taxs will help you. In WW2 the top tax rate for the wealtly america was 92 % with
very few decution to lower your income. Low tax do mean alway than better ecomoncy. All government need money to run. I can have 0 % taxs but I will run the printing press to print more money to run the government.

vmxa1 · March 8, 2003, 16:10

Quote:

Originally posted by CharlesBHoff
May-be you should think of raiseing the Empire and system taxes and lower the planetary taxes.

I donot buy that myst that too many people have that low
tax are automatic better than hight tax. It depend on are you in a full scale war then highter taxs will help you. In WW2 the top tax rate for the wealtly america was 92 % with
very few decution to lower your income. Low tax do mean alway than better ecomoncy. All government need money to run. I can have 0 % taxs but I will run the printing press to print more money to run the government.

What the heck are you talking about?
This is a game and high taxes in the game can lead to unrest, simple as that. You need to balance that with the need to pay the bills.
Governments waste money in real life, all of them. The ones that run the printing presses went out of business, look at all of the ones in South America that tried that.
Just for the record, WWII USA had shortage on almost everything.

CharlesBHoff · March 8, 2003, 16:38

Quote:

Originally posted by vmxa1

What the heck are you talking about?
This is a game and high taxes in the game can lead to unrest, simple as that. You need to balance that with the need to pay the bills.
Governments waste money in real life, all of them. The ones that run the printing presses went out of business, look at all of the ones in South America that tried that.
Just for the record, WWII USA had shortage on almost everything.

Sorry I once worked for IRS an I read than history on the income tax that state that taxes where that hight. !/3 of the cost of WW2 came from highter taxes, 1/3 from borrow the money from the public and the other 1/3 from running the printing press. All government that where in life and death fight run the printing press to get the money their need. When in the second century when the Roman Empire was fighting bloodly cival war and invasion from the germany tribes they debase their coinage by putting less silver and gold in then. The secrect to raiseing tax in MOO3 is to also change your war footing to either limit or total or holy war setting

vmxa1 · March 8, 2003, 21:39

Let me say I was not addressing the tax rate you quoted, but for the record it was 38% for 1946 for individuals making 100,000.
I am not familar with all governments, but all the ones I am aware of in the last 40 years that tried to print money all had their governments collapse. This has occurred all over Latin America and Euorpe. The US did not go on a printing binge ala Post world war I Germany or even Brazil. It borrowed money and since its credit was good, it managed to not hyper inflate. We were not in a fight for our life in WWII/ France was and it collapsed. Germany was and it collasped as did Japan. We proped them up after the war and they got back on their feet, but with new governments. This is in no small way why Italy has averaged a new leader every two years since the war.
As far as I can tell in Moo3 your war footing has only to do with the tolerance your people have with how you spend your money, not how much you raise. go to peace and prosperity and start building lots of ships and you will have unrest, you will have to loer the taxes or change to a more warlike setting.

CharlesBHoff · March 8, 2003, 22:08

Quote:

Originally posted by vmxa1
Let me say I was not addressing the tax rate you quoted, but for the record it was 38% for 1946 for individuals making 100,000.
I am not familar with all governments, but all the ones I am aware of in the last 40 years that tried to print money all had their governments collapse. This has occurred all over Latin America and Euorpe. The US did not go on a printing binge ala Post world war I Germany or even Brazil. It borrowed money and since its credit was good, it managed to not hyper inflate. We were not in a fight for our life in WWII/ France was and it collapsed. Germany was and it collasped as did Japan. We proped them up after the war and they got back on their feet, but with new governments. This is in no small way why Italy has averaged a new leader every two years since the war.
As far as I can tell in Moo3 your war footing has only to do with the tolerance your people have with how you spend your money, not how much you raise. go to peace and prosperity and start building lots of ships and you will have unrest, you will have to loer the taxes or change to a more warlike setting.

The tax rate when I worked for IRS was 70 % on simple person make 100,000 dollar plus and 70 % on couple or head of household makeing 200,000 plus dollar. Germany
after WW I was force to pay unreasonable paymernt to England and France so Germany print all that money to make those payment. Marten Freeman in his book Money
said there are time when government must raise taxs to pay they bill Freeman is than low tax person who believe in low tax, but he also regocinte there time when tax must go up also. All 50 states in America are going to rise
taxs as their must balance the budget and they cannot cut anymore programs from their budget anymore.

CharlesBHoff · March 8, 2003, 22:14

Far footing allow you to raise taxes to pay the increase cost of fighting the war. At the beging of very game I alway rise system and empire tax both by 2 % points. I have now over 5000 AU at less than 40 turns in the games. I start at less than 200 au at turn 1.

vmxa1 · March 9, 2003, 00:11

Quote:

Originally posted by CharlesBHoff
Far footing allow you to raise taxes to pay the increase cost of fighting the war. At the beging of very game I alway rise system and empire tax both by 2 % points. I have now over 5000 AU at less than 40 turns in the games. I start at less than 200 au at turn 1.

I never said you could not raise money by raising taxes. You can get animals to work harder for a time by beating them a bit, but in the long run that will not pay off.
At some point the people will have unrest because of high taxes and you will have to lower it or spend for unrest. If you are in one footing say peace and take action that is counter to peace you get unrest. Your footing is not linearly tied to the tax rate. IOW raising or lower taxes is not inpacted by your footing. What you do with the money is impacting the footing. So if you crank out war ships while in a peaceful footing that causes unrest, regardless of the level of your taxes. Lower the taxes can then reduce the unrest.

CharlesBHoff · March 9, 2003, 03:30

Quote:

Originally posted by vmxa1

I never said you could not raise money by raising taxes. You can get animals to work harder for a time by beating them a bit, but in the long run that will not pay off.
At some point the people will have unrest because of high taxes and you will have to lower it or spend for unrest. If you are in one footing say peace and take action that is counter to peace you get unrest. Your footing is not linearly tied to the tax rate. IOW raising or lower taxes is not inpacted by your footing. What you do with the money is impacting the footing. So if you crank out war ships while in a peaceful footing that causes unrest, regardless of the level of your taxes. Lower the taxes can then reduce the unrest.

When I raise the system and empire taxes I also lower the
planetary tax. Right now my two most delvelp planet paid 14 % planetary tax and the other one I have paid 10 % planetary taxes. That why I disagree with Bush idear on lowing tax even more as I think it is economony unsound to do so right now. I must say that French take care of their people unlike America. Why do we still have not than Drug plan to help older people pay for they drug, there are some older people paiding 1300 dollar a month for drug. We are saying we are the wealth nation that doesnot take care of it own people.

CharlesBHoff · March 9, 2003, 03:39

I have to get rid of than other empire blockade on one of my
planet I built afew warships without any unrest as I only built then few at a time. This empire doesnot show up in the foreign menue yet. You must maintrain than balance. I also have than absolutist govenment for my psilon as than oligarchy.

vmxa1 · March 9, 2003, 05:12

Quote:

Originally posted by CharlesBHoff
That why I disagree with Bush idear on lowing tax even more as I think it is economony unsound to do so right now. I must say that French take care of their people unlike America. Why do we still have not than Drug plan to help older people pay for they drug, there are some older people paiding 1300 dollar a month for drug. We are saying we are the wealth nation that doesnot take care of it own people.

What does this have to do with a game? Why are you bringing it politics to a game board, don't you have friends to talk to about real world events.
You are starting to go off the deep end on me, so I will take a pass. I am willing to talk about game strategy and mechanics, but I play games to forget about real like, I get that all the rest of the time.

Main_Brain · March 9, 2003, 09:53

Do you (with no time limit on Turns) fight Imperial Debt?
I tend to stay on balanced Spendings ands every 50 Turns or so I Take 2 Turns to eliminate the Imperial Debt which has accumulated by then. Nevertheless the Imperial treasury in the main Screen states than am filthy rich?
Why is that Money not Used for Debt reduction?

CharlesBHoff · March 10, 2003, 04:36

Quote:

Originally posted by Main_Brain
Do you (with no time limit on Turns) fight Imperial Debt?
I tend to stay on balanced Spendings ands every 50 Turns or so I Take 2 Turns to eliminate the Imperial Debt which has accumulated by then. Nevertheless the Imperial treasury in the main Screen states than am filthy rich?
Why is that Money not Used for Debt reduction?

Are you playing Single person or MP. I donot change System or empire taxs very turn as long on most turn there is than surplus of than small amount. For over 120 years the postal rate where unchange at 5 cents for first class local next day mail deliver and 10 cents first class mail anywhere in America. Now their raise the postal rate almost every two year or less. For 120 year the postal rate generator than surplus for the Post Office which kept rate from going up and
this was when Congress ran the Postal Office not the Exceture Branck as now. Today they set the postal rate on than break even base, Some busy body person who doesnot believe in the Government generate than small surplus in some of their operateion make than big strink about this.

canamrock · March 10, 2003, 05:45

I find that the best way to run things is to maintain minimal taxes overall, and supplement the loss in productivity with a focus on industry in the early game. It seems to work for me, and honestly, it's rare to need more than a few thousand credits at any stage of the game with a little preparation.

CharlesBHoff · March 10, 2003, 06:28

Quote:

Originally posted by canamrock
I find that the best way to run things is to maintain minimal taxes overall, and supplement the loss in productivity with a focus on industry in the early game. It seems to work for me, and honestly, it's rare to need more than a few thousand credits at any stage of the game with a little preparation.

I raise system and empire taxes by 2 % point and keep the lower planetary taxes possible without unless.

canamrock · March 10, 2003, 07:10

System taxes are only really useful in one of two situations...

1) Rapid development of intra-system colonies, and

2) Focused production of one expensive project on a central production world.

If these are not your situations, just drop the system tax, and the overall economic efficiency is raised quickly. My large despotisms maintain HFoG's well under 2, even when they are of immense populations. Empire taxes are only useful when needing to focus on centralized development, which is more useful than intra-system centralization, as empire-wide, there will be many more opportunities to have this division of labor efforts.

Economic specialization, just one of the beauties of natural economic development.